I received an email today that is one of the best I’ve gotten all year, if not of all time. I will simply post it here, with permission from the author, Linda Lindsey.
To: badastro@badastronomy.com
Subject: Thank you for helping me get married
Bet you’ve never gotten that one before. But, yeah, if it weren’t for you and your info on the moon hoax we never would have gotten married.
Here’s the story. While working in Iraq, I met the most wonderful man. After several months we both realized that our relationship could possibly lead to marriage. There was just one problem. He seemed to believe every conspiracy theory out there, thanks to his bizarre grandmother. One of those was the moon hoax. I knew that I could never spend the rest of my life with a man who could not see the difference between reality and woowoo. Therefore, I devised a test. If he could indeed overcome his overbearing grandmother’s force fed ideas to understand the truth, I would have to go ring shopping.
I decided that the moon hoax would be the simplest to conspiracy to tackle. I already knew about you and pulled up your website, then spent several government hours and pages of printer paper to assemble a little packet that I insisted that he read. He did and began arguing his point. Every “proof” that he would come up with I would hunt up, usually finding the answer somewhere on your website, and present to him. It took a few weeks, but he ran out of arguments. I then laid all the paperwork out on the bed in front of him, introduced him to the idea of Occam’s Razor and rational deduction. Another week or so went by, and he started asking questions and for clarification of various facts.
In February of 2006, we got married while home on R&R. We’ve been slowly tackling Evolution (thanks to Carl Sagan), the grassy knoll and the Holocaust. I’m happy to say that he no longer automatically believes what people in “authority” tell him. He thinks things through for himself, talks to me about them and does research on the Internet by himself (an amazing feat when you know that he, a man who is now 40, never used a computer before 2005). He’s come a long way, and I get joy out of showing him new things and listening to him tell me about various scientific discoveries he’s read about. A whole new world has opened up to him. It’s all because you laid out the facts in such an accessible manner.
So, thank you for helping me discover that this wonderful man is truly as incredible as I thought he would be. We look forward to growing old together, bantering ideas about and mock battling over that silly sound stage idea.
Linda Lindsey
Ain’t reality grand?
December 20th, 2007 at 2:21 pm
You’re the one that lead to my conversion from Christian to Atheist. I’m not sure whether that’s a good thing or too much of a taboo on this site, but it’s true. You introduced me to skepticism, and that was a life saver. I questioned my beliefs and found truth. So my story wasn’t quite as dramatic and beautiful as this one, but believe me: you’ve changed my life in positive ways I never dreamed of.
Thank you, Bad Astronomer!
December 20th, 2007 at 2:22 pm
Congratulations Linda! Not only for the marriage but in helping someone discover that the truth really is out there, for somebody willing to look at the facts and use sound logic. Your story gives me a little bit of hope.
December 20th, 2007 at 2:25 pm
What a lovely Christmas present – a big dollop of extra strength Feel Good Factor! Better than a pair of socks any day.
Seems like your work here is almost done… (if only!)
Elwood
p.s. Someone recently told me my music had “healing powers” – not literally of course; he meant it in a complimentary way, so I know just how you feel right now!
December 20th, 2007 at 2:27 pm
Congratulations!
And we all know the truth behind the Grassy Knoll:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6naJ08Tskk
December 20th, 2007 at 2:47 pm
Get the facts, examine the evidence, and think for yourself.
What I don’t get is why this is so difficult for so many people.
December 20th, 2007 at 2:54 pm
It is difficult for me to point out something in which the BA has helped me out since I came here as a skeptic and I still am. But one thing is for sure! It sure gave me some really good stuff to point out when arguing someone who believes in woowoo crap!
That’s why BA is one of the first blogs I pay a visit “religiously” every single day! xD
December 20th, 2007 at 2:55 pm
Congratulations to the happy couple and to Phil for being the “best man” to set the record straight!
~David D.G.
December 20th, 2007 at 2:59 pm
Congratulations Linda! You must take more credit for the conversion, because you were prepared and patient when talking with your husband. He is very lucky to have you!
December 20th, 2007 at 3:01 pm
I’m glad this worked out for them! I tried dating a creationist for almost 2 years, on the track for marriage, and she just would not open her mind to any evidence that the evolution is real, and the geological features we enjoy were created over millions and billions of years, not overnight in “the flood”.
We separated for other reasons, but I am both glad to be free from her irrationality, and saddened that I was unable to bring her or her family to reality.
December 20th, 2007 at 3:25 pm
“We’ve been slowly tackling Evolution (thanks to Carl Sagan), the grassy knoll and the Holocaust.”
Holocaust? Am I missing something?
December 20th, 2007 at 3:26 pm
So what you’re saying is that the StarWars program really did get built, but Dr. Plait uses it as his personal Cupid’s Bow? Wiley Plait… you do weave a certain brand of magic.
