Comments on: Who says clouds screw up observing? http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/ I am an astronomer, writer, and skeptic. I likes reality the way it is, and I aims to keep it that way. My real name is Phil Plait, and I run the Bad Astronomy blog. Tue, 14 Feb 2012 18:53:17 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Link Archive | K-Squared Ramblings http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-209944 Link Archive | K-Squared Ramblings Tue, 01 Sep 2009 05:49:48 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-209944 [...] Who says clouds screw up observing? [...] [...] Who says clouds screw up observing? [...]

]]> By: Sprinky http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37292 Sprinky Sat, 02 Jun 2007 04:18:02 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37292 Beautiful picture! The weather in Boulder typically changes fast. This past week, it's been chillier than it usually is at this time of year. And, as I'm sure you've noticed by now, we get plenty of thunderstorms. Beautiful picture!

The weather in Boulder typically changes fast. This past week, it’s been chillier than it usually is at this time of year. And, as I’m sure you’ve noticed by now, we get plenty of thunderstorms.

]]> By: Brendan http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37291 Brendan Fri, 01 Jun 2007 23:33:42 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37291 I had wondered about the photograh's validity. Mostly from the clarity of the clouds. I suppose that could easily be the fact that they get almost no light, and the only time they're lit is when the lightning goes off. The lack of tree movement is easily handled by it being a windless night. At any rate, it's very pretty. @Mark Martin: As far as the weather, that's Northern Arizona. The fickle climate is something some of us even take pride in. I personally just get baffled by it, despite 20 years of living here. I had wondered about the photograh’s validity. Mostly from the clarity of the clouds. I suppose that could easily be the fact that they get almost no light, and the only time they’re lit is when the lightning goes off. The lack of tree movement is easily handled by it being a windless night. At any rate, it’s very pretty.

@Mark Martin: As far as the weather, that’s Northern Arizona. The fickle climate is something some of us even take pride in. I personally just get baffled by it, despite 20 years of living here.

]]> By: Laguna2 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37290 Laguna2 Fri, 01 Jun 2007 12:00:39 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37290 This picture is a composite of three pictures stacked together. http://www.astrotreff.de/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=57635&whichpage=2 This picture is a composite of three pictures stacked together.

http://www.astrotreff.de/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=57635&whichpage=2

]]> By: Mark Hansen http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37289 Mark Hansen Fri, 01 Jun 2007 06:42:13 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37289 To my bronchitis-addled brain, it looks like a weird lightning-cloud creature malevolently approaching the observatory. "Puny humans, I will destroy your star watching instruments!" Would make an excellent B-grade movie, maybe? It's still a beautiful picture. To my bronchitis-addled brain, it looks like a weird lightning-cloud creature malevolently approaching the observatory. “Puny humans, I will destroy your star watching instruments!”
Would make an excellent B-grade movie, maybe?

It’s still a beautiful picture.

]]> By: icemith http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37288 icemith Fri, 01 Jun 2007 04:59:34 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37288 Again, re the photo. I was reminded of a photo I took, (actually it was probably a GAF/Ansco color slide), taken with a then newish Minolta SRT101 SLR in about 1967, of close-ups of some roses growing in the backyard - by moonlight! I set up a tripod (naturally), and with only the bright moon, and bracketing the exposures, found about 15 minutes was pleasing. Aperture was probably wide open, which could have been f1.7, but I would have been then smart enough to stop it down a bit to get a sharper image. The resultant image on 50ASA stock was surreal and quite pleasing. I was proud of it and that it worked so well. I will just have to dig (and I do mean dig) that slide box out of storage. As others have mentioned or have alluded to, it does look as though the observertory/lightning photo was graphically enhanced, but as I noticed long ago, really it is all about the smooth creamy texture, no doubt caused by minute movements and light reflections, that stand out. Reciposity failure also figures in the final outcome, at least with filmstock, but I do not know if that is even a factor with digital systems. Now, tonight there is a full moon, and it will be pretty bright for a week, why not set up your camera and take advantage of the really cool moonlight. Paradoxically, it yields a "warm" rendition, quite different and unexpected. Long exposure times with the, shall we say, less expensive digital cameras may be problematic. A remote control or the older cable release will be an advantage, or follow the century old technique and use a lens cap. Sorry if this was a little off topic, but there was some connection to ethereal lighting, and I just couldn't resist. Ivan. Again, re the photo. I was reminded of a photo I took, (actually it was probably a GAF/Ansco color slide), taken with a then newish Minolta SRT101 SLR in about 1967, of close-ups of some roses growing in the backyard – by moonlight!

