On occasion (increasingly rarely these days, but still) I find myself agreeing with Bill Maher, host of a TV show called "Real Time". He’s a comedian, and used to host "Politically Incorrect", a show that was great when it was still on Comedy Central. Anyway, he had a good rant about Pluto where he described astronomers using mock Republican talking points (he called them "cut and run scientists"). A video is posted at Crooks and Liars and is worth a watch! He attacks a lot of the bad thinking that I attack on this blog as well. His language is just a touch salty, but I have to admit– it’s the first Uranus joke I’ve laughed out loud at in many, many years.
About Bad Astronomy
If you went to BadAstronomy.com and found yourself here, never fear: the BA Blog has moved to its new home at Discover Blogs. The original BA site (with the Moon Hoax debunking and all that) is still online, too.
Phil Plait, the creator of Bad Astronomy, is an astronomer, lecturer, and author. After ten years working on Hubble Space Telescope and six more working on astronomy education, he struck out on his own as a writer. He has written two books, dozens of magazine articles, and 12 bazillion blog articles. He is a skeptic, and fights misuses of science as well as praising the wonder of real science.
Contact me: The Bad Astronomer "at" gmail "dot" com
Bad Astronomy is a Wikio Top Blog! Clearly, Wikio has excellent taste. 
Bad Astronomy was chosen as one of Time.com's Best Blogs of 2009. Subscribe to BA using an RSS Feed
Death from the Skies!
Order a copy of Death from the Skies! from Amazon, Barnes and Noble, or Borders.
"If things worked the way I wanted them to, any reporter about to do another 'sensational' story on deadly meteors would consult this volume, and bang! common sense would find its way into the news. How strange would that world be?"
-- Adam Savage, Mythbusters"Reading this book is like getting punched in the face by Carl Sagan. Frightening, but oddly exhilarating."
-- Daniel H. Wilson, author of How to Survive a Robot UprisingSocial/Networking/Cool Stuff
DISCOVERmagazine.com: Latest Articles on Space- Top 100 Stories of 2009: #50: Magnetic Mysteries of Sunspots Decoded
- Top 100 Stories of 2009: #2: NASA Braces for Course Correction
- Top 100 Stories of 2009: #5: Astronomer Alan Dressler
- Top 100 Stories of 2009: #8: Earth-like Worlds Come Into View
- Top 100 Stories of 2009: #16: The Moon: Cold, Wet, and Breathing
- DISCOVER Blogs: The Loom
August 26th, 2006 at 10:30 am
ARE YOU DISSING US REPUBLICANS?!?
August 26th, 2006 at 11:01 am
Bill Maher hits the nail on the head while mocking Republicans in a commentary style not unlike Steven Colbert. Friends and I caught Mahler’s show in Sacramento recently and he’s very much on top of topical events. It was great. I chuckled. It’s ironic too because Maher is mocking people who really do think like that.
August 26th, 2006 at 11:25 am
Politics…… It’s unfair to devide the scientific community because of their political beliefs, politics is just opinion. Science is fact (well, some of it) and if you’re saying that all republican scientists are the “cut and run” type then you’re wrong. That’s over sterotyping, that’s way unfair.
Don’t you think it’s facinating when a disaster happens, like Katrina and Challanger people forget politics for a moment just to come together and help out? That’s why I love science so much, it didn’t matter what your religion, political beliefs, race, gender, ect. Science is science, you can’t change it.
August 26th, 2006 at 11:40 am
I must have accidently slid in from a parallel universe. What people forgot politics after Katrina?
CompRep, the result of Katrina was one of the most horrifically politicized disasters in this nation’s history right up there with 9/11. Did you miss the memes where people thought the gummint blew up the levees? Simple (and typical) As government incompetence was painted with the dark brush of evil conspiracy even in the mainstream media. There were some folks who literally blamed Bush for the *hurricaine* based on some global warming piffle.
And science itself has been politicized since it started. My God, look a the long and hard struggle for the acceptance of plate tectonics. So many major scientific discoveries are historically credited to the wrong people because the real trailblazers dared to express a new idea, and the supposedly open to new ideas scientific orthodoxy delivered the smack down to them and sent them into unpublished, unfunded obscurity.
