Mecca lecca hi

By Phil Plait | January 16, 2007 12:34 pm

Some people have accused me of being anti-religious, anti-christian, whatever. The truth is, I am anti-irrational. As long as you make sense, you’ll have no quarrel with me (well, that’s not strictly true– you can make sense and still be wrong… but if you don’t make sense then I guarantee you’ll be wrong).

But if you want to make absolutely no sense, spew irrationalities, and then claim that you are irrevocably correct and that everyone else is wrong, then fundamentalist religiosity is a great place to start.

Take this screed, for example. Acording to Dr. Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid, a "scientist" at the Egyptian National Research Center, we should dump Greenwich time and switch to… wait for it… Mecca time!

Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid: When British colonialism or the British kingdom were in control, and it was “an empire on which the sun never sets,” it imposed Greenwich Mean Time. This creates two problems for the world. The first problem is that in Greenwich, the magnetic field of Earth is 8.5 degrees, whereas in Mecca the magnetic field is zero.

[…]

Interviewer: What other benefits are there to calculating time according to Mecca?

Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid: If you calculate time according to Mecca, those 8.5 minutes… The magnetic field of Earth, for example… What I say is that there are people at the North Pole and the South Pole who cannot come here in multitudes.

Interviewer: Really?

Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid: This is because the magnetic force is concentrated there, which affects people’s blood and the biological movement of life. It has been proven that if magnetism, anywhere, exceeds 1,000 gauss, which equals one tenth of a tesla, it affects the ability of the hemoglobin in the blood to carry oxygen to the body’s tissues, the ability of the blood to carry oxygen to the tissues.

Interviewer: In other words, the ability to live…

Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid: Yes, to live… This means is that when you are in Mecca, the ability of the blood to carry oxygen to the tissues is greater than anywhere else in the world.

Interviewer: That’s why, when people travel to Mecca, they return full of energy.

Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid: In Mecca, you don’t exert any effort. That’s why you may see an old man, who cannot walk, or who walks with crutches, and even though it gets very crowded around the Ka’ba, he is filled with great strength, and he circles the Ka’ba. You do not exert any effort, and you are filled with energy, because you are in a place in which there is no magnetic force.

I was going to tear this apart step by step, but c’mon, why bother. This guy is so full of crap it would just be kind of sad to do it. People want to visit Mecca from the north and south poles? That ought to be a short list. And the stuff about magnetic fields and blood is utter garbage. I have had MRIs on my back and my knee in the past, and if blood flowed differently depending on magnetic field strength, my body would have exploded like an overstuffed balloon during the procedure. MRIs use a huge magnetic field, tens of thousands of times stronger than the Earth’s field. Plus, what does anything he is saying have to do with Greenwich time? It’s like Al-Sayyid wrote down scientific-sounding words on a piece of paper, cut it into pieces, and drew them randomly out of a hat.

So this guy is full of it. But why get upset?

What makes me so angry about stuff like this is that he claims he’s a scientist, when he is anything but, together with the fact that this is all based on fundamentalist Islam. So what we have here is a middle-eastern version of the young Earth creationist, someone who has the incredible ability to totally ignore every single fact and observation about reality, and instead substitute them with fantasy based on something in an ancient book written before we understood germs and electricity.

But what really, really makes me angry is that I know that this twinkie will be praised by millions of people who will take his word as, pardon the expression, gospel. They won’t wonder that Dr. Al-Sayyid’s words were sent over the Internet — a triumph of human engineering knowledge — or that what he said was broadcast over a television signal that took centuries of scientific progress to create.

Fundamentalist ignorance is many things, but irony is one of of its most obvious properties. But another property, and its most insidious, is its infection rate. The only cure for this sort of thing is knowledge.

Arm yourself.

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Comments (62)

  1. Michael

    I have no idea what “magnetic field of Earth is 8.5 degrees” even means, let alone what the connection between magnetic field and a standard time meridian is . . . . but what the hell, there’s a magic rock in Mecca.

    Lastly, I thought I’d mention the curiosity of people using the word “gospel” to mean something is true, when (as I understand it) the word actually means “good news,” e.g., _ The Gospel According to Mark_ (or Matthew, John, Peter, Luke, and so forth).

