AAS Report #2: Dark matter and large scale structure

By Phil Plait | January 7, 2007 5:37 pm

A note: I am attending a meeting of the American Astronomical Society in Seattle. I will blog as much as I can from this meeting, as there is a LOT of news coming out, as well as lots of fun and wonderful scientific geekiness. This particular blog entry is a bit long as I have to explain some relatively complex things to get to the point. I think most of my reporting will be somewhat less wordy. But no promises! I love this stuff, and I love to talk about it.

Today, astronomers released news about the largest and most detailed survey of the deep Universe ever made. It used telescopes in space and on the ground to make a huge census of matter across the Universe, from local regions out to a distance of about 6 billion light years. It’s called COSMOS, for the Cosmic Evolution Survey, the telescopes involved were Hubble, XMM-Newton, Spitzer, Keck, the Very Large Telescope in Chile, the Very Large (radio telescope) Array in New Mexico, and the Subaru observatory. It involved over 100 scientists from more than a dozen countries.

This survey is incredible: it mapped the location of more than two million galaxies over an area two degrees on a side on the sky– bigger than 16 full Moons. In the end, astronomers made what is essentially a three-dimensional large-scale map of normal matter (the stuff that makes up you, me, doorknobs, snakes, planes, everything we can see and touch).

Here’s a (very) small piece of the survey image from Hubble:

Click on it for a much higher-resolution version. It’s very pretty.

Amazingly, the map of galaxies made is not the most interesting part of this survey. What makes COSMOS unique is that using sophisticated techniques, the astronomers were also able to map out the location of dark matter as well! This is the stuff that makes up the vast majority of matter in the Universe, but which we cannot detect directly. It’s been known to exist for decades — it was first postulated in 1933 — but the evidence has been indirect. Dark matter still has gravity, and so we see it through its effects — galaxies surrounded by dark matter halos rotate differently than they would without them, and dark matter in clusters of galaxies reveals itself through the motion of those cluster members.

But a trick of relativity winds up betraying the presence of dark matter, too. As Einstein postulated, matter bends space, the way a heavy weight in a bed will warp the mattress. Light traveling though empty space will move in a straight line, but if matter is warping space, light will travel along the bent space as well. Imagine light from a distant galaxy is on its way to us. But between this galaxy and us is some large mass, like a clump of dark matter. The light from the galaxy will bend around the matter, and when it gets to us it will be slightly distorted, just as if the light has passed through a lens. This process, in fact, is called gravitational lensing (for more about this, see my writeup about the Bullet Cluster, image #4 in my Top 10 Images of 2006).

So astronomers can map out the location of dark matter by very carefully taking observations of large areas of the sky and painstakingly teasing out the distortions in the shapes of background galaxies. The observations need to be done from space because the background objects are faint, small, and very close together. Space-based telescopes can more easily see fainter objects than ground-based ‘scopes, and have better resolution– they can separate closely spaced objects better. That’s why Hubble was used for this survey. In fact, the survey was massive: it took 10% of Hubble’s time over two years. It’s the biggest single project ever done by Hubble.

But Hubble has limitations. To get the dark matter location, the distances to many thousands of galaxies had to be found. This was done from the ground, using the Very Large Telescope and the Subaru Observatory, using a technique called photometric redshift. Basically, the galaxies were observed through many different color filters, and the brightness of a given galaxy in each filter can be used to determine its distance.

Armed with the distortion to the galaxies’ shapes and their distances, astronomers began to map out the location the dark matter.

Let me pause for just a second here– we’ve known about dark matter for a long time, but the problem is, the dang stuff is dark. It’s hard to see. People have been arguing over whether it even exists, yet now, not only do we know it’s there, we know where it is! This is an amazing advance.

There is one very big result you can see just by glancing at the observations:

The left image, in red, shows the location of normal matter on the sky. The right image, in blue, is where the dark matter sits. They match! It’s been theorized for some time that as the Universe cooled after the Big Bang, dark matter formed long filaments many millions of light years across. As that happened, normal matter would be attracted to it gravitationally. Today, the normal matter should trace the location of the dark matter. Now we can see this is true!

But it gets better. Because astronomers were able to see dark and normal matter at very large distances, they were able to track how the stuff changes over time. That’s because the farther away we look, the farther back in time we see — we see an object a million light years away as it was a million years ago. So by looking back far enough, you can actually see how stuff behaved in the distant past, billions of years ago.

And things have changed! Perhaps the most important thing astronomers saw in their data is that dark matter was smoothly distributed at times early in the Universe, and became clumpier as time wore on. They created an image to show this. It’s a 3D map of the dark matter:

You can think of the left hand side of the image being dark matter that is nearby, and the right side being farther away. But remember, distance=time. You can see that dark matter now (on the left) is clumpy, whereas dark matter was smoother a long time ago (on the right). Again, that is just what models predict. Over time, the smooth distribution of the matter in the Universe became lumpy as small ripples in the matter were amplified by gravity. In other words, any place where there was a little more matter had more gravity, and attracted even more matter. This process continued, until after billions of years we got our current Universe: clumpy, lumpy, and full of wonderful galaxies, stars, and planets.

The COSMOS survey data is incredibly rich, and will be mined for information for years to come. I have only touched on what was learned from it so far, and there is much more scientific knowledge lurking within it. And even now, astronomers are planning even more ambitious surveys of much larger areas of the sky. These surveys will refine the data taken already, and will also start to tackle dark energy, the mysterious force that appears to be accelerating the expansion of the Universe. We know even less about that than we do about dark matter.

As usual, the more we know, the more there is to know. There’s still so much to learn!


Comments (72)

  1. j jonah jansen

    Great post, BA! You have the gift of being able to convey complex information and concepts in a way that the layman (such as myself) can understand. You are a true teacher and that’s about the highest compliment I know how to give.
    PS; unlike some posters, I also love your more rant oriented posts. It’s all good, and always lots of fun. 😉

  2. labtechpete

    Why isn’t it ‘bright yellow with purple spot matter’? That would make life easier! :)

  3. j jonah jansen

    Oh, and, um… am I right in inferring from the time stamp on your post that you haven’t reset your website to PST from daylight savings? Perhaps a switch to UT is in order? 😉

  4. Tom Epps

    Mind–and Universe–Expanding Stuff, Phil. Keep it coming!

    Tom Epps
    USNS Arctic
    Persian Gulf

  5. Dr. BA, have you Seen this from CNN about the AAS?

    Talk about sensationalizing a headline!

    Sounds to me like Dr. Schulze-Makuch’s paper at the meeting said something to the effect of “life on Mars may have developed based on Hydrogen Peroxide, and if it did, the Viking Landers wouldn’t have noticed it, and if they happened to scoop some up in their experiments, they would have killed it with the experiments they used.”

    Of course, CNN’s headline reads

    Scientist: NASA found life on Mars — and killed it

    Did you get to hear the presentation? What’s your take on it?

    (Notice I dutifully checked here before posting on it this time! :) )

  6. Wow, the 3D image really brings it home how the dark matter clumped up over time. That’s a really big advance to actually see where the dark matter is, and how it evolved just as the models predicted.

