Comments on: Grudge-Holding Crows Pass on Their Anger to Family and Friends http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/ 80beats is DISCOVER's news aggregator, weaving together the choicest tidbits from the best articles covering the day's most compelling topics. Wed, 23 May 2012 19:57:39 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: teresa http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-4104361 teresa Fri, 18 May 2012 14:21:58 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-4104361 To May, They are teachers as well. If you do not know how to deal with a bully, lol, they will teach you or they will beat you if you don't learn how. They will take your belongings, your personal space, if you allow it. If...you...allow it. Get mad and stand up for yourself and take your space back. Replace the fear with strenght, stearn, strong behavior. But...you have to learn to feel that strengh and firmness with no fear inside. They know when its acting. Belive me they know. When my raven tries me for dominance, I tell ..let's go, its on, and I will win. I believe that. She then gets meek and sweet again. That is the ravens way. The crows way. Another thing you need to do is get a bag of puppy chow. They wool see you as a benifit to them if you throw out a cup of food to them every time you at the park. Let them see you dump it and even make up a certain whistle or call that they will learn. Put the food in the same place each time and in a few days or week they wool want to see you there. You see all corvids, will appreciate anyone that is a ...benefit to them and there health and survival. Pretty soon you will be there buddy . It took months for the wild crows to trust me. That's normal. They will be great friends to you. They need that food for there new offspring. Plus others will wonder what your trick is when you walk through the park with no problem and they arestill getting dive bombed, LOL. I promise you it will work . To May,

They are teachers as well. If you do not know how to deal with a bully, lol, they will teach you or they will beat you if you don’t learn how.
They will take your belongings, your personal space, if you allow it.
If…you…allow it.
Get mad and stand up for yourself and take your space back. Replace the fear with strenght, stearn, strong behavior.
But…you have to learn to feel that strengh and firmness with no fear inside. They know when its acting. Belive me they know.
When my raven tries me for dominance, I tell ..let’s go, its on, and I will win. I believe that. She then gets meek and sweet again.
That is the ravens way. The crows way.
Another thing you need to do is get a bag of puppy chow. They wool see you as a benifit to them if you throw out a cup of food to them every time you at the park. Let them see you dump it and even make up a certain whistle or call that they will learn. Put the food in the same place each time and in a few days or week they wool want to see you there.
You see all corvids, will appreciate anyone that is a …benefit to them and there health and survival.
Pretty soon you will be there buddy .
It took months for the wild crows to trust me. That’s normal. They will be great friends to you.
They need that food for there new offspring.
Plus others will wonder what your trick is when you walk through the park with no problem and they arestill getting dive bombed, LOL.
I promise you it will work .

]]> By: may http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-3181214 may Thu, 05 Jan 2012 18:59:13 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-3181214 it is the third time i am beaten by acrow now i am afraid to go to the park tell me why and what can i do to prevent it it is the third time i am beaten by acrow now i am afraid to go to the park tell me why and what can i do to prevent it

]]> By: gwbnyc http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-3067588 gwbnyc Thu, 22 Dec 2011 22:50:47 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-3067588 I can attest to this; for years, I was sure crows recognized me, by their calls and behavior- I know they can certainly discern a man with or without a rifle or shotgun- display a firearm and they disappear. I'm referring to crows reacting to *me*, and not just "another human". I sometimes wonder how far the influence, in actual distance, goes. I suspect, from experience, farther and faster than imagined. I've dealt with them as quarry for years, and can assert crows know a lot more than they let on:) from above: "They also understand trading for something better" -True. When I was a boy a neighbor had a crow for a while that would fly up to you and try to take, say, a shiny gum wrapper from you. Denied the wrapper, he'd fly off and bring an item back in his beak to trade, like a pine needle. We would make the swap with him and he'd fly off with his new piece of tinfoil. I can attest to this; for years, I was sure crows recognized me, by their calls and behavior- I know they can certainly discern a man with or without a rifle or shotgun- display a firearm and they disappear.

I’m referring to crows reacting to *me*, and not just “another human”.