  2. Stuart

    Surely this guy cannot be real. As well as the quote above, he seems to have said many more things that have no resemblance to reality. For another example see here:
    “Dr. ‘Abd Al-Baset Sayyid: Imagine that you are the North Pole and I am the South Pole – in the middle there’s what is called the magnetic equilibrium zone. If you place a compass there, the needle won’t move.
    Interviewer: You mean that the pull is equal from both sides?
    Dr. ‘Abd Al-Baset Sayyid: Yes, and that’s why it’s called zero-magnetism zone, since the magnetic force has no effect there. That’s why if someone travels to Mecca or lives there, he lives longer, is healthier, and is less affected by Earth’s gravity. That’s why when you circle the Ka’ba, you get charged with energy.”
    So at the equator you can’t navigate using a compass? At Mecca people are less affected by gravity?

  3. dave

    I started reading the article and they were talking about measuring time by latitude??? I thought that the whole concept of time zones was a measure of longitude for the most part. If both the latitude of Greenwich and the latitude of Mecca have the same time on the same longitudinal axis, the interview makes even less sense.

  4. Jamie

    Burning calories gives you energy, whoda thunk it?

  5. Stuart Says: “Surely this guy cannot be real.”

    Sadly, he is. These people live in the bubble of their own fantasies, and whatever they think of is real since they are divinely inspired. I wouldn’t try to make any sense out of what he says. I’m sure he was referring to magnetic deviation (which may or may not be zero in Mecca, I don’t have a chart with me) but Michael is correct, it has nothing to do with time. It has nothing to do with gravity, either. Or human “energy” (whatever that means).

    Phil is correct that millions around the world will take this scientific-sounding garbage as more “proof” of the divinity of Mecca and the correctness of the jihad against the west.

    I have a brother who is an evangelical fundamentalist Christian, and he’s always coming to me with some sort of “science” proving creationism or something. To his credit he always backs down when I show him the logical or scientific errors in what he shows me, but no matter how many times, or how thoroughly I show him wrong, he is never shaken in his belief. Some people are just wired that way.

    – Jack

  6. Better watch it Phil!! He might invoke a jihad against you!! Just make sure you’re at the poles so they can’t live without their “magnetics”

  7. jasonB

    And what makes me really really really angry is if you disagree with Sayyid and his ilk you may not have a head with which to refute his zero-magnetic zone

    Arm yourself. Check, .45.

  8. Lunatik

    ( Scarasm on…)All the better to co-ordinate the islamofaschist attacks in/on all time zones of the imperial infidles empire. (Sarcasm off…)

    These nut-type people want to drag us back to about the 7th cent…
    permently!!!

    As least the Jewish and Christian communities don’t require the conversion to their faith or you must lose your head!!!, type-mentality by the hard-line Islamists.

    Luna

  9. I just had to check on the magnetic deviation of Mecca. Looks like it’s about 5°E. OTOH, there is ZERO deviation right through the American Midwest starting in Minnesota and roughly following the Mississippi all the way to New Orleans.

    Check out:

    http://www.geo-orbit.org/sizepgs/magmapsp.html

    – Jack

  10. spacewriter

    What should we expect from people who have “re-wired” women so that the females in heaven regularly re-grow their hymens… sadly, we have equally loony folks in other faith-based realities, too.

  11. Actually, there also are / have been plenty of loonies in non-faith-based mindsets as well. Little things like…

    Astrology
    Other new-agey stuff (crystals, pyramids, and the like)
    Political nutjobs (the Khmer Rouge come to mind)
    A variety of personality cults (some religious, some not)

    The problem isn’t in faith, it’s in zealotry. Once you decide that irrationality supersedes rationality, future problems are pretty much guaranteed.

    This is also why I dislike on-blog rants — they’re non-productive, and I fail to see how they help encourage rational behavior (“their irrationality is bad, but MINE is justified!”).

    My $0.02,

    Lorne

  12. Notice when he decries GMT as British imperialism, he doesn’t find anything wrong with imposing Mecca time on the world.

  13. Gawd, please save us from your followers!

  14. derio

    Well, one thing I that is clear in the maps Jack Hagerty generously provided is that when you travel in the desert near Mecca the compass points West instead of North!!

    Now that’s the long awaited explanation for the lack of Eskimo pilgrims in Mecca.. the true believers travel in huge flocks down through Turkey following the compass but they end up in Baghdad where they are decimated by the american bombs. Even more faithful (polar) muslims serve as cannon fodder, victims of the infidels’ imperialistic war.