    Very very cool.

  7. KingNor

    i didn’t see this coming at all. i was under the impression dark matter was such a distant mystery we’d be decades away from something like this.

  8. GREAT Post!!!! As always thanks for sharing your great insight and knowledge!!!

  9. Irishman

    EGADS, JanieBelle, that is a pretty bad hack by the headline writer. Headline writers suck.

    Phil, most of your article is pretty good, but one part confused me.

    This survey is incredible: it mapped the location of more than two million galaxies over an area two degrees on a side on the sky– bigger than 16 full Moons.

    I don’t understand what this means. I get you’re trying to reference a square 2 degrees on a side, making it have an area greater than 16 full moons, but I don’t get how that fits into the mapping the whole sky.

  10. Gary Ansorge

    So now all we have to do is figure out what the dark matter characteristics are. I think particle physicists are the next ones up to bat on this subject. Wonder if the big accelerators will provide any insight into these qualities? We’re pretty certain it’s not neutrinos so what the heck IS it?
    Ah, the mystery continues,,,maybe the butler did the dirty deed,,,in the pantry,,,

    GAry 7

  11. Squatch

    I couldn’t agree more with j jonah jansen!
    This stuff is why I’m here. I’m reading this during my lunch and the photos coupled with the verbal imagery are breathtaking, literally. The wonder of it all has left me lightheaded.

    Keep it up Phil!

  12. Tim G

    How dense can dark matter get?

    Ten to the power of negative fifteen grams per cubic meter is more than enough to have effects on large-scale structures in the universe.

  13. skeptigirl

    Makes you wonder if we’ll find anything in the future which doesn’t interact with waves/particles of the electromagnetic spectrum or gravity.

  14. icemith

    Maybe it is at the other end of the scale , so to speak, but where does it leave ‘Black Holes’? How do they fit into the overall scheme of things?

    Just thought I’d ask.


  15. Balstrome

    Ok, Dark matter… there’s lots of it… so how much does one Kg of Dm go for, what can we use it for, is it measured in pounds, metres or what. All I ever hear is you brainy guys saying there is a lot of it and you dont know much about it. Is this a goverment coverup ?

  16. Flak

    I don’t know where I head my head buried for the last few years but I didn’t even ralize the existance of dark matter had been confirmed before BA’s (very cool) top ten photo’s of 2006 post a bit back. And the more that’s posted about it the more mind blowing it gets. Dark matter effects normal matter gravitationally but in no other apparent way? That’s amazing. I wonder if it effects us in other ways we just don’t understand yet. And to the previous poster who wonders what particle physicists will do with it I ask: How the heck do we ever get our (proverbial) hands on any of it? To my knowledge particle accelerators haven’t ever produced anything nearly like this. Or even hints of it. I suppose I’ll keep reading and discover more, as we all do. Great post BA.

  17. PK

    Ivan, as I understand it the current (largely experimentally verified) model of baryogenesis in the universe puts a limit on the maximum amount of normal matter (protons, electrons, neutrons, etc.), and this amount is less than all the matter in the universe. Since black holes are almost certainly formed by ordinary matter, they cannot account for the missing (non-luminous) matter.

  18. Oldfart

    I beg to differ with you Flak. The existence of Dark Matter has NOT been confirmed! Only the existence of unexplained gravitational fluctuations has been confirmed. I have yet to see anyone create, generate, capture or otherwise prove it’s existence.

    The word ‘Virus’ was coined long ago to explain diseases for which there was no bacteriological explanation. Few believed in the existence of viruses UNTIL SOMEONE WAS ABLE TO POINT AT ONE! Dark Matter, Dark Energy and the recently “discovered” Dark Force are all the Viruses of Physics.

    All I want to know is will one of them allow me to exceed the speed of light? If not, they are useless……lol.

  19. Bee

    I have a question about the analysis that might sound a bit weird, but it’s been puzzling me. How do they set a ‘zero’ to the distortions? I mean, they can find out delta rho, but how do they set rho = 0? Do they just define the minimum of rho to be zero? I’ll give you an analogy: take a plane slice of glass. It doesn’t cause any lensing, but the density isn’t zero. How do they get rid of this normalization? Also, a void in a non-zero density ( negative delta rho) acts as a diffraction lens, no? Do you know if anything like this is observed? Best,


  20. Bill Nettles

    Trying to understand dark matter:
    It is said to have gravitational “mass” because that’s how it acts, but we don’t know its “composition,” i.e., whether there are elements or particles that we commonly talk about. And that’s why it’s dark, right? So we have an invisible gravity generator.

    But does it have inertial mass? Are there frequencies of em radiation that it absorbs? Does it have collisions with normal matter?

    These may be elementary questions that have been answered, but I didn’t want to assume that. All that I’ve heard is that “dark matter exists.” That’s not a very satisfying statement without a definition of dark matter in terms of how it’s different from regular matter (if it is).

    The technology and science to produce that “map” sound wonderful!

  21. Hey Phil – there’s a video on Youtube now showing the images from the Skepdude calendar. I just wanted to say – your picture? Made of 100% pure awesome. :-)

    Hope you’re having fun!

  22. If dark matter exists, and that existence can be shown as this research seems to indicate, then I would think the next step would be to try and gather/make some, yes?

  23. Bee

    Hi Bill,

    But does it have inertial mass

    one of the best dark matter candidates are WIMP’s – weakly interacting MASSIVE particles…

    Hi Squid,

    then I would think the next step would be to try and gather/make some,

    indeed, depending on what dark matter is, it might show up at the LHC, or alternatively there are experiments under consideration which would be able to detect dark matter directly even though it’s only extremely weakly interacting.

    For more infor see also my post Dark Matter and references therein (don’t miss the comments).



  24. Does this mean that there are sub-atomic dark quarks?

  25. skeptigirl

    Oldfart Says: …The existence of Dark Matter has NOT been confirmed! Only the existence of unexplained gravitational fluctuations has been confirmed. I have yet to see anyone create, generate, capture or otherwise prove it’s existence.

    The word ‘Virus’ was coined long ago to explain diseases for which there was no bacteriological explanation. Few believed in the existence of viruses UNTIL SOMEONE WAS ABLE TO POINT AT ONE! Dark Matter, Dark Energy and the recently “discovered” Dark Force are all the Viruses of Physics.

    Before viruses were visualized with the electron microscope we could ‘prove’ the existence of an infectious agent which was not visible with the optic limits of the time. We did this by showing the unseen ‘thing’ caused infection. It could be recovered and passed on again and again with each subsequent exposed organism becoming infected. Immunity could also be confirmed.

    We have confirmed the existence of matter in space by its emissions of electromagnetic radiation along the entire spectrum. How do you know a gamma ray burst represents something occurring with normal matter? Maybe the bursts come from something which if observed after the burst, was no longer visible with any detection device?

    So with that, here are 2 comments about your comments.

    We accept as proof many kinds of evidence besides touching and seeing.