As for real charity: although I am very anti-religious, I regularly donate old furniture and clothes and whatnot to my local Salvation Army. After Katrina, while United Way and the Red Cross were putting up banners and scheduling photo ops for the media, the SA folks were quietly moving into the New Orleans area before the rain even stopped.
August 26th, 2006 at 11:58 am
“And science itself has been politicized since it started. My God, look a the long and hard struggle for the acceptance of plate tectonics.”
1: I see some BAD GRAMMER in there, you’re not supposed to start a sentence with a conjunction!
2: Where is the politics in plate techtonics?!?
“What people forgot politics after Katrina?” FORGOT?!? Sorry, I ment to say, set aside political ideas. Have you noticed that Bush and Kerry made an organization to help Katrina differences? I don’t care if they did it to make them look good, it was for a good cause. No matter what angle you look at it, Katrina victoms lost their homes, family, and anything else they cared for. We need to help them. Where’s the politics in that?
Does Mars or the Sun or a black hole or even extra terrestrial life even CARE about Politics on Earth? No, no matter what president is in office nothing outside of Earth really gives a dang. The cell that is traveling in your blood stream doesn’t give a dang. No one cares exept the human race. So putting science and politics together seems strange to me.
August 26th, 2006 at 12:21 pm
“1: I see some BAD GRAMMER in there, you’re not supposed to start a sentence with a conjunction!”
Well, I see some terrible GRAMMAR there as well…
August 26th, 2006 at 12:22 pm
I think the commentary refers, not to republican scientists, but to counter scientific/intellectual retorics used by republican politicians. There has been a campaign to paint everyone who argues based on logic and analysis as some kind of far-leftist who can be dissmissed.
Thus they have pushed logic, reason and analysis out of the mainstream and sheilded themselves from _actual_ debate. Only soundbites and talking points remain.
They are tapping in to the large part of the population who feels threatend by the progress of science and engineering, education and even the broading of the “philosophical space” that is happening with the new age thing and in certain cultural settings.
I know who people here feel about the cacophony of religions, philosophies and practises under the new age label, but I have to say it is when all is said and done a sign of progress. **Free thinking is required before one can truly think rationally**, and new age is a sign that people are thinkning freely about their worldview.
So the world is changing and a lot of people don’t want to adapt. They don’t want it to be OK to be gay, to choose your own religion, or learn new things about the nature of nature.
And it is not primarily because of the bible. The bible has happily supported whatever it’s readers says it supports through out the ages. And now they say that the bible is proof that gays are evil, science is wrong and war is good.
The primary reason is fear of change, and the desire to be right at all costs. So they don’t want debates with real arguments, or media with real analysis.
August 26th, 2006 at 2:33 pm
Bill Maher used to be funny… right up until he started talking about how “courageous” the 9/11 attackers were. I can’t fathom how another network could actually gave him a show. What were they thinking?
August 26th, 2006 at 5:12 pm
Ahahaha, everything got clearer now.
It’s a big conspiracy!
That video is gold. Consider it SAVED.
August 26th, 2006 at 6:21 pm
Completely Republican,
Let’s not forget to fast that it is Republicans that seem to be Creationist & Inetelligent Designers AND
We have a Republican Congress and a Republican President that are trying to run Scientists out of government and or MUZZLE them.
And these same Republicans want to ignore the signs of Global Warming.
No, my friend, Politics is just not opinion it is made out of facts and Republicans seem to like to deny lots and lots of facts.
Oh and I forgot to mention Katrina & Rita, in which the governments response (don’t forget these are the same folks who like to talk about downsizing government totally) was HORRIBLE.
And it’s Hurrican Season again too and one Tropical Storm is heading into the Gulf at the moment.
Hurricane’s you know, don’t talk and they don’t care they just start churning and go.
August 26th, 2006 at 7:28 pm
I see that Penn Jilette will be on next week’s show. I might watch that one.
August 26th, 2006 at 9:20 pm
Folks want to blame the Federal Government for the response to Hurricane Katrina. Lets get a few facts straight.
