Comments on: Putting the sham in shamanic http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/ I am an astronomer, writer, and skeptic. I likes reality the way it is, and I aims to keep it that way. My real name is Phil Plait, and I run the Bad Astronomy blog. Thu, 08 Jan 2009 08:59:40 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1 By: Rufus http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4186 Rufus Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:25:37 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4186 There is more to life than rationality. There are feelings, thoughts, passions, desires.... Have any of you heard of Jung? Ever heard of archetypes? Are all of that knowledge new age BS according to you rational people? It is obvous most of the people on this blog have the mercury in Aries. There is more to life than rationality. There are feelings, thoughts, passions, desires…. Have any of you heard of Jung? Ever heard of archetypes? Are all of that knowledge new age BS according to you rational people?

It is obvous most of the people on this blog have the mercury in Aries.

]]> By: Ken Gayley http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4185 Ken Gayley Mon, 10 Oct 2005 01:45:07 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4185 In response to Seamyst, the point being made is that whenever astrology or new-age philosophy has any meaning, the meaning derives from the way in which it is interpreted by the listener. In other words, the wisdom is input by the client, not supplied by the practitioner. So even though it may have some value in encouraging people to introspect, it's obviously a pretty good racket! I suppose some might argue that so is psychology, but at least there is a great effort there to establish reliable credentials and accountability. In response to Seamyst, the point being made is that whenever astrology
or new-age philosophy has any meaning, the meaning derives from the way
in which it is interpreted by the listener. In other words, the wisdom is input
by the client, not supplied by the practitioner. So even though it may have
some value in encouraging people to introspect, it’s obviously a pretty good
racket! I suppose some might argue that so is psychology, but at least there
is a great effort there to establish reliable credentials and accountability.

]]> By: ElWampa http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4184 ElWampa Fri, 01 Apr 2005 19:23:11 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4184 Sure, sure! It's just the same old & tired, meaningless, new age self help rhetoric that has been re-worded. It makes the same amount of sense as it originally did. Just step outside the New Age loop, and you will see what we're talking about. And just for your information. It only takes a little rationality and intelligence to be a whole and balanced individual, not this trash! Sure, sure!

It’s just the same old & tired, meaningless, new age self help rhetoric that has been re-worded.

It makes the same amount of sense as it originally did. Just step outside the New Age loop, and you will see what we’re talking about.

And just for your information. It only takes a little rationality and intelligence to be a whole and balanced individual, not this trash!

]]> By: Seamyst http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4183 Seamyst Wed, 30 Mar 2005 04:13:58 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4183 "Wholeness is awakening to your shadow as well as your light, balancing the upper, lower, and middle worlds, and integrating your past lineage with your future soul intention. " Actually, if you take this apart, some of it DOES make sense. (Please note, I am agnostic. I do NOT believe in all this.) "Wholeness" - duh, being whole, being complete. "your shadow" - your dark side. This is in psychology, can't think what it's called right now. Some people are more in tune with their dark side than others - this does NOT refer to criminal or wrong acts. "balancing the upper, lower, and middle worlds" - not entirely sure on this one, except it reminds me of Tolkien's Middle Earth. "integrating ... soul intention" - combining your past experiences, whether they be in this lifetime or in past lifetimes (if you believe in reincarnation) with your future dreams and goals. So basically, this person's saying that in order to be a whole and balanced individual, you need to acknowledge and become comfortable with your dark/shadow side as well as your light side, you need to balance all parts of your life, and you need to both come to grips with your past as well as be aware of your future goals. See? When you translate it like that, it makes sense and isn't so bad. “Wholeness is awakening to your shadow as well as your light, balancing the upper, lower, and middle worlds, and integrating your past lineage with your future soul intention. ”

Actually, if you take this apart, some of it DOES make sense. (Please note, I am agnostic. I do NOT believe in all this.)

“Wholeness” - duh, being whole, being complete.
“your shadow” - your dark side. This is in psychology, can’t think what it’s called right now. Some people are more in tune with their dark side than others - this does NOT refer to criminal or wrong acts.
“balancing the upper, lower, and middle worlds” - not entirely sure on this one, except it reminds me of Tolkien’s Middle Earth.
“integrating … soul intention” - combining your past experiences, whether they be in this lifetime or in past lifetimes (if you believe in reincarnation) with your future dreams and goals.

So basically, this person’s saying that in order to be a whole and balanced individual, you need to acknowledge and become comfortable with your dark/shadow side as well as your light side, you need to balance all parts of your life, and you need to both come to grips with your past as well as be aware of your future goals.

See? When you translate it like that, it makes sense and isn’t so bad.

]]> By: Spaz http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4182 Spaz Thu, 17 Mar 2005 16:40:35 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4182 Man, if it wasn't for my conscience, I would go into that business so fast... Man, if it wasn’t for my conscience, I would go into that business so fast…

]]> By: Gillian http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4181 Gillian Thu, 17 Mar 2005 04:22:36 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4181 When I was still a college student, the Powers That Be at our school paper decided that having just any ol' horoscope was boring, so instead, we went for Mayan Cosmology. Much of which made even less sense than that. The other copy editor and I practically arm wrestled to see who was going to be forced to slog through it that week, trying to make some grammatical sense out of it. When I was still a college student, the Powers That Be at our school paper decided that having just any ol’ horoscope was boring, so instead, we went for Mayan Cosmology. Much of which made even less sense than that. The other copy editor and I practically arm wrestled to see who was going to be forced to slog through it that week, trying to make some grammatical sense out of it.

]]> By: Maksutov http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4180 Maksutov Thu, 17 Mar 2005 00:01:07 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/03/15/putting-the-sham-in-shamanic/#comment-4180 It's the result of the age-old conflict between feeling and thinking. Strong feelings are mistaken for proven facts. The mesmerizing mumbo-jumbo of rituals produces emotional reactions that, if not filtered, analyzed, and controlled, are mistaken for real results and actual occurrences. Then, when the trance is broken, and what actually happened is coolly evaluated, the complete lack of any basis in fact becomes readily apparent. The BA's quote from "Holistic Happenings", illustrates this quite well. To folks under the spell of the shaman, those words make perfect sense, but in the cold, sober light of reason, are revealed to be nonsense. "Your species has the most amazing capacity for self-deception, matched only by its ingenuity in destroying itself." -- The 7th Doctor Who It’s the result of the age-old conflict between feeling and thinking. Strong feelings are mistaken for proven facts. The mesmerizing mumbo-jumbo of rituals produces emotional reactions that, if not filtered, analyzed, and controlled, are mistaken for real results and actual occurrences.

Then, when the trance is broken, and what actually happened is coolly evaluated, the complete lack of any basis in fact becomes readily apparent. The BA’s quote from “Holistic Happenings”, illustrates this quite well. To folks under the spell of the shaman, those words make perfect sense, but in the cold, sober light of reason, are revealed to be nonsense.

“Your species has the most amazing capacity for self-deception, matched only by its ingenuity in destroying itself.” — The 7th Doctor Who

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