    And, something exists we have evidence of but don’t know much about the nature of it. We have labeled it dark matter. Who cares if when we do discover the nature of it it turns out to be even odder than first thought? Maybe we will re-name it dark ether instead of dark matter. But the gravitational anomaly as you correctly call it is still evidence something we have labeled dark matter is in that spot.

    It’s there, it exists. Prior to using gravitational lensing, the existence of dark matter was only theoretical based on the physics calculations which said there was not enough visible matter in the Universe for the calculations to be correct. Rather than an anomaly, it was still possible the math was wrong and gravity was the thing which was not as believed.

    In other words, we can see something, we have labeled it dark matter, it isn’t Newton who was wrong. We have established dark matter exists, whether it turns out to be matter or an anomaly as you label it.

    Feel free to correct my understanding of things here. I am not a physicist.

  26. skeptigirl

    And I would add, gravitational lensing does indeed ‘see’ things otherwise invisible. It would be like back-lighting an object and revealing its outline. If you accept infrared detection devices ‘see’ things, why be so reluctant to accept gravitational detection is evidence as well?

  27. bad Jim

    Pah. Dark matter is just bent space. Leave enough ordinary mass in one place long enough and space/time can be permanently warped. A black hole can actually put a kink in it. There’s a certain amount of hysteresis.

    Space is clumpy because it’s dented.

  28. That’s pretty slick… but… why does the term “phlogiston” come to mind every time I hear about dark matter?

  29. bad Jim

    It’s also interesting that the physicists aren’t falling over themselves in a rush to tell us what dark matter is. [There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy]

    Higgs bosons may prove snooty, less elusive than reclusive, preferring the exclusive company of their own kind and disdaining interactions with lesser particles. Might there even be elder, heavier, haughtier such?

  30. “Pah. Dark matter is just bent space. Leave enough ordinary mass in one place long enough and space/time can be permanently warped. A black hole can actually put a kink in it. There’s a certain amount of hysteresis.

    Space is clumpy because it’s dented. ”

    Could you elaborate on these statements? How does the space get permanently warped and how do you prove such an assumption?

    “Let me pause for just a second here– we’ve known about dark matter for a long time, but the problem is, the dang stuff is dark.”

    Dark matter is not dark, Phil, it’s transparent. Despite that, it was a great read, thank you a lot!

  31. Dave Kary

    Until recently the best alternative to “dark matter” has been something called “modified Newtonian gravity”. The basic idea behind it is that on very large distance scales the inverse square law that describes the gravitational force (both in Newton’s and Einstein’s gravity models) changes slightly. The last I head about it this modified gravity law worked pretty well in a classical situation but had not been made consistant with relativity.

    However, with this level of detailed mapping of dark matter locations, I wonder if modified gravity laws would still be consistant with the observations, or can we give up on that one completely now? Anybody up on the latest literature on this?

  32. Balstrome Says: “Ok, Dark matter… there’s lots of it… so how much does one Kg of Dm go for, what can we use it for, is it measured in pounds, metres or what. All I ever hear is you brainy guys saying there is a lot of it and you dont know much about it. Is this a goverment coverup ?”

    Obviously the fault of the Bush administration…

  33. Flak Says: “Dark matter effects normal matter gravitationally but in no other apparent way? I wonder if it effects us in other ways we just don’t understand yet.”

    Yes, it surrounds you with “cosmic energy” and affects your very personality. Soon people will be able to predict the events in your life by deterimining the position of the dark matter in the sky. They’ll have daily predictions for you every day on the comics page.

    – Jack

  34. Carnifex Says: “‘Leave enough ordinary mass in one place long enough and space/time can be permanently warped. A black hole can actually put a kink in it. Space is clumpy because it’s dented.’

    Could you elaborate on these statements? How does the space get permanently warped and how do you prove such an assumption?”

    I believe it was a joke, just like my last post.

    – Jack

  35. Good one Phil! I linked to your explanation from my blog; ya done good!

  36. skeptigirl

    I think Carnifex had a reasonable statement that there was room for doubt about dark invisible matter being proved. I think with all the additional data and the gravitational lensing, I’m going to go with the evidence it is there and does exist. But the dented space hypothesis is a reminder there may be other explanations not yet thought of.

    Invisible matter isn’t correct either. Unless you take the literal definition cannot be actually seen. If we make a false color image of the gravitational evidence we can see the dark matter just as we can see a false color image of incoming electromagnetic data outside the visible range.

  37. skeptigirl

    It’s dark because it doesn’t interact with light.

  38. Rob

    Dave – the recent TeVeS theory extends MOND to be relativistic, and I’d think (although it’s not my field) that the DM tracing the light would make explaining it with MOND-type theories easier. Far harder is where the mass and the light don’t go together (see past BA blogs for the example, whose name escapes me) – but the MOND proponents claim that this can be explained with neutrinos (an ‘allowed’ DM in that theory) rather than needing CDM, so the alternatives to DM are still alive.

    Talking of alternative theories, has anyone in Seattle talked to the guy with the ‘alternative theory vs Big Bang’ stand? in the middle of the main hall?

  39. bad Jim

    The jape about bent space was mine. It’s really not that much different than saying there’s a bunch of unobservable massive stuff out there, since (at least in the traditional theory) gravity is equivalent to the warping of space.

    To attribute memory or hysteresis to space itself would, I suspect, also impute mass, thus begging the question. It’s really an ether hypothesis, where the ether is something like taffy.

    In contrast, dark energy (to my limited understanding) could be just a coefficient in the gravity equation, Einstein’s cosmological constant.

  40. bad Jim

    There’s also the issue of where all the antimatter went. According to scripture, matter and antimatter should initially have been created in equal proportion, yet in the observable universe antimatter is essentially absent. Perhaps, rather than being immediately eliminated moments after the creation of the universe, the antimatter collapsed into innumerable small black holes. (This, though it might explain the abundance of dark matter, wouldn’t explain its shyness.)

    How do we really know that the next galaxy over isn’t antimatter, though?

  41. Bee

    How do we really know that the next galaxy over isn’t antimatter, though?

    I guess we’d see annihilation effects around it. Even the space between galaxies isn’t empty.

  42. The MOND theory was developed so that it would conform to the Tully Fisher law which says that the total luminosity of a galaxy is proportional to its highest orbital velocity.

    We cannot believe that the Tully Fisher law “says what it says it means”. We have to believe that mass has some inherent yet-to-be described property that transmits itself through a vacuum and attracts neighboring mass or warps space.

    The light pressure studies tell us that light is repulsive not attractive as implied by the Tully Fisher law. Guess what I have performed numerous experiments that indicate that the “radial spreading of infrared luminosity” is attractive. I can get as much as 10% increase in weight with a hot plate heating element attached to a convex-up colander.

    Furthermore, my luminosity-based gravity theory provides a “close to experience” explanation for the higher-than-expected rotation curves of galaxies which make the dark matter “superfluous” (in the immortal single word of Einstein who came up with a theory that did away with the “luminiferous ether” by making the results of the speed of light studies mean what they said they meant).

