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	<title>Comments on: Familial Rejection of Gay Teens Can Lead to Mental Health Problems Later</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/</link>
	<description>80beats is DISCOVER&#039;s news aggregator, weaving together the choicest tidbits from the best articles covering the day\&#039;s most compelling topics.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 24 Nov 2009 01:11:34 -0600</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: MikeD</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16666</link>
		<dc:creator>MikeD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 15:03:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16666</guid>
		<description>There isn&#039;t a specific word for a person who is attracted to long legs, or large breasts, a certain hair colour or ethnicity. The fact that there are so many words to describe someone who is attracted to their gender is a clear symptom of destructive prejudice. Having the distinctions of gay, lesbian, bisexual, etc... are not socially helpful for anyone.

From the religious perspective, Jesus was asked what the greatest commandment is, his response was love (in the sense where love is a general respect for humanity). Jesus is supposed to be the embodiment of God, he helped anyone who needed help regardless of their life choices and background. That is not at all consistent with the church of today. Things have improved but we have a long way to go still.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There isn&#8217;t a specific word for a person who is attracted to long legs, or large breasts, a certain hair colour or ethnicity. The fact that there are so many words to describe someone who is attracted to their gender is a clear symptom of destructive prejudice. Having the distinctions of gay, lesbian, bisexual, etc&#8230; are not socially helpful for anyone.</p>
<p>From the religious perspective, Jesus was asked what the greatest commandment is, his response was love (in the sense where love is a general respect for humanity). Jesus is supposed to be the embodiment of God, he helped anyone who needed help regardless of their life choices and background. That is not at all consistent with the church of today. Things have improved but we have a long way to go still.</p>
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		<title>By: Frank</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16645</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 02:11:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16645</guid>
		<description>To Dana C. LaRocca,

Organizations like &quot;Act Up&quot; and &quot;Bash Back&quot; are effective precisely because they teach GLBT youth that they have a right to defend themselves even if they are gay.  The prevailing religious and social environment with its millennia bias against gays does all it can to deny them that right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Dana C. LaRocca,</p>
<p>Organizations like &#8220;Act Up&#8221; and &#8220;Bash Back&#8221; are effective precisely because they teach GLBT youth that they have a right to defend themselves even if they are gay.  The prevailing religious and social environment with its millennia bias against gays does all it can to deny them that right.</p>
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		<title>By: Dana C. LaRocca</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16642</link>
		<dc:creator>Dana C. LaRocca</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 01:26:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16642</guid>
		<description>I share the concern for GLBT youth and I believe that we need to address the issues of depression and suicide through direct action in our communities. Frankly, I think that organizations like &quot;Bash Back&quot; and &quot;Act Up&quot; do more to support our youth than academia can dream of doing.

Though I am confident that social worker Caitlin Ryan&#039;s research is well intended and well funded it falls short in intellectual rigor. It is intellectually dishonest to rubber stamp it merely because it agrees with our opinions. That is foolish and silly.