If you are going to blaime anyone for the flooding after a major Hurricaine – Blame the French for building a city below sea level at the mouth of the continents largest river. By the way folks this isn’t the first time that New Orleans has Flooded, with a quick web search for “New Orleans Floods” I was able to find this reference to a flood in 1849 “On May 12, 1849, a flood in New Orleans spread over 160 squares and sub-merged 1,600 buildings” not to mention floods in 1912 & 1913.
For those that can’t come to lay blame on the French considering we (The United States of America) have held title to the land for a little more than 200 years (Napoleon Bonaparte sold the Louisiana Territory to President Thomas Jefferson in 1803) should look at the local governments of New Orleans and the State Of Louisiana for their parts in the Disaster that the Federal Government is shouldering the mass of critism over the aftermath of Katrina. If Gov. Blanco and Mayor Nagen had done their jobs FEMA would have been in position to do its job, remember the separation of powers, unless the States Government asks for assistance then the Federal Goverment is handcuffed until the event has occured. Example, hurricanes Dennis and Ivan wreaked havoc on the Florida Panhandle, but because our Gov. alerted FEMA to the need prior to their respective landfalls response time was hours not days. The officials in Louisiana were negligent in their decisions prior to the landfall of Katrina. Enough of my soapbox on who should be held responsible, everyone “dropped the ball.”
As To “ignore(ing) the signs of Global Warming.” ask paleontologists when the Ice Age actually ended, if my memory serves me correctly when Humankind started to walk on this fair planet of ours we were still technically in the Ice Age, and therefore we are still coming out of an Ice Age wouldn’t that logically equate to Global Warming. Following that same train of thought because of the cyclic nature of Climatology at some point in the future the planet will start to go into another Ice Age with or without Mans help.
August 26th, 2006 at 11:01 pm
“Following that same train of thought because of the cyclic nature of Climatology at some point in the future the planet will start to go into another Ice Age with or without Mans help. ”
Not this wonderful talking point again… the issue with climate change isn’t so much the warming itself but the unprecidented rapidity with which it is occurring.
August 27th, 2006 at 2:39 am
Actually the French sector is the one part of New Oreleans that is above sea level, so you can’t blame the French for that. I wouldn’t take issue with either party but the U.S. Gov’t itself that builds bridges to no where in Alaska while New Orleans had only Category 3 protection. As for the response Bush obviously stacked his cabinet with friends and cronys; the FEMA director and most of the upper echelon had no direct disaster relief assistance. Federal manpower in the form of the military should have been on the ready, no excuse except gross incompetance. I don’t think all republicans are anti-science just the religious right faction and Bush is a true believer. Science is seen as a tool to manipulate to justify policies they want. It would be so much better if we had divided government–less spending more accountability. There’s hope for the Republicans.
As for Maher’s comment mentioned above, it didn’t support the terrorists or their cause one bit. The fact is it does take more courage to be riding on a missile than pushing a button and launching one. No matter what you think of them you have to give them grievous respect for the sincerity of their irrational beliefs. We need to at least know our enemy. That said I didn’t find the (Pluto) bit all that funny.
August 27th, 2006 at 4:04 am
Jeb’s response to hurricanes isn’t that much better. But Florida wasn’t devastated like New Orleans was either. On top of that, he got his funding MUCH faster than Louisiana did. And there are still people in Florida who haven’t had their homes rebuilt or their insurance claims settled.
Oh, and let’s not forget where the Louisiana National Guard was – protecting American’s lives from the imaginary Iraqi invaders – fighting them over there so we don’t have to fight them here. Much better to let our citizens drown.
August 27th, 2006 at 5:40 am
“Politics…… It’s unfair to devide the scientific community because of their political beliefs, politics is just opinion. Science is fact (well, some of it) and if you’re saying that all republican scientists are the “cut and run†type then you’re wrong. That’s over sterotyping, that’s way unfair.”
Firstly, Science is not fact; science is a system by which we obtain knowledge.
Secondly, you’re totally missing the point of Bill Maher’s (in my opinion, quite brilliant) rant. He’s taking the R talking point of calling Democrats “cut and run,” and combining that with the recent R propensity to dismiss science (read Chris Mooney–he makes the argument much better than I can). The result is a mock R rant where he dismisses all scientists as being “cut and run” just like the D’s.