I sometimes wonder how far the influence, in actual distance, goes. I suspect, from experience, farther and faster than imagined.

I’ve dealt with them as quarry for years, and can assert crows know a lot more than they let on:)

from above:
“They also understand trading for something better”

-True. When I was a boy a neighbor had a crow for a while that would fly up to you and try to take, say, a shiny gum wrapper from you. Denied the wrapper, he’d fly off and bring an item back in his beak to trade, like a pine needle. We would make the swap with him and he’d fly off with his new piece of tinfoil.

]]> By: Vincent http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1627030 Vincent Wed, 07 Sep 2011 22:14:13 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1627030 Magpies are so closely related to crows that it shouldn't be considered as a totally different species, I'm sure they can crossbreed and the research has not been done yet, it would be better to say Corvidae recognize human faces, as current research shows the corvidae family can recognize faces. Magpies are so closely related to crows that it shouldn’t be considered as a totally different species, I’m sure they can crossbreed and the research has not been done yet, it would be better to say Corvidae recognize human faces, as current research shows the corvidae family can recognize faces.

]]> By: teresa http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1504471 teresa Sat, 27 Aug 2011 05:21:57 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1504471 To Chris, They are scolding you. They scold each other as well. Put an offering of dog food dry preferably with your photo under the food. when they take your gift , they will see yor face in the photo and will most likely forgive you. Add some ripe cherries to the plate also. They can recognize people in a photo to. You see after you scold them you have to show love and reasurance afterwards. Tell them trees off limits but you still love them and give them something better instead. They also understand trading for something better. I get tree, you get dog food and a coupe ripe cherries for association reasons. You mabey should put the photo just above the plate actually and don't pick one where your showing your teeth, but one with a gentle smile and relaxed eyes. Have fun! I have African ravens and crows. They are legal. Take care all. To Chris,
They are scolding you. They scold each other as well. Put an offering of dog food dry preferably with your photo under the food. when they take your gift , they will see yor face in the photo and will most likely forgive you. Add some ripe cherries to the plate also. They can recognize people in a photo to. You see after you scold them you have to show love and reasurance afterwards. Tell them trees off limits but you still love them and give them something better instead. They also understand trading for something better. I get tree, you get dog food and a coupe ripe cherries for association reasons. You mabey should put the photo just above the plate actually and don’t pick one where your showing your teeth, but one with a gentle
smile and relaxed eyes. Have fun! I have African ravens and crows. They are legal. Take care all.

