Comments on: Study: Lice-Infested Farmed Salmon Not to Blame for Wild Salmon Die-Off http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/ Mon, 22 Apr 2013 21:34:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.2 By: Jim Bruining http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24192 Jim Bruining Fri, 17 Dec 2010 23:20:52 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24192 I love the lady above (Barbara Watson) that says "it (study) should be ignored". Wow. I take it Barbara is an activist, 'cause that doesn't sound very scientific!! Science is to be debated (usually by scientists though, and not weird people that seek cults and leaders). Whether you agree with this study or not, you simply can't "choose" your favorite and ignore the rest. It's all important. In this case, I think salmon farmers have made some very good changes because of what other "less favorable" studies have concluded in the past. These positive changes would suggest that salmon farmers aren't ignoring any studies, so it would be good to see activists like Barbara paying attention as well. I'll bet Barbara stopped reading this comment after the first sentence... I love the lady above (Barbara Watson) that says “it (study) should be ignored”.

Wow. I take it Barbara is an activist, ’cause that doesn’t sound very scientific!! Science is to be debated (usually by scientists though, and not weird people that seek cults and leaders).

Whether you agree with this study or not, you simply can’t “choose” your favorite and ignore the rest. It’s all important.

In this case, I think salmon farmers have made some very good changes because of what other “less favorable” studies have concluded in the past. These positive changes would suggest that salmon farmers aren’t ignoring any studies, so it would be good to see activists like Barbara paying attention as well.

I’ll bet Barbara stopped reading this comment after the first sentence…

]]> By: Sara http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24191 Sara Fri, 17 Dec 2010 05:47:18 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24191 There is a whole other story about the well funded anti salmon farming activists intent on demarketing farmed salmon. Dismissing science that is contrary to their campaign is part of the package. Recommended reading: http://www.farmfreshsalmon.org There is a whole other story about the well funded anti salmon farming activists intent on demarketing farmed salmon. Dismissing science that is contrary to their campaign is part of the package. Recommended reading: http://www.farmfreshsalmon.org

]]> By: Barbara watson http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24190 Barbara watson Fri, 17 Dec 2010 00:49:48 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24190 Recommended reading. "Listening to Whales" by Alexandra Morton. Written from a love of the natural world and a lifelong commitment to the whales and their habitat. Read it and then you decide who's science is motivated in YOUR best interests. A fascinating wealth of information about the Orca whales that should not be missed. Recommended reading. “Listening to Whales” by Alexandra Morton.

Written from a love of the natural world and a lifelong commitment to the whales and their habitat. Read it and then you decide who’s science is motivated in YOUR best interests. A fascinating wealth of information about the Orca whales that should not be missed.

]]> By: nick http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24189 nick Thu, 16 Dec 2010 00:26:01 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24189 YR: good point on farming the babies, but you know would end up doing it in toxic conditions anyway, unleashing plagues across our sea. :) Did they check for parasites that infect salmon internally, carried by the sea lice? Like the way our pets can get gross intestinal infections from eating fleas? That's what I'm curious about. Especially since they apparently enjoy eating them. Unfortunately I don't have a PNAS account so I can't check for myself. YR: good point on farming the babies, but you know would end up doing it in toxic conditions anyway, unleashing plagues across our sea. :)

Did they check for parasites that infect salmon internally, carried by the sea lice? Like the way our pets can get gross intestinal infections from eating fleas? That’s what I’m curious about. Especially since they apparently enjoy eating them. Unfortunately I don’t have a PNAS account so I can’t check for myself.

]]> By: YouRang http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24188 YouRang Wed, 15 Dec 2010 14:52:27 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24188 re Vicks's comment. It seems to me that that is exactly their contention: I.E. the prevalence of infestation has been asserted to be killing the fish; but the intensity was only capable of killing an additional 8% of the population. In fact it looks to me like the people claiming the link between farming and lice killing have been looking at prevalence rather than intensity. So thank you Vick for proving the opposite side of the case to your position (or are you just a shill?). My position actually is we'd be better off if we farmed the babies, protecting them and then releasing them into the wild. re Vicks’s comment.
It seems to me that that is exactly their contention: I.E. the prevalence of infestation has been asserted to be killing the fish; but the intensity was only capable of killing an additional 8% of the population. In fact it looks to me like the people claiming the link between farming and lice killing have been looking at prevalence rather than intensity. So thank you Vick for proving the opposite side of the case to your position (or are you just a shill?).
My position actually is we’d be better off if we farmed the babies, protecting them and then releasing them into the wild.