“Science is science, you can’t change it.”
Thirdly, please see my first point. Science is a system, and that system is constantly changing. (I would recomend reading Thomas Kuhn as someone who can explain the process better than me.) Theories are continually being overturned, revamped or tweaked. Even the basic methodology has evolved since the days of Bacon. I wouldn’t be inclined to include the defining of the term “planet” and the subsequent exclusion of Pluto as a real change in science, but then again … what do I know?
August 27th, 2006 at 6:06 am
Interesting Anti-Science post on http://www.dailykos.com/
Science RIP
by DarkSyde
Sun Aug 27, 2006 at 03:04:46 AM PDT
Jon Swift and PZ Myers fisk a neoconservative nutcase, which saves me from having to link directly to the koolaid drinker du jour:
http://jonswift.blogspot.com/2006/08/science-is-dead.html
–Recently there was some controversy when the Bush Administration accidentally left off evolution from a list of subjects eligible for government grants–whoops! But Mark Noonan at Blogs for Bush has an even better suggestion: That we just leave off science altogether. The debate between Evolution and Intelligent Design, he says, “got me thinking, and today ii [sic] occured [sic] to me: science is dead. We have reached the end of the Age of Science.”
I recommend you do not read the actual post on the Blogs for Bush site, unless you’re a masochist. The rant goes on, the comments get worse. The dingbat author’s thesis is that science is ‘dead,’ that in fact science has been ‘dead’ since roughly 1850. Nothing to see here folks, ignore relativity and the atomic bomb, refuse that useless antibiotic and don’t look at that flat-screen . . . . If you don’t like sleeping naked in the dirt and bashing open pig skulls with a stone hand-ax, until you keel over from old age or kidney stones before your fortieth birthday, science is the breath of life. If you want to keep breathing, you might have to vote against the Republicans, or just not vote at all.
August 27th, 2006 at 8:02 am
“Folks want to blame the Federal Government for the response to Hurricane Katrina. Lets get a few facts straight.”
I don’t know where you would lay the blame, maybe its a foolish act to try and pin something like this on any one person or group, but I would like to point out the the Hurricane in New Orleans scenerio had been playing out for years before Katrina. People KNEW that it was going to happen one day and what the effects would be. Stations like the Discovery channel and such were airing documentaries of the possible effects of a major hurricane hitting and how bad it could or would be years before Katrina.
New Orleans itself and all the surrounding areas must shoulder some of that responsibility because it was their own backyard that was on the line for something that people knew would eventually happen.
I wonder how much finger pointing there will be when a major earthquake destroys the west coast, a comet slams into some part of the world or when the super volcano reported to exist in Yellow Stone errupts. These are things that we know about and can see have a real possibility of happening but are being fobbed off as being unrealistic or not cost effective enough to handle right now. Certainly one would look back and think a little more preperation in New Orleans would have been cost effective. But then again, there was alot more coast line than simply New Orleans that saw devestation.
August 27th, 2006 at 8:51 am
As to the responsibility of the Feds in the New Orleans disaster: the levees, dikes and containment systems were designed and built by the U.S. Corps of Engineers.
Their initial designs were criticized before the build; they were criticized during the build, and there has been continued criticism during the 40 or so years since the build. (The rebuilding by the same outfit is also under criticism for being not much better than the system which failed.)
The FEMA team at the time of Katrina was managed by a political appointee with absolutely no experience in disaster management. Since 9/11, the feds have been caught up in a supposed “terror-proofing” of the country which has diverted money (and, by all GAO accounts, wasted money), critical thinking, and manpower away from the more mundane needs of fending off natural disasters, among other things.
Yes, the disaster plans established by the N.O. city council were inadequate, and yes, so were those of the govt. of Louisiana. But the Feds are the folks primarily responsible for dealing with catastrophe on this grand scale, and it is the Feds who must be held responsible for failing to deal adequately with this mess.
August 27th, 2006 at 9:03 am
The nice thing about religion is its absolute certainty that it is right.