  43. Dave M.

    “Balstrome Says: “Ok, Dark matter… there’s lots of it… so how much does one Kg of Dm go for, what can we use it for, is it measured in pounds, metres or what. All I ever hear is you brainy guys saying there is a lot of it and you dont know much about it. Is this a goverment coverup ?”

    Jack Hagerty says..”Obviously the fault of the Bush administration.”

    Give these posters time, they’ll figure out a convoluted way and use mental gymnastics to assign blame to Bush. Seemingly everything that is wrong with the world is Bush’s fault, dontcha know!

    Meanwhile, over a thousand surveys went out and only 10% came back with stated acknowledged pressure from Bush’s administration officials. You would think that if the pressure was so pervasive, there would be a response rate of a lot more than 17%! But, alas, only 60% of the lowly 17% responders said that there was.

    This is all that it took for the BA minions to pounce on Bush. They came to this conclusion with a total lack of due diligence because it must be evaluated on a relative basis, not an absolute one. How does this 10% compare to prior administrations? There is seemingly no data on that, so one can not make a reasonable conclusion. But, never fear, illogical Bush bashers are here and damn anything relative.

  44. Just curious. Have you ever heard any good arguments why dark matter cannot be plain old cold plasma, gas, dust, etc. that has not managed to condense into self gravitating accumulations?

  45. Lance Knoechel

    Being only a layman with an interest in the subject, I’m not even sure how to present an idea on dark matter that I’ve had for a very long time. But in a nutshell:

    Dark matter is merely anti-matter. As anti-matter, it creates anti-gravity and other forms of anti-energy. It seems that an anti-matter universe exists in a commingled way with our material universe. There are anti-stars, anti-planets, anti-galaxies, even anti-light. The reason we cannot see the ‘dark matter’ is because gravity and anti-gravity will ‘push’ against each other as opposed to ‘pull’. Even anti-light approaching earth would be pushed away by the gravity of our galaxy, sun, earth and even individual atoms. Even if some form of anti-radiation were to reach our region of matter and actually come into full contact, it would be annihilated. The meeting of matter/energy and anti-matter/anti-energy would simply cancel each out of existence. This is largely avoided due to the repulsion of the two opposing forms of matter.

    The idea of anti-matter and, therefore, anti-gravity, may be a possible explanation for the continued expansion of the universe.

    Any comments on this line of thinking would be greatly appreciated.

    Lance Knoechel

  46. mick jagger

    well but milk woudnt stay forever in the fridge that is acording to the cosmlagistic theory

  47. Dana Pangburn

    “Dark Matter”! Good description if you have no idea what it is. Or, if it exists. Does anybody have any postulations as to the composition of “Dark Matter”. Is sort of like a cross between Jello and window putty? What would it taste like? Was it created from the “BIG BANG” and then went on to coalesce into stuff that we can see? Why isn’t there any dark matter close to the earth? Why would it only exist a real long ways away? Maybe if we stopped concentrating on such huge distances, we might discover some close by. Why not have a good look around in New York City? They’ve got everything else there. And on this expansion of the universe thing. Just what in hell is the universe expanding into if that is not in itself, The Universe? How do we know it is expanding at all. Maybe it is contracting from another direction. That’s the problem with scientists. They have allowed ethnocentricity (does anybody know how to spell that) to color their thinking. Where is the center of the universe? Maybe we are the ones who are way the hell out toward the edge. Edge! Now that gets me going. Does this mean that the celestial objects that are caught up in the accelerating expansion are going to eventually bounce of a cosmic wall? If the universe started with a big bang, where did the stuff to go “Bang” come from and how is it that there was a “SPACE” in which the “Big Bang” could take place.

    Some of you may have guessed by now that I do not know squat about astroni
    my. Actually, I wouldn’t even be bothering with this were it not for the fact I’m trying to avoid kitchen chores by pretending to be working.

    Have a happy

  48. Dark matter, as described in current physics, consists of particles that don’t interact with matter and light as we know it, or does so very weakly, with the exception of gravitation. The concept of dark matter was originally introduced to explain why galaxies rotate as fast as they do without all the matter flying off. There either was a flaw in Newton’s law of gravity or there was matter that couldn’t be seen. MOND, which stands for MOdified Newtonian Dynamics, was the competing theory to dark matter, and it required that gravitational effects drop off in quanta at extreme distances that allowed for a greater apparent effect. The math was quirky and no one seemed comfortable with it. Anyway, dark matter as a blanket term can also refer to cold normal matter like brown dwarves. The entire reason for dark matter is explain where the “rest” of the matter in the universe resides.

  49. GregKun

    LoL I love Astronomy the colors are so lovely that if you over lay them you would get a good 3D image with the right glasses. lol As to the research ranting or not it is still very interesting. ^_^

  50. Gary Knoeppel

    I have a theory of what (some) of the Dark Matter, and Dark Energy is. I believe it is matter traveling too fast to be folded into space-time. Matter traveling at just less then the speed of light squared.
    During the big bang, all possible speeds were achieved. Soon after the big bang space-time / the sub light speed universe was created.
    For matter/energy to have an existence in our universe, it does not have to be folded into space-time. Matter energy must interact with space-time prior to the end of the universe. It must be converted to energy at just above the speed of light. Most of this matter will only interact with space-time at the end of our universe when all matter in the known universe is accelerated back to the speed of light. For some of the dark matter the entire span of existence of our universe would be very short let us say 1 second. However, that time or fraction of that would be enough for this matter to be created, exist, and be converted to energy that interacts with space-time prior to the end of the universe allowing such matter to exist.
    I believe the speed of light restricts matter transfer in either direction. Know matter can not travel faster then the speed of light, and matter that is traveling at speeds multiple times the speed of light can not slow down to enter into our space time. It is the slowing of dark matter and it is burning up at the speed of light barrier that creates some of the dark energy.
    I have no little explanation why Dark Matter does not crash into matter in our space-time other than it cannot and still have an existence shortly after time space was formed.
    Dark matter is a cold thin matter that passes thru protons / neutrons without interaction, or I would like to think it is a chameleon and not have a specific nature, when it hits a lead molecule its lead, when it hits zinc its zinc. Dark Matter does not have a specific nature, as we know it.
    I think Dark Matter does interact with electrons.
    Of course, for dark matter, electrons would be standing still, and they would be flying past. In large voids between galaxies, the lack of electrons to interact with would cause a slowing of this matter, and its destruction/conversion to energy as it neared the speed of light.
    To me (a construction worker), this explanation resolves several questions I have about Physic’s.
    1.) If the speed of light squared, is an achievable space for matter, and the majority of possible speeds from zero to the speed of light squared being well above the speed of light why is not most of the matter in the universe traveling faster than light speed.
    2.) If a person falling in a Black hole is stretched out like a noodle as they speed up, how could matter possibly slow down to enter space-time. Matter would be landing in multiple places at once, the effect would be like a meteor entering the atmosphere.
    3.) Why do galaxies speed up the further they travel from each other?
    4.) Why an electron can be seen as a wave or a particle, because it interacting with a material that is faster than light, that travels on the surface of space-time.
    5.) I do not have the ability to give you a diagram, so if you could imagine the effect over the span of the universe existence, like cannon ball trajectories landing on the surface of space-time, I believe it would explain why the effect would increase over time.
    For my theory to be possible, all dark matter would have to be converted to dark energy prior to the end of the universe.
    The total amount of dark matter if converted to energy would be equal to the energy required to accelerate all matter in the known universe to the speed of light.
    I am not sure if dark energy and matter are converted back and forth repeatedly over the history of the universe, but I would suspect that the further you look back in time, you would see more Dark Matter and less Dark Energy.
    Thank you for taking the time to read my thoughts on the subject, I would be glad to hear some of the expanations of why my ideas are in error.