That is not science.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I share the concern for GLBT youth and I believe that we need to address the issues of depression and suicide through direct action in our communities. Frankly, I think that organizations like &#8220;Bash Back&#8221; and &#8220;Act Up&#8221; do more to support our youth than academia can dream of doing.</p>
<p>Though I am confident that social worker Caitlin Ryan&#8217;s research is well intended and well funded it falls short in intellectual rigor. It is intellectually dishonest to rubber stamp it merely because it agrees with our opinions. That is foolish and silly.</p>
<p>That is not science.</p>
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		<title>By: Ronald R.</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16627</link>
		<dc:creator>Ronald R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 18:20:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16627</guid>
		<description>The suicide rate among gays is measureably higher.  Religion-caused hate is epidemic, just look around you in the media, in families, everywhere.  There are protests at gay events.  Protests at churches were not seen widely in this country until Prop 8.  The &quot;We hate you because you exist&quot; speech is all around us, it&#039;s undeniable.  So don&#039;t paint yourselves as nice people. You&#039;re NOT.  The cadavers are still piling up.  It&#039;s insidious.  And don&#039;t think those words don&#039;t affect others.  Think Matthew Shepard here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The suicide rate among gays is measureably higher.  Religion-caused hate is epidemic, just look around you in the media, in families, everywhere.  There are protests at gay events.  Protests at churches were not seen widely in this country until Prop 8.  The &#8220;We hate you because you exist&#8221; speech is all around us, it&#8217;s undeniable.  So don&#8217;t paint yourselves as nice people. You&#8217;re NOT.  The cadavers are still piling up.  It&#8217;s insidious.  And don&#8217;t think those words don&#8217;t affect others.  Think Matthew Shepard here.</p>
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		<title>By: Rachel</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16623</link>
		<dc:creator>Rachel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 17:21:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16623</guid>
		<description>Oh and for the recod despite that fact that I am religious I still have many close frinds who are gay, lesbian and bi-sexual.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh and for the recod despite that fact that I am religious I still have many close frinds who are gay, lesbian and bi-sexual.</p>
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		<title>By: Rachel</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16622</link>
		<dc:creator>Rachel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 17:20:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16622</guid>
		<description>I am a very religious person, and I find it morally disgusting that people would reject someone due to their sexual orientation hinding behind the guise of religion.  Get over yourself, be honest, and admit that you are prejudice for all of our sakes!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a very religious person, and I find it morally disgusting that people would reject someone due to their sexual orientation hinding behind the guise of religion.  Get over yourself, be honest, and admit that you are prejudice for all of our sakes!</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16615</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 14:42:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16615</guid>
		<description>I agree with the report. As a Gay adult and 41 years old I was rejected by my family and it caused huge emotional, physical and mental anquish. I tried to commit suicide multiple time and was very into the drug scene and alcohol MY friends disowned me except for one was bullied in school. But hey now I am a 41 years old retired firefighter who is gay and I have been decorated to the hilt. I have a great partner of 16 years and life is good. My mom now accepts us and I still have that 1 good friend. For all of those who think this report is ignorant look in the mirror. All hate kills no matter what it is and if you hate you will eventually be responsibly for someones death. Try being differant for 1 day you couldn&#039;t handle it. try writing left or right handed just for a day. You will explode inside. Now think of being gay I dare you</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with the report. As a Gay adult and 41 years old I was rejected by my family and it caused huge emotional, physical and mental anquish. I tried to commit suicide multiple time and was very into the drug scene and alcohol MY friends disowned me except for one was bullied in school. But hey now I am a 41 years old retired firefighter who is gay and I have been decorated to the hilt. I have a great partner of 16 years and life is good. My mom now accepts us and I still have that 1 good friend. For all of those who think this report is ignorant look in the mirror. All hate kills no matter what it is and if you hate you will eventually be responsibly for someones death. Try being differant for 1 day you couldn&#8217;t handle it. try writing left or right handed just for a day. You will explode inside. Now think of being gay I dare you</p>
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		<title>By: jim</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16582</link>
		<dc:creator>jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 20:08:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16582</guid>
		<description>Roboguy: Yes they are. Anyone who can&#039;t see how much more value a living human being is than an invisible friend is mentally ill.
jim</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roboguy: Yes they are. Anyone who can&#8217;t see how much more value a living human being is than an invisible friend is mentally ill.<br />
jim</p>
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		<title>By: Dana C. LaRocca</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16551</link>
		<dc:creator>Dana C. LaRocca</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 01:47:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16551</guid>
		<description>Sad to say I was conducting my own research last night on the annual practice of ethanol consumption and its effect on cognition. Needless to say my math was way off base, by a factor of ten times.

That said, the sampling was still much too small. The attempted suicide rate for Ms. Ryan&#039;s study would have been five out of 244 (not a half a person as I previously stated). It would have been accurate if she had merely stated that five subjects attempted suicide. Instead she said that the suicide rate was eight times higher.

There is a danger of extrapolating that &quot;eight times&quot; to larger and different populations. Ms. Ryan does not mention the use of a control group with the same demographics. So my guess is that she is comparing these 244 young people to a national norm. There is nothing wrong with that but it should at least be mentioned.

As a serious scholar I would want to know if these subjects shared any common traits other than GLBT (east coast for LGBT). For instance, if they came from the same community some other factor may have played a role. Two copy-cat suicide attempts within a close knit group, for instance, would more than double the instances in this small a sampling.