I set up a tripod (naturally), and with only the bright moon, and bracketing the exposures, found about 15 minutes was pleasing. Aperture was probably wide open, which could have been f1.7, but I would have been then smart enough to stop it down a bit to get a sharper image.

The resultant image on 50ASA stock was surreal and quite pleasing. I was proud of it and that it worked so well. I will just have to dig (and I do mean dig) that slide box out of storage. As others have mentioned or have alluded to, it does look as though the observertory/lightning photo was graphically enhanced, but as I noticed long ago, really it is all about the smooth creamy texture, no doubt caused by minute movements and light reflections, that stand out. Reciposity failure also figures in the final outcome, at least with filmstock, but I do not know if that is even a factor with digital systems.

Now, tonight there is a full moon, and it will be pretty bright for a week, why not set up your camera and take advantage of the really cool moonlight. Paradoxically, it yields a “warm” rendition, quite different and unexpected. Long exposure times with the, shall we say, less expensive digital cameras may be problematic. A remote control or the older cable release will be an advantage, or follow the century old technique and use a lens cap.

Sorry if this was a little off topic, but there was some connection to ethereal lighting, and I just couldn’t resist.

Ivan.

]]> By: Space Cadet http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37287 Space Cadet Fri, 01 Jun 2007 03:16:10 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37287 Hey, I traveled to Utah for the first time last summer, and as soon as we got past the salt flats we were in the biggest lightning storm I've ever seen. Bolts coming straight down into the peaks on both sides of us every thirty seconds. Scared the poop out of this California boy! Hey, I traveled to Utah for the first time last summer, and as soon as we got past the salt flats we were in the biggest lightning storm I’ve ever seen. Bolts coming straight down into the peaks on both sides of us every thirty seconds. Scared the poop out of this California boy!

]]> By: Harold http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37286 Harold Fri, 01 Jun 2007 01:29:33 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37286 Off-topic, but...according to my Astronomy calendar tonight the full Moon will be beside Jupier all night. It won't be as spectacular as the May 19 Moon-Venus pairing, but one thing it has in common with that beautiful conjunction is that MY FURSHLUGGINER SKY IS COMPLETELY CLOUDED OVER AGAIN! If you happen to have clear shies tonight, go out and see it for me. And don't forget to mark your calendars for the June 18 daytime occultation of Venus by the very young Moon. Off-topic, but…according to my Astronomy calendar tonight the full Moon will be beside Jupier all night. It won’t be as spectacular as the May 19 Moon-Venus pairing, but one thing it has in common with that beautiful conjunction is that MY FURSHLUGGINER SKY IS COMPLETELY CLOUDED OVER AGAIN! If you happen to have clear shies tonight, go out and see it for me. And don’t forget to mark your calendars for the June 18 daytime occultation of Venus by the very young Moon.

]]> By: Steve Sutton http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37285 Steve Sutton Thu, 31 May 2007 20:29:52 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37285 That's a beautiful picture. It looks almost surreal. That’s a beautiful picture. It looks almost surreal.

]]> By: Douglas McDonald http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37284 Douglas McDonald Thu, 31 May 2007 18:08:14 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37284 The thing that first caught my attention about the image...other than it is just really cool...were the apparent textures on the buildings and grass. I am in no way a graphic artist, so I can't explain this well, but the buildings have that "too smooth" look I have often seen on computer generated images. There also appears to be something in the depth of field that does not seem right. Finally, after a little exploring, I found a daylight photo of the building. In the daylight photo, the building walls look to have a very different texture than the night image has, although the day image is 2 years old and changes could have been made to the building. All of these things added together just gave me the impression of an image that was part CG and part real. The fact that the author has experience with Terragen...at least according to his website...reinforced my original perception. As I said, however, the image is very nice. My only "complaint" is that there is not a 1680X1050 version I could use as a wallpaper. :) The thing that first caught my attention about the image…other than it is just really cool…were the apparent textures on the buildings and grass. I am in no way a graphic artist, so I can’t explain this well, but the buildings have that “too smooth” look I have often seen on computer generated images. There also appears to be something in the depth of field that does not seem right. Finally, after a little exploring, I found a daylight photo of the building. In the daylight photo, the building walls look to have a very different texture than the night image has, although the day image is 2 years old and changes could have been made to the building.