    Gary Knoeppel

  51. Gary Knoeppel

    It appears no one read my last comments so please forgive my further rambling.
    I believe Dark matter was created in the big bang, and was locked out of space time as matter slowed down, and space-time was created. I think interaction with matter in space-time was a prohibited action for materials attempting to exist, the interaction would distroy space-time. So the matter/energy that is nearly locked out of space time would take infenantly complex routes thru space time in order to exist, this is material that had it’s entire existance thru time planned when it became part of our universe.
    image a board full of nails, and this matter as a magentic string drawn to the board, and repeled by the nails. The string will fall to the board, in the simplest configuration, but it fall to the board.
    Therefore, when space-time was formed, this matter/energy followed infinitely complex routes thru space-time that did not allow interaction with material in the sub-light universe. The key to this is Time-Space had already been mostly formed, and entire existence / route this material takes thru the span space time existence was determined as it was folded into existence, no matter how complex that route would have to be.
    I believe it is part of all matter, and the lack of sub-light matter to interact with causes it to slow, and be destroyed as it attempts to enter space-time. I believe this is matter that is there, but since it is skipping over the surface of space-time, it cannot interact with us. It does not interact the gas cloud, the Sun that is created, or carbon molecule on the planet that follows it is part of or comes in contact with, because to that molecule it is all three at once. This matter would only have an existence as we understand it when it is destroyed attempting to sub-light universe.

  52. Gary Knoeppel

    My final summary of what Dark Matter and Dark Energy are for this blog.
    Matter / energy from the big bang that was not incorporated into fabric of space-time at the beginning of the universe due to its speed.
    Once the fabric of space-time was created, no matter was able to enter. I would like to call this the speed of light barrier.
    Dark matter can only “exist” as an energy release interaction as this matter is pulled into the fabric of space-time and destroyed.
    If matter or energy currently occupies the location where Dark Matter is attempting to enter the fabric space-time, it is prohibited from entry/existence.
    Due to the speed of time difference, the fusion release of energy would occur over long periods, and would appear as a very weak energy release.
    When the universe reached a larger size, it allowed more Fast/Dark matter to be destroyed as it joined into space-time. The effect kept the universe from collapsing in on its self due to the pull of gravity.
    I suspect the effect would look like this.
    If you were looking at two galaxies on the same path traveling away from us, it would appear Dark Energy was on our side of the nearer galaxy, and Dark Matter was intermingled with the galaxy, and also on the far edge of the nearer galaxy. A large amount of Dark Energy should be behind the further galaxy; with the amount of energy dropping off quickly at a point were you near the far side of the closer galaxy.

  53. gene

    Cosmology seems to be dominated by mathematicians with very vivid imaginations. I would be embarrassed if I introduced a theory that relied on 70% (let alone 95%) speculation about a unkwown and unseen material or force. I for one do not subscribe to the theory of “dark matter” or “dark energy” because they were invented to fill holes in the existing mainstream theory. In my mind, “gravitational lensing” is more likely a manifestation of electromagnetic phenomenon or some other yet to be discovered effect. To my very simple mind, talking to so-called experts on cosmology today is like trying to get a straight answer from a political hack. You only get the party line. I know it is hard to make an honest living as a cosmologist, and hence, the more proposterous the theory the more books you can sell. I don’t believe in time travel, wormholes, parallel universes, astral projection, or any of the other ridiculous, ludicrous, proposterous, and outlandish ideas I am seeing out there.

  54. Gary Knoeppel

    Thanks for the input Gene, and I am embarrassed by silly ideas, yet I can’t get past the belief that the speed of light is a two way barrier. but that is unimportant for now. Also I am a simple construction worker so my ideas are no more outlandish than my coworkers. You will be happy to know I have a new idea that eliminates the need for Dark energy to explain the expansion of the universe, and describes dark matter. It is very simple. As a construction worker we use gps satellite positioning on a daily basis. We find that the resetting daily of time for the satellites is not always consistent. As one group of satellites passes over horizon and another group takes over, a difference is found in points surveyed. Based on this, and a TV show that said the reason gravity is such a weak force is because it is bleeding in though string particles form another Dimension. So lets say gravity has a pull forward and backward in time, in all directions along the fabric of space-time, & outside the fabric of space-time. Okay we take two galaxies, we place a ice cube (like one from your refrigerator) at a mid point between the gravity pull of both galaxies. time is much slower for the heavy galaxies than for the ice cube. like pizza dough falling between the fingers of the cook, time between the ice cube and the galaxies begins to distort. The galaxies start to pull towards each other out side the fabric of space-time. In some locations the galaxies pull towards each other fast enough to slow the ice cube and collide with each other. In other cases by simple holding its position between the galaxies the time differential causes space to expand at a faster rate then the galaxies can pull along the fabric of space-time, and the galaxies pull becomes greater outside the fabric of space time than over it. ie.
    no Dark energy math correction required at all, simple entropy.
    I am going to be brief because I have to work. The universe is doing a noddle collapse. like pulling taffy with sticky fingers, light particles on one hand and heavy particles on the other.
    Galaxies look like chocolate waffle ice cream cones with white sprinkles over the cone. We are an ant looking from the bottom of the cone looking up. we cant see the chocolate ice cream filling. Galaxies fold over on themselves, that is way stars at the edges of galaxies travel faster than expected because they are closer to to black hole then seen. Sorry I must go to work. Space vortex’s we are seeing past mid point ice cubes that have been pulled towards each other similar the galaxies out side the fabric of space time giving appearance whole regions of space are rushing off in a single direction. Information is not lost when it falls in a black hole because Black Holes are pulled towards space-time, they do not fit in the slower than the speed of light requirement but are pulled to each other, energy released by pressing on space time will cause some energy to fit back in to universe. That small amount would come back in at super novas, or Quasars. My ideas may in fact be ridiculous, but I would be grateful if someone would say why. I must admit I feel like the kid in Al Gores class 40 years ago saying it looks like South America, and Africa used to fit together. then having the teacher say that’s just stupid. I can accept my idea is wrong I would just be grateful if someone would explain why.

  55. Gary Knoeppel

    Okay, back to the increasing speed that occurs as galaxies increasing vector their pull towards each other outside the fabric of space time. the above scenario, only allows for a doubling of the cosmic constant. Lets throw in a planet sized ice cloud at equal points opposite each other, but held from falling to either galaxy by the pull of the opposite cloud. As force from galaxies diminishes over space-time. Both possibilities will exist, clouds can crash into each other or pull towards each other outside the fabric of space time. the rate if increase could be compounded many times as the size scale reduced.