The worst thing about religion is its absolute certainty that it is right.
Religion, in the organized sense, is an absolute con. Like Santa Clause, it is fantasy for frightened children and should rightly be outlawed in ANY political system.
Spirituality, on the other hand, is personal and private in its belief system and is principally based upon personal experience.
I am spiritual, but I absolutly detest ALL organized religions as a rip off of the desire of people to believe in something, anything, greater than themselves.
Show me the good that religion has done and I will show you the Inquisition, for which a just god would hold the laity forever responsible.
Damn religion to hell and let the chips fall where they may,,,
GAry 7
PS, Bill Maher rocks!
August 27th, 2006 at 10:08 am
Just found this, otherwise would have posted it earlier:
Eyewitless News: Save Pluto
http://tinyurl.com/llsqb
http://www.worth1000.com/cache/gallery/contestcache.asp?contest_id=11570&display=photoshop
August 27th, 2006 at 11:27 am
The Pluto bit was hilarious.
Completly Republican said:
> Don’t you think it’s facinating when a disaster happens, like Katrina and Challanger people forget politics for a moment just to come together and help out?
I Am The Omega said:
>CompRep, the result of Katrina was one of the most horrifically politicized disasters in this nation’s history right up there with 9/11.
You’re talking about different things. Completely Republican is talking abotu people diving in and helping out their neighbors. You’re talking about the discussion about the governmental response.
Completly Republican said:
>2: Where is the politics in plate techtonics?!?
That’s something of a misdirection. When Plate Tectonics was originally proposed, the scientific community was very skeptical – outright rejectful. How do continents move? But then more data was collected and the evidence amassed, and the theories came along to explain the data. Ergo, Plate Tectonics is now the standard model. There’s no contemporary debate about plate tectonics and it doesn’t figure into the political landscape. But it was very controversial scientifically for a few decades.
>Does Mars or the Sun or a black hole or even extra terrestrial life even CARE about Politics on Earth? No, no matter what president is in office nothing outside of Earth really gives a dang. The cell that is traveling in your blood stream doesn’t give a dang. No one cares exept the human race. So putting science and politics together seems strange to me.
Science is about studying the world and trying to understand it. Naturally, there are things about the world about which people have developed strong interests and opinions. Those opinions play out in politics. When science affects what you know about something you believe, the results get messy. People carry their opinions and beliefs into politics, so they have to carry the science that explains or confronts them into politics as well.
Ed Minchau said:
>Bill Maher used to be funny… right up until he started talking about how “courageous†the 9/11 attackers were. I can’t fathom how another network could actually gave him a show. What were they thinking?
That one statement didn’t make him stop being funny. You may not have liked that statement, and may not care for his opinions any more, but that doesn’t mean he lost the funny ability. As for the comment, it is accurate. You can’t call someone a coward for going to certain death to promote/defend their cause. There are a lot of other bad traits, but cowardace is not one of them.
Maher is opinionated, and he isn’t afraid to express those opinions. Opinionated people are often controversial. Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Howard Stern, etc. Being controversial doesn’t mean you have anything valid to say. It doesn’t mean you’re not a flaming idiot. But it does get ratings. And TV is ultimately about ratings, because that’s advertising dollars, i.e. money in their pockets. So people get pissed and want to hate him and have to listen to him to see the next idiotic thing he’s going to say. Ka-ching!
August 27th, 2006 at 11:34 am
CompRep:
1. God hates grammar Nazis, especially on informal message boards. *AND* they make Baby Jesus cry.
2. Pick up a history book, preferably one about geology.
If you think there’s no politics in science, seriously, you must be living in a sealed, underground bunker. Yes, cells and black hole don’t care. Unfortunately, there’s all these humans involved, and *they* care.
August 27th, 2006 at 1:28 pm
The real problem with Hurricanes is not the Hurricane itself but the very simple fact that:
Cities are built near bodies of water and sometimes they are at sea level or under so they can flood.
August 27th, 2006 at 1:32 pm
Simple guy…
Thanks …
These are Priceless!
August 27th, 2006 at 4:23 pm
Black holes have feelings too.