So no, Nancy, it isn&#039;t that I think a small sampling is useless for a scientific study. But at best, in this case, it suggests the need for further study with a much broader sampling. As for Sigmund Freud’s studies; those were case studies. They did not pretend to provide statistical probabilities.

I have no doubt that gay youth are much more at risk than the general population. But Ms. Ryan&#039;s study is hardly groundbreaking or newsworthy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sad to say I was conducting my own research last night on the annual practice of ethanol consumption and its effect on cognition. Needless to say my math was way off base, by a factor of ten times.</p>
<p>That said, the sampling was still much too small. The attempted suicide rate for Ms. Ryan&#8217;s study would have been five out of 244 (not a half a person as I previously stated). It would have been accurate if she had merely stated that five subjects attempted suicide. Instead she said that the suicide rate was eight times higher.</p>
<p>There is a danger of extrapolating that &#8220;eight times&#8221; to larger and different populations. Ms. Ryan does not mention the use of a control group with the same demographics. So my guess is that she is comparing these 244 young people to a national norm. There is nothing wrong with that but it should at least be mentioned.</p>
<p>As a serious scholar I would want to know if these subjects shared any common traits other than GLBT (east coast for LGBT). For instance, if they came from the same community some other factor may have played a role. Two copy-cat suicide attempts within a close knit group, for instance, would more than double the instances in this small a sampling.</p>
<p>So no, Nancy, it isn&#8217;t that I think a small sampling is useless for a scientific study. But at best, in this case, it suggests the need for further study with a much broader sampling. As for Sigmund Freud’s studies; those were case studies. They did not pretend to provide statistical probabilities.</p>
<p>I have no doubt that gay youth are much more at risk than the general population. But Ms. Ryan&#8217;s study is hardly groundbreaking or newsworthy.</p>
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		<title>By: Nancy</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16545</link>
		<dc:creator>Nancy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 2009 22:23:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16545</guid>
		<description>So, you think 300 subjects is too small a sampling to constitute a valid scientific survey?  Funny ...  I&#039;ll bet you have no such qualms about the validity of Sigmund Freud&#039;s studies in the field of psychotherapy, which he founded on a sample size of ...  three, exactly THREE, aristocratic Viennese women.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, you think 300 subjects is too small a sampling to constitute a valid scientific survey?  Funny &#8230;  I&#8217;ll bet you have no such qualms about the validity of Sigmund Freud&#8217;s studies in the field of psychotherapy, which he founded on a sample size of &#8230;  three, exactly THREE, aristocratic Viennese women.</p>
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		<title>By: Nik</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16535</link>
		<dc:creator>Nik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 2009 17:19:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16535</guid>
		<description>In this day and age we see more and more people coming out and admitting their to their homosexuality. we also see more people who are left handed. these are only two groups of people who are now more accepted for what they are rather than being told what they should be. And I think it&#039;s awesome. 
   Imagine(everyone who is straight) that growing up you weren&#039;t allowed to play or socialize with peers of the opposite sex. that same sex was the way to go. wouldn&#039;t you feel confused? what you are told vice what you feel? and how do you think you&#039;d lash out? your parents not caring about you may lead you to not care about yourself. take unnecessary risks, i.e. drugs unprotected sex, even suicide. In the end, if your own family rejects you, what&#039;s left? Hell, maybe that&#039;s learned behavior! parents treat me like utter shit, maybe that&#039;s how I&#039;m supposed to be treated by everyone, even myself! 
   Kids of all ages should be accepted for who they are. nurtured in the natural direction of who they are to be. artists, for art. Musicians for music. do you scold a child for having the wrong colored eyes? or for having Down&#039;s syndrome? I hope not. they had nothing to do with those decisions. It&#039;s in their genes. Stop making children feel bad for who they are. let lefties be lefties, let homosexuals be homosexuals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In this day and age we see more and more people coming out and admitting their to their homosexuality. we also see more people who are left handed. these are only two groups of people who are now more accepted for what they are rather than being told what they should be. And I think it&#8217;s awesome.<br />
   Imagine(everyone who is straight) that growing up you weren&#8217;t allowed to play or socialize with peers of the opposite sex. that same sex was the way to go. wouldn&#8217;t you feel confused? what you are told vice what you feel? and how do you think you&#8217;d lash out? your parents not caring about you may lead you to not care about yourself. take unnecessary risks, i.e. drugs unprotected sex, even suicide. In the end, if your own family rejects you, what&#8217;s left? Hell, maybe that&#8217;s learned behavior! parents treat me like utter shit, maybe that&#8217;s how I&#8217;m supposed to be treated by everyone, even myself!<br />
   Kids of all ages should be accepted for who they are. nurtured in the natural direction of who they are to be. artists, for art. Musicians for music. do you scold a child for having the wrong colored eyes? or for having Down&#8217;s syndrome? I hope not. they had nothing to do with those decisions. It&#8217;s in their genes. Stop making children feel bad for who they are. let lefties be lefties, let homosexuals be homosexuals.</p>
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		<title>By: Dana C. LaRocca</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16522</link>
		<dc:creator>Dana C. LaRocca</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 2009 06:46:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16522</guid>
		<description>I am more than a little suspect of a &quot;scientific&quot; study of less than three hundred subjects making queer (as in &quot;peculiar&quot;) conclusions  &quot;that teenagers who were rejected by their families were eight times as likely to attempt suicide, six times as likely to report serious depression, and three times as likely to have unprotected sex and use drugs.