  56. Gary Knoeppel

    Oops used term cosmic constant in wrong context. Oh well you get the idea, all possibles rates of expansion can be achieved by adding this simple characteristic to gravity. I know some of you are saying then other galaxies will pop out of the sky, ground, sun etc. what ever. if we are folding over one each other. I have two thoughts on topic. One like when the drapes in your living room touching each other they just don’t become one piece of fabric (three dimensional space can not occupy another three dimensional space). Okay what if we are pressing on space from another galaxy, and a Sun is placed directly over Wrigley field, and every time they get to play offs, there’s a solar flare causing some fan to reach out and catch a playable ball leading to the loss of the game. Yeah I can see that, but no. the weight is not equal, the speed of time/shape of space is not equal. Like continents flowing past each other at fault lines,the effect would be weak and over millions of years. again the forward and backward in time thing would help to cancel the effect. Since all galaxies are folded over on themselves some of that energy pushed back into the other galaxies black hole? the closer or more specific the pull outside-across space-time, the less the effect on specific body’s the bodies /mass on your own fabric of space-time becomes dominant. Anyway the effect would be incomprehensible, and would occur over vast periods of time. I have to go to work now I will mention other idea why not later.

  57. Gary Knoeppel

    Okay first post this year I said we were under going a noddle collapse. If looking 4th dimensionally only it would at least start out looking like a very complex snow flake. Universe at end may look like noddle, or ever growing snow flake. It depends on weather your a glass half full kind of person or glass half empty. I must admit I lean towards the glass is more than half empty thinking on topic, but I will get back to that later. Back to second reason why folded space doesn’t intermingle with adjacent space. If gravity has a pull outside our universe Black Holes are pulled toward space-time and each other. I would think they are also pulled strongly back to point of universes greatest density. The point when it first came into existence. ie. backwards in time to the beginning. You may have seen those Chocolate fountains people put out at party’s, Personally when I see them with children coughing on them and double dipping, they just say to me lets swap some chocolate spit, but that another topic. Imagine the entire history of our universe as a sand hour glass, and Chocolate/ energy-mass flowing from top to bottom. the greatest concentrations of chocolate touching glass are at the wide points Top and Bottom, and as Chocolates sheets outs as it passes mid point / point of universes greatest expansion, point of least density to area. we find the least amount of chocolate on the surface. energy/mass but still covering surface of hour glass. I thinks this would also be point when surface energy would be least needed outside four dimensional space to explain expansion of universe. Sorry kind of lame description, but it leads towards how I think the universe ends. A later topic. simply my second thought on why folded space can not merge is between folded space-time there is a layer of energy covering the entire surface that can not fit into space time that keeps any two points of folded over space-time from melding together.

  58. Gary Knoeppel

    Okay, I thought about it over weekend, I’m wrong. I continue to like Idea of information that doesn’t fit into four dimensional space, pulled towards our universe and flowing-passing along just outside to point of greatest density the beginning of time, But have no math or logic to support. If gravity has pull out side space-time still like curvature along time axis that would eliminate need for dark energy, and the return some of information entering a black hole as a force used to provide additional rotation to surrounding galaxy of black hole. Noddle collapse, Universe collapse while appearing to expand. Heavy matter at one end an lite at the other. Only time you know your collapsing is when heavy space begin to meld and forth dimension breaks down lite mass slingshotted back to near singularity causing inflationary event in new universe. Let me step back for a second three types of ending for universe.

    Cold Freeze all energy used up black holes and widely scattered matter. (I don’t like it kind of a non answer.)

    Big Zoom (I like it, if we can have an inflationary event at the beginning of universe why not another at the end) but it has very little support from the people who do the math.

    Big Crunch Doesn’t explain why universe appears to be expanding at ever increasing rate.(If you don’t allow gravity a pull outside four dimensional space.)

    I was beginning to like my idea of a Zoom Crunch. (most likely because it sounds like a candy bar) but I can’t get it to work.

    I thought I would have time to explain why today, but took more time writing / rambling than I thought. Next post I will explain why. I will have to get past four dimensions “and others” thinking.
    I’m sure I will have a new idea next year. If I don’t read too many angry why did you waste my time responses from Gene or others, I will post it on this dead end section, of what is a really good blog. Go to top read instructions if you want to get to new blog site.

  59. Gary Knoeppel

    I will complete my explanation of my view of the pull of gravity out side the fabric of space-time. In addition, I will explain what this would look like in four-dimensional space, and how my idea can be disregarded, or proven with simple observations.

    First I must clarify the statement that all galaxies end state in isolation would be conical (waffle cone with white sprinkles) in shape when gravity is viewed outside four-dimensional space. A galaxy with this gravitational pull when viewed in four-dimensional space would be a would be a flat disk galaxy like ours. Reasons why not are more complex, so would like to start with single galaxy in by it self.
    As mass / energy, falls into a black hole the pull out side the fabric of space-time will be strongly oriented forward in time. (At least to point were time breaks down at bottom of black hole and or point when mass within black hole can escape the pull of the surrounding galaxy.)
    Why forward, and what it will look like.
    The pull forward in time is simple two reasons: as you fall into a black hole time slows for you as you speed up. So the draw to bodies in the future is greater than our pull to bodies in the past. Second is the nature of Black Holes. Space filled with newly created neutral particles of negative and positive mass. After a billionth of a second, these partials are pulled back together and disappear from existence. Except at the event horizon of black holes were pull of Black Hole pulls negative mass into hole (shrinking it) and burns up positive half creating a repulsive effect against more mass pulled to Black Hole.
    Picture two suns pulled to black hole and each other. Sun number one a big one is pulled into hole, second sun maintains an orbit around black hole for a couple hundred thousand years. So inside the black hole the fabric of space-time grows as sun number one as it speeds up and is cast into the future of the twin star that remains in orbit around the black hole. Twin is pulled to black hole and big twin in its future. Present time connection diminishes over surface of space-time, second sun wants to fold space around the black hole prior to its entry.
    I think this means dark matter will gather in two ways towards the forward path of a traveling galaxy, and or will have a consistent pattern relative to the rotation of the stars in its Galaxy.
    So if gravity force vectoring is occurring out side fabric of space-time between galaxies. Why don’t we feel effect of other galaxy?
    Just like the yummy tasty apple that fell out of a tree onto Sir Isaac Newton’s head, he had no idea it was coming until it hit his noggin. So if idea has any merit. What would we see if it were happening? If we look at vortex area of space as far back in history as we can. ~ We will not see anything unusual at all. Galaxy folding is old, but inter-galaxy folding is new. (A couple billion years or so) Sorry just making a point.
    Look to area of rushing away space. If you can find two galaxies a distance apart, that appear to be reorienting their star rotation without explanation. This would be smoking gun. Think of someone flipping a pancake. Part of the pancake has landed on griddle; other part is flopping over into new orientation.
    If this idea is correct, we are already pulled over our own black hole. Although it may not be very healthy for current occupants. I do not see any reason such an occurrence would prohibit life.
    I could keep going, but you get the idea, or are tired of reading this. I will post a new idea next year.