    It really is a terrible conspiracy. The Earth’s magnetic field is deliberately being skewed by a team of evil hebrew-american CIA scientists so that the muslim population of Greenland is kept in check. You know it to be true, you have all read they signs!

  15. Personally, I think we should just do away with time zones altogether. Sure, the times for day and night will vary around the globe, but is adjusting for that any more difficult than adjusting for timezones is today? Plus, doing it this way makes it a lot easier to synchronize world-wide events, without people needing to perform mental arithmetic to convert from the time in Mecca to the time in Boston.

  16. Dave Waalkes

    Unfortunately the trend in the world, as I perceive it, seems to be that people are increasingly too lazy to arm themselves against the irrational. It is easier and more comforting to be fed all the answers. To often humanity’s motto is: Thinking takes energy; Conserve. I hope my perceptions are skewed because I am living in a backward, provincial, conservative and abnormally religious town in the U.S.; I really hope I am wrong.

  17. Dave Waalkes

    p.s.: I heartily agree with “Infophile” (above) about eliminating timezones; let’s go by Coordinated Universal Time! All the easier, then, to think of our rock as Spaceship Earth….

  18. I have it on the authority of the mayor of the North Pole (a jolly old elf in a soft red suit that looks great on my bedroom carpet) that the real reason North Polians don’t go to Mecca is that Jim Beam is excluded from the local airspace.

    Just so y’know.

  19. One additional thought before I get back to foreign affairs with His Honor the Mayor, I think Dr. BA might have been better off to name this post

    “Mecca lecca high as a frickin’ kite”

  20. Troy

    I’ve always thought England and the observatory at Greenwich makes the best origin of the prime meridian (and the datum for the other timezones) For one thing it celebrates astronomy because it is an observatory and it acknowledges the connection between the sky and time. 180° at the opposite side of the Earth is the most convenient place for the international date line between Asia and North America and smack in the Pacific Ocean where nobody worth mentioning lives (joking but it is mostly ocean and island). England then has the distinction of being nearly as west as you can go in the old world so time zones in Europe start at England and count up. Overall it makes a good dividing point for the old and new worlds and I like it. The Arab peninsula is arguable at the epicenter of the old world, obiously much of their thinking is old world as well.
    As for the spouting of the Muslim “scientist” the magnetic field is actually quite volatile and it moves a few miles every year. It is fantastic that it is Canada as it makes our aurorae more abundant in my hemisphere (the western hemisphere). Islam still laments being tossed off as king of the mountain, that’s why you get this. The success of science gets people anxious to get on our bandwagon, good job Phil kicking them back on the ground where they belong.

  21. Christian Burnham

    I’m a Christian and you’re a Philistine!

    (Well, in one sense of those words.)

    Also:

    Britney Spears is an anagram of ‘Presbyterian’
    Pepsi Cola is an anagram of ‘Episcopal’

    Spooky.

  22. Michael

    Coincidently, I just sent Phil an email about a pamphlet I recently recieved from ‘The Biblical Astronomer’, who believes he can prove that the earth is the center of the universe, and stationary.

    http://www.geocentricity.com

    I’m not completely clear on whether scientists are mistaken about their clearly irrational beliefs, or are covering the truth up. Also, the big bang and string theory are kabbalist plots.

  23. Stargazer

    I only have one thing to say about that. Wow…just…wow. I haven’t heard anything quite that…interesting since, um, er… I’ll have to get back to you on that. I can only hope that that is a bad translation of an interview in Arabic. If it was in English… wow.

  24. I also checked to see where Mecca was relative to the magnetic equator (equator between MAGNETIC south and north). Mecca’s well north of it.

    Hey, this is just The 700 Club: Muslim Edition. We (the West) got wackos; they (Middle East) got wackos.

    JanieBelle: how about “Mecca lecca ding dong”

  25. Kaptain K

    If that guy (Dr. Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid) made any less sense, he could be a guest on Coast to Coast AM. George (Noory) would just lap it up!

  26. The proceedings of the conference to decide the prime meridian are online at Project Gutenberg: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/17759/17759-h/17759-h.htm

    The conference was held in the United States, and there was a Turkish (Ottoman?) representative present.

    The use of Greenwich was accepted by the other nations present. Not imposed by England. A striking figure is that 72 percent of the world’s shipping used Greenwich, rather than the ten other options.