August 27th, 2006 at 9:15 pm
“If you think there’s no politics in science, seriously, you must be living in a sealed, underground bunker. Yes, cells and black hole don’t care. Unfortunately, there’s all these humans involved, and *they* care”
If you think politics influences the way the moon orbits around the sun, seriously, you must be a retard. I’m saying that no matter what a person’s opinion on the way the sun works, the sun will always worked the way it always has. No opinion can change that.
August 28th, 2006 at 1:12 am
black holes have no hair!
August 28th, 2006 at 2:12 am
“If you think politics influences the way the moon orbits around the sun, seriously, you must be a retard. I’m saying that no matter what a person’s opinion on the way the sun works, the sun will always worked the way it always has. No opinion can change that.”
However, Americans are going to the point where Bush says: “The Sun is a huge campfire in the sky and all who think it’s thermonucular [sic] reaction are enemies of the state.” If you think this kind of statement doesn’t mean anything, try to read George Orwell’s “1984″.
August 28th, 2006 at 4:37 am
1 caution about Bill Maher: I believe he’s drunken the thimerosal/autism Kool-Aid.
August 28th, 2006 at 9:46 am
I Am The Omega, Completly Republican, you’re both talking past each other. Take a deep breath and read what the other person actually wrote, not your preconception of what they wrote.
Omega, CR is saying the universe is what it is, politics doesn’t change the universe. Duh.
CR, Omega is talking about the process of science and how scientists themselves come to consensus on the research. The internal workings of the science community is laden with its own form of politics. It’s not the politics of White vs. Black, Rich vs. Poor, Republican vs. Democrat, etc. Rather, its the politics of “my idea is superior to yours”, “my team actually discovered this, not yours”, “you couldn’t possibly be right because that would make me wrong,” etc.
And both of you, you’re treading the line on acceptable behavior here. Name calling will not be allowed. The BA has banned people before and will ban people in the future. If you don’t wish to be the next banned person, watch your attitude and your words. We all want this place to be a civil discussion. Help keep it that way, starting with yourself.
August 28th, 2006 at 10:14 am
While I don’t want to get into the little war going on above, I will say that as a science geek who also tends to vote Republican and Libertarian (in my heart I’m a Libertarian, but so few of their candidates have a hope in Heck of getting into office), it would be nice to be able to be a science geek and not get ridiculed for political beliefs. Maybe that’s just me, though…
August 28th, 2006 at 11:58 am
Kevin,
Agreed. Not only Am I a conservative Libertarian, but I’m a Christian too. I get blasted all the time for either “my” politics or “my” religion, without people actually understanding what I believe.
August 28th, 2006 at 12:55 pm
Stephen Coulbert proposes a mnemonic: “My Very Educated Mother Just Served… Uh-oh Not Pluto”.
August 29th, 2006 at 3:39 am
”If you think politics influences the way the moon orbits around the sun, seriously, you must be a retard. I’m saying that no matter what a person’s opinion on the way the sun works, the sun will always worked the way it always has. No opinion can change that. ”
-But George Bush has the ear of the Almighty… are you saying God couldn’t change the orbit of the moon if He wanted to? HERETIC!!!!
Interesting so many people describe themselves as ‘conservative’ I’m in scotland, a country so far to left that were we independant from the rest of the UK, we would be classed as a communist country.
Now over here, a conservative attitude is ‘YOU WANT TO SELL OFF MY DEVISION TO THE HIGHEST BIDDER????? SOME MONEY GRABBING THUG WHO WILL LAY OFF HALF THE STAFF, THEN DO A **** JOB????’
or possibly
‘YOU WANT TO TAKE AWAY MY LIFELONG RIGHT TO FREE HEALTHCARE???? I VOTED FOR YOU, YOU TRAITOR!!!!!!’
facinating, isn’t it?
August 29th, 2006 at 9:14 am
“Black holes have no hair”
said PK but :
“Blacjk holes have feelings too.”
noted CafeenMan.
Thus don’t mention their baldness to a black hole for they’re sensitive about it and end up in deep black depression forever after!