  60. Gary Knoeppel

    Okay last post for a year, I promise. this is more of a question then a rambling idea mono-log.

    PS to Genes’ point that my ideas are based on 75% to 95% speculation of a unknown force. Gene is wrong the ideas based on limited understanding of the concept of an unknown force, and well over 99.000?% speculation.

    I am person who has questions, those questions lead to ideas that are almost certainly in error.

    The speed of light is constant. It is known that the time it takes to get from one point to another is based on area it must cover, and that Mass alters the shape of space time.

    Question: If time, and the shape of space cannot be set equal, if we overlap our own Black Hole, and lets say 10 other galaxies, would we even know it?

    I guess the point I am getting to is, I don’t think melding of space is possible, but what about sharing?

  61. Gary Knoeppel

    Same Idea Just more wordy.

    Brian Greene went on a television show called The Colbert Report pitching his new book The Hidden Reality.

    He stated during the show that he hoped the universe was not collapsing. Since then I have read his book. I take a different outlook on the subject. I prefer my collapsing / self-replicating three dimension dominated universes; collapse outlook on the future of our universe.
    In my scenario overlapping regions of space will tunnel inversely overlap each other in near proximity due to the incongruity of the shape of time and space. Acting almost like another separate universe would act if in near proximity to ours.
    When I read Professor Greene’s book, I was looking for a definite reason why my thinking on the topic had to be in error. I only found couple of snippits of information that would make my idea moot.

    At this point I would like to take some time to step back and give some definitions for terms I am about to make up to better explain my idea.

    Also for brevity, state an observable requirement for my Idea to be correct.
    Requirement: For a regionally collapsing universe to exist, caused by bands of gravity reaching through three dimensional space to pull back on incongruent folds of our own universes fabric to occur, Both Dark Energy, and Dark Matter will have to increase with time, up to the point that the region of space they contain begins it collapse.
    My new terms.

    A.) A nexus nub: any two or three galaxies undergoing time incongruity related to their time and the refrigerator ice cubes time trapped between them. A nexus nub will begin a tunneling process, but as mass is vectored off of space-time, the inverse relation of mass to space-time will diminish weight of the galaxies, and the galaxies will catch up with the ice cubes correcting the shape of space. . I think nub galaxies will all develop a disk like appearance similar to ours.

    B.) A nexus nodule two-galaxy pairs, or a two galaxy pair and a three galaxy pair pulling toward each other off the surface of space and partially bonded in this way. A nodule may never return all of its mass to the surface of space-time and tunneling will be more extensive. A pair of nub galaxies create a line, a three set create a plane. A four set is minimum required to create the space that will capture the mid point ice cubes as well as the galaxies, permanently maintaining the incongruity in the shape of space-time between them.
    C.) A nexus node. Two -? Nodules bonding mass out side space-time, with multiple possible configurations that would contain the mid point ice cubes/ time incongruities. The mass of this region would be greatly reduced, with mass relative to, or even less then that of a single un-joined galaxy would on surrounding space. Also a Space Vortex. A collapsing branch from the universe snowflake described in an earlier post.
    D.) A Black Brain *(1.)The point when deviation from space-time has shrunken space to the point when black holes rotating in the void of space surrounding a nexus node can coalesce to a single Black hole. A point when not even a single snipit of information is emitted from a nexus node. The point when our universe pumps is negative mass particles, and space needed to begin the expanding of a new three dimensionally dominated universe.
    The two ways a collapsing universe will look.

    1.) Fourth dimension time-space view. The incongruent tips on snowflake melt away (creating new three dimensionally dominated universes), until it becomes a single thin crystal without the mass needed to exist.

    2.) The three dimensions of space-time deviating from one four-dimensional time-space view: Section to view on time axis. Picture a cannon fired on the moon (without atmosphere to slow its movement). 100lb cannon ball, and 100lbs of powder, and the oxygen needed to ignite it. Along three dimensions deviating from a fourth, the cannon ball leaves the cannon as a 100lb cast iron ball, and when it lands, it has the weight of a 1lb soccer ball. Along space-time without deviation from the three dimensions the cannon fires as a 1lb soccer ball, and lands as a 100lb cast iron ball. Near point when the trajectories of both balls intersect at the landing point. A region of space collapses, now the trajectory of both balls is altered from beginning to end. Along the three dimensions riding on a fourth, view it leaves the cannon with same 100lbs of powder as a 99lb cast iron ball and lands as a .99lb soccer ball, and vise-versa on the unrestricted space-time view. The trajectory lengthens as different regions of space repeatedly collapse from existence. This would continue to repeat to the point when mass would be insufficient to allow the formation of the universe in the beginning.

    The universe when viewed along time axis will look like a snow flake, as it collapses Nexus nodes (space vortexes’) will shrink and break away like a self righting scale that corrects its-self by dropping one pebble every time the scale lowers one way or another.

    If information does fall into a black hole, and is used to power the rotation of stars in a galaxy, the additional mass/energy brought into the region due to the instability of the void of space at its perimeter, will mean that hole regions of space will become to dense to hold up. The three dimensions of space will meld with time, creating a “Black Brain”.
    For my idea to work, I must disagree with this description “Black” in Black Brains.
    I want to keep space vortexes in my idea simply because they are behaving the way I believe they should if Dark Energy is simply the pull of the bands of gravity from one galaxy to another outside the fabric of space-time, caused by the slowing of a expanding of the universe.
    Okay if a whole region begins to meld together, you will not have point specific density to prohibit light photons from escaping, but if the region melds with time, time stops.
    From the simple description given to me the more correct way of describing it is time becomes a direction like up- down, left-right, forward-backward.
    So viewing stars as they shrink away. Once time stops acting as it does in our three dimensions traveling on a fourth (time)~ existence as we know it ends, and we should not see an endless steam of light emitted from stars of region that has collapsed, or nearing unrestricted space-time.
    This is were I make up a super power for light coming from that region.
    Quantum mechanics proves that particles do not travel on a single path but along a probability wave, taking all paths at once. The light from a nexus node will take on a new characteristic as void instability pumps in infinite amount of energy to the collapsing region, and the region shrinks, as surrounding space continues to expand/distort. The last photons emitted will ride on an altered probability wave, will have infinite mass and charge, and will take all possible paths though space, and time. We would not be looking at a star continuing to burn, but would be looking at the same light we looked at a year ago, since its path is no longer limited to a single time and it takes all possible paths though space and time.

    Note: I have only seen one picture of a space vortex, and it looked like normal space, with a bunch of space pouring down a well. For my idea to be correct, we should find a vortex that looks like normal space, darkness to a point half way down the well, and then a bunch of space falling into the well.

    The true weight of a galaxy.
    Calculate the weight of the galaxies center black hole at the surface of space-time, based on the rotation speed of known sized stars that rotate it. Estimate the weight of the visible universe (stars, planets debris, and gas) use Newton’s theory of gravity or general relativity what ever you prefer. Calculate the anticipated rotation of stars, compare that to the mass required to achieve the observable view. Divide the difference in these numbers by two. This will give you the actual weight of the galaxy. Take the visible weight of the galaxy, divided by its actual weight, and you will have the percentage of gravity band pull the galaxy exhibits in unrestricted time.