]]> By: Bronwen http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24187 Bronwen Wed, 15 Dec 2010 03:26:56 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24187 New study suggesting sea lice not to blame for harming wild salmon is inconclusive and fails to convince when weighed against the full scope of science on this subject. http://farmedanddangerous.org/page/newsandcommentary New study suggesting sea lice not to blame for harming wild salmon is inconclusive and fails to convince when weighed against the full scope of science on this subject.
http://farmedanddangerous.org/page/newsandcommentary

]]> By: Vick http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24186 Vick Tue, 14 Dec 2010 19:32:17 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24186 Your article states that the authors findings were that : "the parasites travel from wild salmon to farmed ones and not the other way around". Absolutely NOT true. In fact, later on the author corrects or counterdicts this statement by stating that the authors found: " high number of lice in the farmed fish predicts higher than normal exposure for the juveniles of the wild variety". The authors looked at prevalences (% population with sea lice), instead of intensities (# sea lice per infected fish). It's the INTENSITIES (per gram of host) that are used to estimate mortalities of fish, not Abundances. So why didn't the authors also examine INTENSITIES as well as PREVALENCES? That data would have been right in front of them. Why hasn't the media questioned them on it? Let's also NOT FORGET that sea lice on farmed salmon is the BEST predictor of sea lice on wild outmigrating juveniles that these authors found. The question is whether or not sea lice prevalences is the best metric to use to determine the impacts of farm-origin lice on wild salmon populations. Seems not. what about intensities? Your article states that the authors findings were that : “the parasites travel from wild salmon to farmed ones and not the other way around”.

Absolutely NOT true. In fact, later on the author corrects or counterdicts this statement by stating that the authors found: ” high number of lice in the farmed fish predicts higher than normal exposure for the juveniles of the wild variety”.

The authors looked at prevalences (% population with sea lice), instead of intensities (# sea lice per infected fish). It’s the INTENSITIES (per gram of host) that are used to estimate mortalities of fish, not Abundances. So why didn’t the authors also examine INTENSITIES as well as PREVALENCES? That data would have been right in front of them. Why hasn’t the media questioned them on it?

Let’s also NOT FORGET that sea lice on farmed salmon is the BEST predictor of sea lice on wild outmigrating juveniles that these authors found. The question is whether or not sea lice prevalences is the best metric to use to determine the impacts of farm-origin lice on wild salmon populations. Seems not. what about intensities?

]]> By: Barbara watson http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24185 Barbara watson Tue, 14 Dec 2010 19:04:25 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24185 Natures way of dealing with the sea lice on adult salmon is to have the lice die with the adult when they go up the river to spawn. This leaves a clean environment for the baby fry to grow and begin their journey to the ocean. The salmon feedlots are like the Golden Arches to the young fry, attracted by food. This intense exposure to concentrations of lice infested farmed fish allow the lice to transfer to the young salmon in mortal numbers, instead of growing in the open ocean to a size that is not as vulnerable to the lice. Nature has no Golden Arches. The young fry are not intended by nature to mingle intensely with diseased or infected adults. The science of this report is faulty and self serving to the industry. It should be ignored. Natures way of dealing with the sea lice on adult salmon is to have the lice die with the adult when they go up the river to spawn. This leaves a clean environment for the baby fry to grow and begin their journey to the ocean. The salmon feedlots are like the Golden Arches to the young fry, attracted by food. This intense exposure to concentrations of lice infested farmed fish allow the lice to transfer to the young salmon in mortal numbers, instead of growing in the open ocean to a size that is not as vulnerable to the lice. Nature has no Golden Arches. The young fry are not intended by nature to mingle intensely with diseased or infected adults.

The science of this report is faulty and self serving to the industry. It should be ignored.

]]> By: Matt B. http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/12/14/study-lice-infested-farmed-salmon-not-to-blame-for-wild-salmon-die-off/#comment-24184 Matt B. Tue, 14 Dec 2010 18:53:25 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=23732#comment-24184 How closely related is the sea louse to regular lice like the head louse? How closely related is the sea louse to regular lice like the head louse?

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