]]> By: teresa http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1504148 teresa Sat, 27 Aug 2011 04:41:49 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1504148 Yes but if your part of there family. And you scold them first, they ask for your forgiveness and reashurance of your love and then run off to get into more trouble. talk softly to them bow your head down , lblink your eyes a lot. I then COO and do bill holding with them which is a sign of affection and reasurance . Blinking and showing the whites of the lids is a sign of relaxation and non agression. These birds have a strong hiarchy. If you allow them to be aggressive to you and have fear or back down them look out. Allways mutual respect is kept. They are very forgiving if your one of there family. If they see another raven scared or upset they are right there to comfort them and make sure there ok. If they are in fear for no real threat then the alpha raven will nip and get there attention and then preen there feathers only around the. Head and face area. It works. By the way, ravens and crows think there feathers are all that and do not like them touched even by family. Only the face and neck are touched by the rest. Beaks being touched are there way of communication as well. Ravens will have enouph respect to warn you before they bite. They give a non chalant bill click. They won't warn you twice. I respect that. Crows wellll, they tend to bite first, but then again its only my stupidity of not recognizing the crows warning signs first. I live with them and we are all family. The wild ones that I feed understand I'm with them from seeing myn with me. So to make a longstory short,,,,,,,don't disrespect them or touch there babys because they will only do what each of you would do and that's protect there children and family members. Mutual respect is the key as well as don't show fear. They don't attack without a very good reason. Beautiful animals beautiful old souls is what they are. We can all learn so much if you yopen yourselves and your minds and hearts to their world. It's actually quite less barbaric than humans when you look at what we do to each other in the world . They have a beatiful order to themselves and to each other as well as loving caring devotion. Yes but if your part of there family. And you scold them first, they ask for your forgiveness and reashurance of your love and then run off to get into more trouble. talk softly to them bow your head down , lblink your eyes a lot. I then COO and do bill holding with them which is a sign of affection and reasurance . Blinking and showing the whites of the lids is a sign of relaxation and non agression. These birds have a strong hiarchy. If you allow them to be aggressive to you and have fear or back down them look out. Allways mutual respect is kept. They are very forgiving if your one of there family. If they see another raven scared or upset they are right there to comfort them and make sure there ok. If they are in fear for no real threat then the alpha raven will nip and get there attention and then preen there feathers only around the. Head and face area. It works. By the way, ravens and crows think there feathers are all that and do not like them touched even by family. Only the face and neck are touched by the rest. Beaks being touched are there way of communication as well. Ravens will have enouph respect to warn you before they bite. They give a non chalant bill click. They won’t warn you twice. I respect that. Crows wellll, they tend to bite first, but then again its only my stupidity of not recognizing the crows warning signs first. I live with them and we are all family. The wild ones that I feed understand I’m with them from seeing myn with me. So to make a longstory short,,,,,,,don’t disrespect them or touch there babys because they will only do what each of you would do and that’s protect there children and family members. Mutual respect is the key as well as don’t show fear. They don’t attack without a very good reason. Beautiful animals beautiful old souls is what they are. We can all learn so much if you yopen yourselves and your minds and hearts to their world. It’s actually quite less barbaric than humans when you look at what we do to each other in the world . They have a beatiful order to themselves and to each other as well as loving caring devotion.

]]> By: Jan Standefer http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1154676 Jan Standefer Sat, 09 Jul 2011 10:33:53 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1154676 I grew up raising baby crows and over the years after being gone from the small town where I did this I was always recognized by the crows in that part of town and would be dive bombed! My mom used to laugh and tease me saying, "see, they remember who stole their babies!" This happened after I'd been gone for 3 years to college when I returned home to visit my parents. They are like the bouncers of the bird world! they also will scold animals they don't like, cats, certain dogs, ravens, eagles, etc. As pets, they make wonderful watch dogs! Too bad no one asked me about this or I could of saved them all that time and money on the research at U of Wa.!! I live here in Wa now and think it's hillarious w/all this latest news on crows! I grew up in Alaska and they are everywhere and one definitely has many opportunities to observe them! I grew up raising baby crows and over the years after being gone from the small town where I did this I was always recognized by the crows in that part of town and would be dive bombed! My mom used to laugh and tease me saying, “see, they remember who stole their babies!” This happened after I’d been gone for 3 years to college when I returned home to visit my parents. They are like the bouncers of the bird world! they also will scold animals they don’t like, cats, certain dogs, ravens, eagles, etc. As pets, they make wonderful watch dogs! Too bad no one asked me about this or I could of saved them all that time and money on the research at U of Wa.!! I live here in Wa now and think it’s hillarious w/all this latest news on crows! I grew up in Alaska and they are everywhere and one definitely has many opportunities to observe them!

]]> By: Stan http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1151118 Stan Fri, 08 Jul 2011 10:34:22 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1151118 Konrad Lorenz wrote about this in <i>King Solomon's Ring</i> (1952). Konrad Lorenz wrote about this in King Solomon’s Ring (1952).

]]> By: Bird Lover http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1148886 Bird Lover Thu, 07 Jul 2011 23:28:09 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1148886 The crows at my golf course know me, and wait for my handout of peanuts. They used to pick my pocket(book) that was in the basket of the cart, but have learned to just wait for the handout (all they ever got from my purse was cash and credit cards). The crows at my golf course know me, and wait for my handout of peanuts. They used to pick my pocket(book) that was in the basket of the cart, but have learned to just wait for the handout (all they ever got from my purse was cash and credit cards).