  27. Christian Burnham

    Where are all those readers who normally criticize the BA for attacking religion? Or do they only get upset when the BA talks about Christianity?

  28. Eric

    Why not shift it to the ‘international date line’ and be done with it?

  29. Micheal:

    Wow, the OFFICAL Geocentricity website. I hope the Geocentricity people don’t revoke that honour!

  30. Michael

    Jack: Thanx for the declination charts. I figured that is what he meant (horribly stated and I couldn’t resist jumping on it), though he seems to have been wrong on that as well–looks closer to 3.5 degrees East.

    Michael ‘not to be confused with the other Michael’

  31. Ed Davies

    ‘When British colonialism or the British kingdom were in control, and it was “an empire on which the sun never sets,” it imposed Greenwich Mean Time.’

    Picking on this one particular bit of nonesense: it’s not really true. Actually, it was the US which proposed the use of Greenwich as the standard zero for longitude. There was a conference (1870 or so) and everybody present (basically, all the countries who had any representatives in Washington who had any understanding of the issues – quite a few naval officers, astronomers, etc, travelled from Europe or South America specially for the conference) agreed (except the French, of course ;-)).

    The spread of the use of GMT follows from that, I would assume.

  32. Dave

    “I was going to tear this apart step by step, but c’mon, why bother”

    Maybe because you would – if the guy were a Christian? Maybe because if you don’t you’ll expose your obsession with tearing religion down – as long as it’s a Christian one?

    But I will give you points for actually posting about a religion other than a Christian one. Barely.

  33. Will

    I nominate Dave for the “Douchebag of the Thread” award.

  34. icemith

    Eric, If you think about it, the Int’l date line is where the day starts. It’s just that Greenwich is halfway thru that day, and even I do not see the sense of changing it. Mind you if everyone DID adopt U.T.-( yeah , that’s going to happen?), it would make time co-ordination so much easier.

    Shift workers and nightowls unite!

    Ivan.

  35. In case anyone is interested, I’ve posted a dispassionate unbiased review of the man’s proposal here:

    http://gregladen.com/wordpress/

    Clearly, moving airline hubsfrom England to Mecca would be an improvement in terms of the weather, but the magnetic arguments for moving Zulu Time re not, well, moving.

  36. Dean Baird:

    JanieBelle: how about “Mecca lecca ding dong”

    I like that, too!

    Christian Burnham:

    Where are all those readers who normally criticize the BA for attacking religion? Or do they only get upset when the BA talks about Christianity?

    Odd, ain’t it?

    Dave, right on cue:

    “I was going to tear this apart step by step, but c’mon, why bother”

    Maybe because you would – if the guy were a Christian? Maybe because if you don’t you’ll expose your obsession with tearing religion down – as long as it’s a Christian one?

    But I will give you points for actually posting about a religion other than a Christian one. Barely.

    Dork. Like anyone cares.

    Will:

    I nominate Dave for the “Douchebag of the Thread” award.

    Seconded.

  37. Michael

    “Michael ‘not to be confused with the other Michael’”

    Now I’m confused; I thought I was the original!

    Seriously, this guy sounds like any other fanatic fundamentalist. As for the way it reads, check out this link:

    http://www.memritv.org/

    A lot of the translations there sound very similar in their construction (not to mention their rambling). At least as scary as bible literalists, but, as someone pointed out, most of them don’t threaten to behead you if you disagree….

    The other Michael

  38. Astrogirl

    Good one, Phil. It’s good to post about more than one religion’s fundamentalists not only to make it fair, but more importantly, to show that fundamentalists are equally as nutty in any religion and/or country. I laugh equally at them all, including the ones in the religion I was raised in. I have met fundamentalists from several religions, and they all have the “my religion is right, and all others are wrong” claim in common. It shows exactly why none of those claims can be right anyway.

  39. The Apostate

    This stuff isn’t really any more ridiculous then the garbage frequently spewed forth by “Dr.” Hovind.

  40. Michael

    Wait! Phil cut off the end of the interview, which was filled with solid science:

    “Anybody who studies human chemistry knows that all circulation in the human body is to the right. All the components are called “dextro-rotatary,” which means circulating to the right. They call it dextro-rotatory, which means circulating to the right. When I’m circulating [the Ka’ba] from right to left, anti-clockwise, I increase my body’s circulation, and consequently I am filled with energy.