All of these things added together just gave me the impression of an image that was part CG and part real. The fact that the author has experience with Terragen…at least according to his website…reinforced my original perception.

As I said, however, the image is very nice. My only “complaint” is that there is not a 1680X1050 version I could use as a wallpaper. :)

]]> By: jackd http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37283 jackd Thu, 31 May 2007 18:04:54 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37283 icemith, nice guess. I guessed the star "trails" as one degree and calculated a 4 minute exposure. With a straightedge and a protractor, you could figure the latitude of the location pretty closely, too. icemith, nice guess. I guessed the star “trails” as one degree and calculated a 4 minute exposure. With a straightedge and a protractor, you could figure the latitude of the location pretty closely, too.

]]> By: icemith http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37282 icemith Thu, 31 May 2007 17:54:36 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37282 Oh, OK. Mark. Ivan. Oh, OK. Mark.

Ivan.

]]> By: Mark Martin http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37281 Mark Martin Thu, 31 May 2007 16:25:03 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37281 "But wait…. what is that *in* that thunderhead? Is it a face?" It's just Mufasa. “But wait…. what is that *in* that thunderhead? Is it a face?”

It’s just Mufasa.

]]> By: Godless Geek http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37280 Godless Geek Thu, 31 May 2007 15:48:45 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37280 <blockquote>I buy the long exposure explination. But why are most of the star trails left to right, but the ones in the upper left corner have trails top to bottom???</blockquote> His camera was pointing north. The north pole of the celestial sphere is just above the top of the picture, just right of center, and the stars are rotating around that.

I buy the long exposure explination. But why are most of the star trails left to right, but the ones in the upper left corner have trails top to bottom???

His camera was pointing north. The north pole of the celestial sphere is just above the top of the picture, just right of center, and the stars are rotating around that.

]]> By: RWEDENS http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37279 RWEDENS Thu, 31 May 2007 15:18:15 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37279 I did not think the photo was a fake, and I buy the long exposure explination. But why are most of the star trails left to right, but the ones in the upper left corner have trails top to bottom??? Could not be shooting stars, the trails are just as long as the other stars so they had the same apparent motion as the other stars, just in a different direction. I am open to a good explination. I did not think the photo was a fake, and I buy the long exposure explination. But why are most of the star trails left to right, but the ones in the upper left corner have trails top to bottom??? Could not be shooting stars, the trails are just as long as the other stars so they had the same apparent motion as the other stars, just in a different direction. I am open to a good explination.

]]> By: Gary Ansorge http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37278 Gary Ansorge Thu, 31 May 2007 14:34:29 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37278 Thunder storms in Georgia are equally impressive. When a lightening bolt struck a tree about 50 meters from where I was standing, the light and sound were simultaneous. Intense enough to startle even me. Fortunately I was under a roof at the time. Thunder storms here usually pour down intense rain for less than 30 minutes, then dribble to a stop. I remember driving thru an intense storm in southern Calif, back in Feb.,1987, on my way to my second Dead concert at Irvine Ampitheater. It was so intense we could barely see the hood of the car, yet there were no lightening strokes. I really enjoy lightening, as long as I'm indoors,,, GAry 7 Thunder storms in Georgia are equally impressive. When a lightening bolt struck a tree about 50 meters from where I was standing, the light and sound were simultaneous. Intense enough to startle even me. Fortunately I was under a roof at the time. Thunder storms here usually pour down intense rain for less than 30 minutes, then dribble to a stop.
I remember driving thru an intense storm in southern Calif, back in Feb.,1987, on my way to my second Dead concert at Irvine Ampitheater. It was so intense we could barely see the hood of the car, yet there were no lightening strokes.
I really enjoy lightening, as long as I’m indoors,,,

GAry 7

]]> By: Irishman http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37277 Irishman Thu, 31 May 2007 14:27:21 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37277 Yes, icemith, great estimate. I've seen a bald eagle from ten feet (~3 m) away. Big, scary looking bird. It happened to be in captivity, recuperating from being shot. Yes, icemith, great estimate.