]]> By: Kevin Johnson http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1131275 Kevin Johnson Sun, 03 Jul 2011 15:50:21 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1131275 I wonder who paid for this and how much it cost them. I wonder who paid for this and how much it cost them.

]]> By: cancer cure http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1129008 cancer cure Sat, 02 Jul 2011 20:52:59 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1129008 Hello finaly I found what I was looking for how did you guys found this information??thank you for your article I saw it on Google And I saved it .I like. You have my email guys, so can you please send me an email when you post some new blogs on your site!!! thank you and have a nice day Hello
finaly I found what I was looking for

how did you guys found this information??thank you for your article I saw it on Google And I saved it .I like. You have my email guys, so can you please send me an email when you post some new blogs on your site!!!

thank you and have a nice day

]]> By: Chris http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1128323 Chris Sat, 02 Jul 2011 15:31:27 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1128323 These findings make me wonder if crows also go a step further and enact vendetta on humans. We have a very bountiful cherry tree in our country cottage's back yard that up until two years ago gave us loads of cherries. Of course raccoons and many types of birds, including crows helped themselves. Three summers ago I clapped and yelled to chase the crows away. They would fly away cawwing "angrily" (my interpretion). The last two seasons we have returned on vacation to find cherry branches with green cherries attached littering the ground. Our neighbors reported seeing crowds of crows in the tree ripping off the branches. They were even eating the green, unripe cherries. Humanly it feels like punishing behavior. Perhaps I'm anthropomorphizing? Anyone observed similar crow behavior? These findings make me wonder if crows also go a step further and enact vendetta on humans.
We have a very bountiful cherry tree in our country cottage’s back yard that up until two years ago gave us loads of cherries. Of course raccoons and many types of birds, including crows helped themselves. Three summers ago I clapped and yelled to chase the crows away. They would fly away cawwing “angrily” (my interpretion). The last two seasons we have returned on vacation to find cherry branches with green cherries attached littering the ground. Our neighbors reported seeing crowds of crows in the tree ripping off the branches. They were even eating the green, unripe cherries. Humanly it feels like punishing behavior. Perhaps I’m anthropomorphizing? Anyone observed similar crow behavior?

]]> By: Michelle http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1122238 Michelle Fri, 01 Jul 2011 04:04:00 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1122238 In my case it was probably a combination of factors...a wide-brimmed hat, a light-colored jacket and physical build. I saw these same crows cawing at another woman on a day that I wore a different kind of hat...she was dressed the way I usually do when I go to the beach. http://www.flickr.com/photos/11815777@N07/5760000955/in/set-72157625687842416/ It's been several weeks though since the last time I was there...I wonder if they have found someone else to yell at. In my case it was probably a combination of factors…a wide-brimmed hat, a light-colored jacket and physical build. I saw these same crows cawing at another woman on a day that I wore a different kind of hat…she was dressed the way I usually do when I go to the beach.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/11815777@N07/5760000955/in/set-72157625687842416/

It’s been several weeks though since the last time I was there…I wonder if they have found someone else to yell at.

]]> By: Iain http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1121681 Iain Fri, 01 Jul 2011 00:37:16 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1121681 What this proves is that crows like many species have a rudimentary language. They were calling dirtbag and passed it on to a younger generation. Big surprise, the young learned from the old. The real test is to find out what characteristics the crows used to identify the faces. What this proves is that crows like many species have a rudimentary language.
They were calling dirtbag and passed it on to a younger generation.
Big surprise, the young learned from the old.
The real test is to find out what characteristics the crows used to identify the faces.

]]> By: Michelle http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/06/30/grudge-holding-crows-pass-on-their-anger-to-family-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-1121030 Michelle Thu, 30 Jun 2011 20:20:48 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/?p=30017#comment-1121030 I don't think their eyesight is as good as claimed. I have been misidentified as a miscreant by a group of crows. All because of a hat. I don’t think their eyesight is as good as claimed. I have been misidentified as a miscreant by a group of crows. All because of a hat.

]]>