    Fourth dimensional proximity of Milky Way and our nub twin Andromeda.
    The time incongruity is at our mid point. Part of our mass has pulled off of space-time due to galaxy folding, seven billion years ago, we started to speed up, but gravity band pull due to time incongruity began before this split. I would attempt to do the math to calculate our fourth dimensional proximity to our neighbor Andromeda, except, people at work are always getting mad at me for taking my shoes off. I blame them for making me count to twenty. Yet to an Astro physicist taking time to reading this instead of the comics in their newspaper, this is a calculate able number. If someone were to do the math, I would like to see the results. Of course, if you do not want to show the math, please return a result equal to 42.

    What happens at the perimeter of a collapsing region of space?
    Many small black holes would surround this region, and when the size was small enough and space-time could be pulled together congruently, the light photon would be blocked from our view, absorbed by the larger black holes that would eventually become one, and our view of the region would end.
    Simply by the nature of creation of a Nexus node. The black holes will form at the perimeter, in areas of space with little mass, and quasar blasts from these black holes would be unlikely. The Black holes may pull in a few stars, planets and gas clouds at the periphery, so depending on the size the black hole, blasts may occur? Simply the nature of their creation would mean they would occur in an area of little matter, and would soon burn out / as matter/energy was added to remaining universe, and the shrinking curvature and the absorption of negative mass particles will be pumped into the new three dimensionally dominated universes created by the collapse.

    Like two bubbles separating, the pull of gravity back towards our universe would continue until the new universe achieved escape velocity. That wave vibration may create the negative gravity that would make the need for the yet to be found inflaton particle moot.

    In Greene’s intertwining universe, there are a billion billion copies of you and I distantly scattered though out the universe. The only thing is we have just this one time. In my version, possible same result, but we would be eternal in time time of many universes.

    Lets say that in ten years, or ten billion years, give or take a billion years anywhere in that time; our region of space were to collapse. I don’t know how that would effect probability wave calculations, or multi-verse calculations, but I for one would glad to give up one existence, to be sitting down to Christmas dinner with my family, and know that my existence had ended in three dimensional space, ended on a path to creating a new universe.

    Heck, if Whoopi Goldberg were standing in the study, I would ask her to have dinner with the family.

    *(1) I personally would like to call this an “Elvis Has Left the Building”, but intelligent physicists have already done the math and I should not make jokes when truth be told I am the one who should be facing ridicule for my unfounded ideas.

  62. Gary Knoeppel

    Okay I haven’t changed my mind yet, I still think space-time could be folding / creasing incongruently due to the pull on gravitons through “deep space” (outside of our three dimensional space).
    Black Hole Quasar blasts could be point when mass within Black Hole reaches plank scale, and ”time” again becomes a dimension like left-right, up-down, or forward-backward. When this occurs information would have a release/escape from the black hole through deep-space.
    Mass on the surface of space-time is restricted form its path toward the singularity, and mass that has reached the plank scale makes its escape when the dimension of time again becomes a direction of travel. At this point I would like to believe information escapes though deep space in two directions, forward and backward in time. The quasar blast would be the only visual representation we would ever see of the folding of space-time.
    Quasar blasts crease space-time unperceptively near the event horizon of the black hole. The overall mass remains unchanged, yet like a water saturated log, floating on the water, more mass is contained in deep space or within the water.
    If correct dark matter correction calculations should be needed at locations preceding future quasar blasts.
    Question. If a Super Massive Black Hole is 20 light years from another Super Massive Black Hole, when the mass within both Black Holes has been compressed to less than the plank scale, how far apart are the black holes through Deep Space.
    Possible Answers:
    A.) 20 light years of deep space. (We live in a three dimensionally dominated universe surrounded by another three dimensional or more universe.)
    B.) An infinite separation exists. (Although the creation of both black holes is similar, they are both falling into separate deep space dimensions.)
    C.) 20 millameters, or 20 plank lengths, (Like a sheet of paper viewed from the side, our universe is not the same size when viewed from the outside as it is from the inside.)
    I like the simple answer “C” current M-theory leads to an interruption of our universe exists integral with an additional seven dimensions. With these additional dimensions existing in the realm of the very small.
    A folding of space-time due to the effect of differential mass’s impact the shaping of space-time, over time, will cause a surface expansion of space-time, and deep space collapse of the universe.

    On a side note.
    If all probability waves have an equally real existence, isn’t this a simple way of saying that “Time” is an expanding shape perpendicular to our universe’s three dimensional pull on its existence?
    Time with a shape infinitely perpendicular to this moment would hold on its surface our three dimensions curled with an expansion of all the possibilities that could exist.
    I know current M theory states ten dimensions riding on time. Yet I believe Einstein said at the very small Time was a direction. Question. Why is time now restricted a forward backward shape?

  63. Gary Knoeppel

    Note to self.
    Topic: What is the Weight of Undetermined Reality, The Double Slit Experiment, Buckie Balls,~Richard Feynman and Shing-Tung Yau.
    Okay we can alter the results of the double slit by observing them, we can predict the results of undetermined reality by summing the total of all possible realities and deleting the conflicting pasts. Dr Yau calculates that our three dimensional universe resides in six higher dimensions with conical apertures permeating thru our three dimensional space.

    Okay so lets say when I was very young I took my dog on a walk, at the corner I had the choose of walking left, right, or straight. End result is I would walk my dog a couple of blocks and go home. If no one saw me, to all observers other than me, my dog walking would be an undetermined event.
    If I forget the walk entirely,the same could hold true for me also. If reality is a dimension than Feynman’s formulas would appear to suggest that determined non conflicting reality will attempt to reside at the lowest possible state. Question: is it possible that bubbles of undetermined non conflicting realities permeate thru our three dimensional space?

    I view this as stars being fussy, permeating with a vast number of alternate molecular interactions. and planets like Mercury with a large lead core and less interaction as having a much less fussy or smaller extra dimensional volume.

    The problem with this idea is that undetermined realities exist/travel on probability waves and probability waves are not restricted by time.

    The possible molecular interactions that can occur in a star may very greatly, but they would have a generally consistent value. I can only think of one possible factor that could clump up, or alter the disbursement of Dark Matter.

    Life: past present or future.

    (Yep I know that’s just silly. I plan to read a little more on quantum solutions this year,and then gladly go back to my Newtonian thoughts on the topic.)


    If Dark Matter is gravitational pull of coexisting undetermined realities thru higher dimensional space. We would be looking at regions of space where life expands the region into the surrounding higher dimensional space. The broadening of potential undetermined realities, altering the movement of the planets and stars. This effect is based on non conflicting potential realities only and would proceed the existence of life.

    A bizarre side effect of NON-SINGULAR REGIONALLY SPECIFIC DETERMINED REALITIES would be that having a positive effect on your family,your community, and your environment.

    May not only define you as a person, but may establish whether or not you have a defined existence at all.


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