AS for Global warming -or tobe technical anthropocenric greenhopus effect -its real as evolution is in thescientific consensus -most of the world is keen tostart doing something about it except for a few sad hold-outs who like Canute are trying to hold back the tide of reality with the rubbish of rhetoric.
The above description also neatly summarise the US Republicans as far as I can see. Eg. Denying evolution, covering their ears to the discoveries being made by the scientific method such as global warming, the cuts to NASA, the politicising of reprts eg. Big Bang “_theory_” decree, and so forth as the BA’s discussed here so often.
Come on, if its not clear by now that the right wing – correction Extreme Ultra-Right Wing (the US has only right-wing & EURW
as known by the rest of world politics – maybe you haven’t noticed it but its true!) – is anti-science then well itnever will be .. & the BA and others on this list are just banging heads against brick walls which I hope isn’t true.
As for global warming causing or worsening hurricanes it hardly takes
genius to note that heat = energy thus more heat =more energy, that
hurricanes gain strength from passing over hotter water, that we’re making more hot water & then oh yeah, isn’t it funny how last huricane season we had more frequent and more damaging hurricanes than ever before…
Co-incidence??
I don’t think so & I don’t think its reasonable not to put 2 +2 together and NOT get 4.
August 29th, 2006 at 9:19 am
“Black holes have no hair”
said PK but :
“Black holes have feelings too.”
noted CafeenMan.
Thus don’t mention their baldness to a black hole for they’re sensitive about it and end up in deep black depression forever after!
As for Global warming – or to be technical the Anthropocentric greenhouse effect – its real as evolution is in the scientific consensus. Most of the world is keen to start doing something about it except for a few sad hold-outs who like Canute are trying to hold back the tide of reality with the rubbish of ostrich headed rhetoric.
The above description also neatly summarise the US Republicans as far as I can see. Eg. Denying evolution, covering their ears to the discoveries being made by the scientific method such as global warming, the cuts to NASA, the politicising of reprts eg. Big Bang “_theory_” decree, and so forth as the BA’s discussed here so often.
Come on, if its not clear by now that the right wing – correction Extreme Ultra-Right Wing (the US has only right-wing & EURW as known by the rest of world politics – maybe you haven’t noticed it but its true!) – is anti-science then well it never will be ..
.. & the BA and others on this list are just banging heads against brick walls which I hope isn’t true.
As for global warming causing or worsening hurricanes it hardly takes
genius to note that heat = energy thus more heat =more energy, that
hurricanes gain strength from passing over hotter water, that we’re making more hot water & then oh yeah, isn’t it funny how last hurricane season we had more frequent and more damaging hurricanes than ever before…
Co-incidence??
I don’t think so & I don’t think its reasonable not to put 2 +2 together and NOT get 4.
Finally regarding Tom O’Reilly’s comment for the mnemonic :
“My Very EducatedMother Just Seved Nachos.”
makes an ideal replacement.
I can’t take credit for it tho’ – heard a scientist whose name I missed or forget tell that one on the news.
PS. Hope this isn’t a repeat posting, computer stuffing me around as per usual. Sigh.
Tryingagain coz’ not working -hope itfinallyegts through on this attempt … :-~
August 29th, 2006 at 9:24 am
Err … Sorry about that. Would someone please kindly delete the first (less edited, less added) post. Hate it when this happens : it wasn’t coming up >I got an error page > I tried again > & there we go ..
Computers – can’t live with ‘em
– Can’t kill ‘em
(To misquote from ‘True Lies.’)
August 29th, 2006 at 10:10 am
Must edeit before I post some day ..
Also must learn how to bold things someday too ..
Aerimus : you describe yourself as ‘conservative Libertarian’ & ‘Christian’ & say people don’t understand what you beleive and attack you for it…
I can’t say I’m surprised – although I don’t mean to make this a personal attack – its just not that puzzling and I’m puzzled by your comment. Sorry but I’m not sure what you believe or why you feel aggreived and Ion’t understand what your beliefs are -and I’ll admit it.
I’m not sure about Libertarian conservative (or vice-versa) but to me, itsounds like an oxymoron. You see ‘conservative’ implies status quo, opposing changing values and understandings example : “tradit’l family values -> not accepting single parents or abortion or co-habitationbefroe marriage, et all ..