    Interviewer: I get filled with energy too?

    Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid: Yes, because the right-to-left circulation in my body increases.”

    Well, duh. Who doesn’t know that?

    The sarcastic other Michael

  41. jackd

    “Mecca lecca hi” is a shout-out to Jambi from PeeWee’s Playhouse.

  42. Gary Ansorge

    All religion is absolutist.
    All religions preach unquestioning obediance.
    All religions command the faithful to give money.
    All religions are guided my humans.

    Anyone see a connection?

    Gary 7

  43. The other Michael

    Greg Laden
    Says:

    “Clearly, moving airline hubsfrom England to Mecca would be an improvement in terms of the weather, but the magnetic arguments for moving Zulu Time re not, well, moving.”

    The one little flaw with this plan is that everyone on this board would get beheaded for going anywhere near Mecca.

  44. JustAl

    It occurs to me just how much easier it is to be a fundamentalist scientist. You already have the answers to whatever question that might arise, all you have to do is throw together some scientific words in a paragraph vaguely related to the topic. You could probably write a computer program to do it automatically (and likely call it, “Elijah”).

    Peer review consists of, “Did you give credit to the right deity? Good man!” and you’re done. Your papers get published (in the proper fundamentalist publications anyway), you get to do talks (to fundamentalists), and get additional funding (from fundamentalists, if you didn’t see that one coming). Predestined science: Your answer will be, “The Big Guy In The Sky” (with parmesan as desired).

    Seriously, I wonder sometimes: How many of them really don’t buy a lick of their own BS but are more than happy to take money from idiots by pretending to?

  45. Ruth

    Ansorge,

    Change those to ‘most’ religion(s) not ‘all’. Everybody always forgets the Buddhists, maybe because we’re not required to give up critical thought 😉

  46. Daffy

    Ruth is correct. I would also mention the Philosophical Taoists. Critical thinking is encouraged and there is no organized church to ask for money in the first place.

  47. Kaptain K

    “All religion is absolutist.
    All religions preach unquestioning obediance.
    All religions command the faithful to give money.”

    Not all. The Urantia Book is presented as a straightforward “Fifth Revelation of God to Man”.

    “All religion is absolutist.”

    No absolutes. No “believe this or go to hell”. No hell, just eternal progress of the mind and spirit and even this is voluntary. One can, at any time, choose to “be made as never was”.

    “All religions preach unquestioning obediance.”

    It doesn’t matter what you believe, or even if you believe.

    “All religions command the faithful to give money.”

    Nope. No money needs to change hands. Even reading the Book is optional, but if you wish to read it, it is online.

    “All religions are guided by humans.”

    Unfortunately, true. The Urantia Foundation has been taken over by a group of zealots who are trying to mold it into a standard human religion. The good news is that one can safely ignore them (See above).

  48. Gerrsun

    Don’t forget Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster AND you get to dress like a pirate!

    But I would say, while the good Dr.’s comments are laughably in error. It might be a good faith effort TO Christians to explain why he is, even if it is obviously in error.

    At the least you could respond to an attack by a Christian later who says you never pick on any other religions with a resounding ‘NU-UHH!’

    /shrug

  49. Rue

    Woohoo, Sir Sanford Fleming!

    ” Fleming was even called a Communist for his “internationalist” notions, and reviled by some who believed that such interference with the nature of time was contrary to the will of God.”

    http://www.histori.ca/minutes/minute.do?id=10182

  50. JustAL: Seriously, I wonder sometimes: How many of them really don’t buy a lick of their own BS but are more than happy to take money from idiots by pretending to?

    I also often wonder this. It is not necessarily for the money alone, but for dogmatic philosophical reasons, eternal salvation, etc.

    Imagine knowing that a certain dogma provides eternal salvation. But then you, over time, encounter overwhelming evidence that this dogma has to be wrong. You have to keep believing no matter what. On could almost feel sorry for such individuals.

  51. hhEb09'1

    icesmith, your comment: “Eric, If you think about it, the Int’l date line is where the day starts. It’s just that Greenwich is halfway thru that day,”

    Each day does not start at the date line, the date line is just where you convert from one date to the other–but it could be 3pm in the afternoon. Greenwich is opposite the date line, but there is no day that it is halfway thru.