I’ve seen a bald eagle from ten feet (~3 m) away. Big, scary looking bird. It happened to be in captivity, recuperating from being shot.

]]> By: icemith http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37249 icemith Thu, 31 May 2007 14:07:23 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37249 How's that for an educated guess? I was correct with the exposure. I have just opened the original newsletter as provided by the link above in Phil"s blog. Canon30D, 5 mins., and it needed that wide 25mm (Equivalent) view. Nice shot. Also, some other interesting things there on the SpaceWeather site. Ivan. How’s that for an educated guess? I was correct with the exposure. I have just opened the original newsletter as provided by the link above in Phil”s blog. Canon30D, 5 mins., and it needed that wide 25mm (Equivalent) view. Nice shot.

Also, some other interesting things there on the SpaceWeather site.

Ivan.

]]> By: Rui Borges http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37276 Rui Borges Thu, 31 May 2007 13:58:58 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37276 That's just...stunning! :-) That’s just…stunning! :-)

]]> By: Kelvin http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37275 Kelvin Thu, 31 May 2007 13:49:40 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37275 Those jokes are absolutely - shocking! An electrifying experience. Though some of you may get a charge out of it, others may find themselves feeling either positive or negative about the whole thing. Name a famous TV star who feared lightning - ROD Serling! Lightning rod, get it? Those jokes are absolutely – shocking!

An electrifying experience.

Though some of you may get a charge out of it, others may
find themselves feeling either positive or negative about the
whole thing.

Name a famous TV star who feared lightning – ROD Serling!

Lightning rod, get it?

]]> By: icemith http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37274 icemith Thu, 31 May 2007 13:42:55 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37274 Re that photo: How could anybody just assert that it was fake, just like that? I would like to know why a couple of posters thought so. And yes others offered reasons why it was "different", to which I concur. I'd say the exposure would have been close to 5 minutes, going by the star trails. And the light is coming from different directions. Even the reflections in the shiny bits indicates that. But wait.... what is that *in* that thunderhead? Is it a face? It looks familiar.... hmmm.. does the word pareidolia come to mind? Ivan. Re that photo: How could anybody just assert that it was fake, just like that? I would like to know why a couple of posters thought so. And yes others offered reasons why it was “different”, to which I concur.

I’d say the exposure would have been close to 5 minutes, going by the star trails. And the light is coming from different directions. Even the reflections in the shiny bits indicates that.

But wait…. what is that *in* that thunderhead? Is it a face? It looks familiar…. hmmm.. does the word pareidolia come to mind?

Ivan.

]]> By: Godless Geek http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37273 Godless Geek Thu, 31 May 2007 12:48:19 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37273 I saw a bald eagle about three years ago in south Alabama where I used to live, about 20 miles north of the Florida border, and two more last year on a kayaking trip down the Coosa River, north of Wetumpka, AL They are absolutely awe inspiring. The first one I saw was particularly striking. I was driving home, through the country, and it was sitting on a fence post about 20 yards off the road. It had never occurred to me how huge they were until then. I saw a bald eagle about three years ago in south Alabama where I used to live, about 20 miles north of the Florida border, and two more last year on a kayaking trip down the Coosa River, north of Wetumpka, AL They are absolutely awe inspiring. The first one I saw was particularly striking. I was driving home, through the country, and it was sitting on a fence post about 20 yards off the road. It had never occurred to me how huge they were until then.

]]> By: Sticks http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37272 Sticks Thu, 31 May 2007 11:00:26 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37272 I see now Fox TV presents "Did BA really go to Boulder" ;) I see now

Fox TV presents “Did BA really go to Boulder” ;)

]]> By: Ian http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37271 Ian Thu, 31 May 2007 07:48:03 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37271 So obviously fake that image :) So obviously fake that image :)

]]> By: Danny Schade http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/comment-page-1/#comment-37270 Danny Schade Thu, 31 May 2007 05:50:28 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2007/05/30/who-says-clouds-screw-up-observing/#comment-37270 Hey BA, What coffee shop do you usually hang out at? Hey BA,
What coffee shop do you usually hang out at?

]]>