December 20th, 2007 at 3:30 pm
So, Dr. Plait, do you know any hot single women? How much do you charge for your Matchmaking service? Maybe you could set me up?
December 20th, 2007 at 3:31 pm
Rob, I’m sure she is referring to Holocaust denial, not the Holocaust itself.
J. D.
December 20th, 2007 at 3:34 pm
She didn’t finish the list. I’m sure Roswell, cold fusion (suppression of), Mars face, Jupiter bomb, A.I taking over the world, vampires, and various secret societies also need debunking.
December 20th, 2007 at 3:36 pm
Nice try Ken (obviously an AI bot), but I don’t think AI taking over the world belongs on that list.
December 20th, 2007 at 3:47 pm
I’ll bet he believes in the NAFTA Superhighway, too. That’s a tricky one to handle because there *is* something called the Trans Texas Corridor which is controversial all on its own, and also has the fears of some sort of North American Union attached to it.
Hey, Phil! Can you get me hooked up with someone?
Please?
No?
Oh, OK.
(kicks pebble)
December 20th, 2007 at 4:16 pm
Thanks for a lovely story. Sometimes the truth wins, yay.
I am on the verge of giving up on people like that. When the woo woos talk, I just smile and nod. Arguing with them is generally a waste of time. Case in point–it took Linda weeks of research and effort on someone who was in love with her to get through. I don’t have the time or inclination to try this on, for example, my assistant (a sweet woman who is a lost cause, for sure).
Lately I have been concentrating my efforts on those on the fence. This site and Snopes are good sources for email replies, but you really have to be selective, because some people find reality offensive.
December 20th, 2007 at 4:18 pm
Well, how do you like that?
Congratulations, Linda!
Phil Plait: Astronomer and… Matchmaker?
December 20th, 2007 at 4:20 pm
That’s a great story.
All you’ve ever done for me, Phil, is show me that looking up is just as important as looking down when it comes to where we are going.
I’ll admit, the neck was a little “crunchy” at first, but after a while, it seems those stiff and stuck vertebrae move a little easier. So, good job, and keep up the good work.
December 20th, 2007 at 4:39 pm
Great story, hopefully she can kick that Holocaust denial garbage out of his head too.
December 20th, 2007 at 4:45 pm
Bah – conspiracy theories. Here’s a crib sheet you can pass on to similar slack-jawed yokels:
* Kennedy was killed by one homicidal loony, acting alone.
* The moon landing happened, driven by the American fear that if they didn’t get there first the Soviets would.
* Evolution isn’t a “theory”, except in the strict scientific sense of the word; in day-to-day parlance it’s most accurately described as a fact.
* The Nazis killed millions of Jews, Gypsies, homosexuals and other people because they were a fairly efficient bunch of bigoted thugs.
* The Loch Ness Monster is a local running gag blown up into something big by the yearning for tourism income.
* The Iraq war was a panicked attempt to gain a foothold in a difficult political region, run by well-meaning but mediocre politicians who just got out of their depth really quickly.
* John Kerry was a Thirulean shape-shifter whose voidship crashed in up-state NY in 1948, and he lost the election because his gengineered psionic coercive ability was cancelled out by a pocket-sized anti-psi generator produced by a branch of the secret service set up during the Nixon administration to protect the president using reverse-engineered Roswell technology.
I hope that helps.
December 20th, 2007 at 5:16 pm
Congratulations, Linda. I hope your marriage is long and happy!!!
(And way to go, Phil!)
December 20th, 2007 at 5:50 pm
Oh wow! Thank you guys for all the warm wishes.
Don’t worry, he hasn’t quit asking questions or reevaluating ideas. He doesn’t believe all the conspiracy theories out there, just some of the older ones that his grandmother taught him.
And Ken, although Roswell isn’t on his list, Area 51 has becoming an on-going joke with us because I was stationed at Nellis for a bit. He says I’m just keeping the alien secrets from him. Thank goodness he’s joking on that one.
I’m glad I could brighten some days with the story. I’m so proud of him, thankful to Phil and hopeful about our future.
December 20th, 2007 at 5:53 pm
While we’re thanking Phil for stuff…
Phil, you were the one who introduced me to the skeptical blogosphere.
I originally found you while looking up anagrams… You’re the moon trash debater.
December 20th, 2007 at 5:57 pm
I am all for helping someone find their path to reality, and I am very happy for Linda and her new hubby. Congratulations!
That being said, isn’t this another example of a person (man or woman) trying to change their significant other/spouse into something they’re not? Of course, its a good thing in this case. Nothing like changing a person’s ways with a constant barrage of gentle nagging.
December 20th, 2007 at 6:27 pm
Congratulations to Linda for her success with her hubby’s conversion to reality. It’s not easy to reverse a lifetime of woo-woo brainwashing even with Phil’s help.