  52. icemith

    To hhEb09’1, I beg to differ. The thrust of the argument is acceptable so long as we are looking at time on a relative basis. But that is not what happens in the real world. Whatever time-zone one is in, seems to be the definitive time. It is not until New Year’s Eve that we are reminded that the ‘dropping of the ball’, or the fireworks or whatever celebrates that moment, that we realise it is played out 24 times or so, around the world.

    I don’t want to appear smug because we here in Sydney are actually second cab off that particular rank, and that New Zealand is first to greet the New Year, (good luck to them). Actually I spent NYE on a beach with some of my family in Adelaide SA, and that it was a further half hour later. I was acutely aware that it was really NYE still, not earlier with my friends who were home, nor later for other friends in the USA, or Britain, or other relatives in another state in Australia.

    And then there is daylight saving time as well!

    I get peeved that certain world events get pegged to certain dates. The best example is the day Neil Armstrong walked on the moon. By agreement if it is understood that any extra-terrestrial activity be referenced to a ‘Universal’ time, then that is legally GMT, UTS, Zulu. It is co-ordinated, but certain News organisations and their affilliates, particularly in the US, and because they think they created the news, have it date-stamped for their date. OK, I know that other news editors in other countries should not be lazy, but correct these anomalies. By that token, he walked on the moon on the 21st of July, 1969. Though we can share that anniversary at the very same moment, it has different days on which to do so.

    (On a different track, the short-hand for the World Trade Center attack – 9/11 – is a variant of this and represents a local, US practice of date format, generally not used elsewhere. I understand that and comprehend its meening, but wish it was more logical.)

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m not knocking the US on this score, just pointing out the inconsistencies.

    Greenwich IS halfway through the day, half the world, with about three quarters (three fourths!) of the world population, are well and truly into that day, call it Monday or whatever. Actually about 80 percent of the population live east of the GMT line, but of course some of them have only just gone to bed in say, Germany, if they were up late after their midnight. Consider China – 1.2b and India another 1 billion or so, there’s one third with just two countries.

    If I remember correctly, it gets back to the understanding of the difference between Cardinal and Calendar reckoning. This was thrashed out in the Year 2000, re the actual start of the Century, and for that matter, the Millennium. (I didn’t know it had a double ‘n’, but I did know it had an ‘i’ near the end! Now check ‘Aluminium’.)

    Ivan.

  53. hheb09'1

    I’d just like to clarify something. Britney Spears is not an anagram of Presbyterian as claimed above.

    It is an anagram of Presbyterians.

  54. james

    I am not against you but you have not presented factual evidences that Dr. Abd Al-Baset Al-Sayyid is wrong. I have checked the map, Mecca is half -way to human population almost 1/2 to the east and 1/2 to the west. You just simply dump his ideas to garbage. You know words of Aljebra, Algorithm, etc, all of these words came from arabic, they used them for astronomy calculation and later adopted by westerner. Eventhough his idea is totally wrong and if you are scentific people, you will never ever throw somone else ideas without properly come up with factual evidents that goes against it. Off course new science is always go against logical thinking because the “wrong” logical thingking is the barrier to knowledge frontier. If you were go back to 1 century and meet with your great great grand father and you said, “there are virus/bacteria living organism which are invisible to your eyes but can harm you”. You know what they said ? “You are idiot !” If you can not see them, then they are not there !”

    Same thing here, our great great grand son will laugh at us, they will said we are primitive civilization because 100-200 years from now, today’s scientific principles shall be totally different and some may contradicted to our’s.

  55. SB

    C’mon morons, get real. Of course most people, especially ultra-religious, look for evidence to support their facts. This happens everywhere. But let’s not be freaks ourselves. To say that these people want to take us back to the 7th Century is spoken like a true idiot. Proof: The Ottoman Empire consisted of Christian, Jews, Muslims, and Hindus. They all got along peacefully for over 1,000 years. Get your facts straight. They are a much more peaceful society than ours ever was.

  56. emine

    Okey guys when i will go to do my pilgrimage i will take with me a magnetic compass and make the test sounds fair right meanwhile for mathematician and designer you can check about the golden point of the earth you will see that it is in Mecca http://www.holymysteries.com/

  57. yonason

    “It’s like Al-Sayyid wrote down scientific-sounding words on a piece of paper, cut it into pieces, and drew them randomly out of a hat.”

    Well, isn’t that how the Koran was originally put together?
    http://www.sullivan-county.com/x/koran_form.htm

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