I have no doubt that kids rejected by their families are more likely to have mental health problems than those who are accepted. But it is hardly &quot;science&quot; when those conclusions are drawn from surveys of a tiny sampling.

The first problem is that the conclusions are based on the subject&#039;s own perceptions. Doesn&#039;t it occur to the researchers that a young person who is depressed or suicidal might feel rejected when in fact he or she is not?

Now let&#039;s do the math. According to The National Institute of Mental Health there are about 250 suicide attempts for every 100,000 people. That&#039;s 2.5 per ten thousand. Social worker Caitlin Ryan&#039;s sampling of 224 subjects would result in one half of an attempted suicide based on her &quot;eight times as likely&quot; scenario.

Clearly half a person did not report a suicide attempt. Nor is it likely that a whole person reported a half a suicide attempt.

Give me science. Please.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am more than a little suspect of a &#8220;scientific&#8221; study of less than three hundred subjects making queer (as in &#8220;peculiar&#8221;) conclusions  &#8220;that teenagers who were rejected by their families were eight times as likely to attempt suicide, six times as likely to report serious depression, and three times as likely to have unprotected sex and use drugs.</p>
<p>I have no doubt that kids rejected by their families are more likely to have mental health problems than those who are accepted. But it is hardly &#8220;science&#8221; when those conclusions are drawn from surveys of a tiny sampling.</p>
<p>The first problem is that the conclusions are based on the subject&#8217;s own perceptions. Doesn&#8217;t it occur to the researchers that a young person who is depressed or suicidal might feel rejected when in fact he or she is not?</p>
<p>Now let&#8217;s do the math. According to The National Institute of Mental Health there are about 250 suicide attempts for every 100,000 people. That&#8217;s 2.5 per ten thousand. Social worker Caitlin Ryan&#8217;s sampling of 224 subjects would result in one half of an attempted suicide based on her &#8220;eight times as likely&#8221; scenario.</p>
<p>Clearly half a person did not report a suicide attempt. Nor is it likely that a whole person reported a half a suicide attempt.</p>
<p>Give me science. Please.</p>
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		<title>By: Robguy</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16481</link>
		<dc:creator>Robguy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 07:49:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16481</guid>
		<description>..so people that reject members of their family based on religious beliefs are mentally ill?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>..so people that reject members of their family based on religious beliefs are mentally ill?</p>
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		<title>By: Larian LeQuella</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/comment-page-1/#comment-16464</link>
		<dc:creator>Larian LeQuella</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Dec 2008 21:50:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2008/12/30/familial-rejection-of-gay-teens-can-lead-to-mental-health-problems-later/#comment-16464</guid>
		<description>The third paragraph is quite &quot;informative&quot; and further affirms the opinion I hold of theism...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The third paragraph is quite &#8220;informative&#8221; and further affirms the opinion I hold of theism&#8230;</p>
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