Whereas ‘Libertarian’, to my perhaps flawed understanding stresses individuals _liberty_ to choose for themselves : ie. women can choose tohave abortions, move in before marriage, raise kids on their lonesome etc …
Do you see why I find a contradiction there? Am I totally misreading your views? If so, can you see where I’m going wrong?
Now for “Christian” – okay this is a sience-based site / list and science versus the more fundamentalist or literalist types of Christian thinking clash often. There are manysorts of Christian withmany varying interpretations, denominations, splinter-groups , opinions & strongly belived pieces of dogma generally. Are you Catholic, Anglican, protestant, Presbyterian, Armenian Orthodiox, Russian Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, Scientologist, Moonie, Rastafarian (are they counted as Christian?) ad infinitum – well nearly to theoutside view anyhow.
I was, many years ago, a lay member of the Uniting Church in a breif religious phase. My view of what is Christian is sort of shaped by that, sort of shaped by the media and other peoples views, sort of shaped by a whole lot of things – from satires like the ‘Simpsons’ and ‘South park’ through reading Bertrand Russelll and philosophy texts atuni and discussing things in general with friends some Christian, some atheist, many like me, agnostic … Ie. we admit we don’t really know all the answers.
Now I do hate theway some “Christian” individuals and groups try toimpose theirebelifs on everyone else. If that’s what you advocate we have a strong area of disagreement – if say, you believe anyone that doesn’t follow exactly what you say will burn in hell & that because God told us so in the Bible the Sun goes round the Earth not vice-versa and everything in the cosmos is just a few thousands of years old again based only on God said so in our Bible then, yeah I’m a little cheesed off at that view because itstrike sme as arrogant, baseless, and well, plain wrong and unwilling to think reasonably.
But, I know, this may be a total misrepresentation of what you mean by “Christian.” In fact, I really hope it is because then we can talk about thinghs like rational individuals which doesn’t exclude faith but doesn’t make it the only or at least main justification for everything either.
I hope you appreciate though that some people do see the term “Christian” as loaded and meaning that unreasonable fundamentalist thought just as for some theterm Muslim equals terrorist or the term Jew conjures upmental images of some a cabal of evil skullcap wearing,sidebearded and full beared black-clad moneychangers.
Stereotypes and generalisations? Absolutely. That’s the problem. Sad thing is people tend to think that way Say “scientist” and some will be picture a mad Frankenstein in a white coat plotting to blow up the world or others a hero of Western enlightenment like Galileo. Say “Christian” and some willpicture Mother Teresa but others will picture thepanish Inqiuition or JerryFalwell blaming 9/11 “on liberals, feminist and gays.”
Me, all I know is what you’ve said in your post and I’m keeping an open mind – or trying to as I hope others also attempt to do. I can’t avoid having the odd stereotype in my head – but I can be aware of them whether good or ill and try to keep that in mind.
I doubt everyone on this list has or would attack you for your views.
I’d expect some would share them on at leasts some issues.
I’sd expect others would disagree tovarying strengthsand intensities.
Plus I expect a lot here don’t understand what you think or overly care except in relation to whatever posts you’ve left – & I’m one of them.
A persecution complex in general for everyone doesn’t mean that person isn’t being persecuted – or that they are.
There’s not much you can do about what other people think of you except talk with them and thereby either correct or worsen your impression to their eyes.
The only person you have any real control over is yourself .. & sometimes not even them!
August 29th, 2006 at 10:24 am
ARRRGHHHH! The typos! The lack of spacing. Mea culpa.
Sorry, I’m tired and writing as I reflect.. & editing,where I have, has somehow made it worse & I can’t edit here so its left as writ.
Hope you can still follow my post above enough to get the idea of what I’m saying & meaning.
BTW. No offence intended to anyone anywhere there so please nobody take any – just me, half-asleep, musing and typing – & not necessarily in that order.
& sorry y’all if that posts too long I do tend to ramble in fact …. zzzz
September 5th, 2006 at 11:26 am
In the 20th Century “science” education became pure politics and indoctrination into leftarded dummycrat lysenkoism.