Then there’s today’s Dear Abby. Her answer to the woman leery of marriage because of what a “so accurate” plam reader told her, unfortunately, wasn’t up to Phil’s standards. Abby even says some woo-woo artists are “remarkabley accurate.” Then rather than exposing the lunacy of palm reading she spins the reading into something she considers as positive rather than negative. A good illustration of how vague these “remarkably accurate” predictions really are.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ucda/20071220/lf_ucda/womanfretsthatherfutureinlovemaybeallinthecards;_ylt=A0WTUdGhEWtH5UQBvjLNbbUC
December 20th, 2007 at 8:28 pm
Rick: Nice link. Amazing what some people will do or believe. To the deluded lady, yes, your first husband may die, but you may also be married for 50 years and he’ll expire before you do of old age. You will move into a nursing home, get hooked up with a 95 year old horny old man, and marry him. Therefore, your palm reader was quite right. You will have 2 husbands. *Michael rolls eyes, slams head into desk*
BTW the only palm reading I’ve ever done was in High School when I wrote cheat notes on my palm. Unfortunately they were the wrong notes… Moral: Palm Reading does not work.
I have a new dating intro, Phil if it will help:
Man with 8 inch Dob seeks Starry eyed woman. It could be Heavenly… No?
December 20th, 2007 at 8:57 pm
Reality is not always harsh. It can be romantic.
December 21st, 2007 at 2:13 am
Thomas Malthus does not approve!
December 21st, 2007 at 5:20 am
Eric TF Bat:
Well, at least you got one right.
December 21st, 2007 at 6:28 am
That Guy posts:
[[You’re the one that lead to my conversion from Christian to Atheist. I’m not sure whether that’s a good thing or too much of a taboo on this site, but it’s true. You introduced me to skepticism, and that was a life saver. I questioned my beliefs and found truth. ]]
*sigh*
I wish people would stop conflating religion with pseudoscience. There is no pseudoscience I believe in, but that doesn’t stop me from being a born-again Christian. Nor does my Christianity stop me from doing science, as much as I am able.
December 21st, 2007 at 6:49 am
Cattle mutilations are up this year.
December 21st, 2007 at 7:03 am
Barton Paul Levenson,
Religion in itself does not equate with pseudoscience. That being said, holding to some religious beliefs (e.g. biblical inerrancy) indicate either a lack of critical thinking ability, a tendency to assert something that hasn’t been critically examined, or an unwillingness to examine beliefs when doing so might cause discomfort. None of those traits are desireable when engaging in scientific thought.
I too am religious, but I hesitate to call myself Christian (though that was my upbringing) and would certainly not call myself “born-again”. I routinely question my religious beliefs, discarding any that can be disproven. The very few I have left are irrational in that I have no basis in rational thought to support them, but there is nothing in reality that contradicts them, and they provide me with a small amount of emotional comfort in dealing with my mortality. More importantly, I am well aware that my beliefs are irrational.
December 21st, 2007 at 7:14 am
I found this website several years ago when I was still in High School (or right after graduation sometime…) and it was entertaining and educating to read about all misconceptions hoaxes and other silliness, as well as all the rest of the stuff on your main site. I was a space “geek” well before though, but your website opened up a new frontier of things to investigate. I have been discussing some of the goofiness people believe with my friends, and it’s fun to teach people about this kind of stuff. I even bought your book and read that during my conscription.(My Swedish military service, that is.) I continue to check out your blog every day and it’s always interesting. Keep up the great work!
December 21st, 2007 at 7:43 am
I’m going to completely avoid the Christian apologism for the moment and simply say that this is nice to see, regardless of the backstory. Good work, Doctor.
December 21st, 2007 at 8:59 am
Doc: I agree, religious faith, of any type, I suppose, can provide a sense of comfort when confronted with the unknown. I think even the most skeptical among us would have to agree that there is still, and will probably always be an element of the unknown in the human experience. Personally, I have followed the teachings of the Bible for 24 years of my life, before abandoning it. In those 24 years I found no concrete evidence for the existence of God, let alone a personal being that took an interest in my daily affairs. Yes, I prayed. Yes, some of those prayers were “answered.” However, was that due to coincidence, or divine providence? I tend to think the former.
Granted, I did have one or two bizarre incidents that I simply cannot explain, however, at this point I cannot prove one way or the other if they were the result of the hand of God, as they were personal, and I have no concrete proof. And no, praying for a parking spot in front of the place you need to be, and finding one does not count. I cannot tell you how many times I heard that one during “Sunday Night Testimony Time!” What, God can give you a parking spot, but can’t restore a missing limb, or feed the hungry, or stop the genocide in Darfur?
What happens when we draw our last breath? Some here, like Barton would probably say, “Well if you believe in Christ, you go to heaven. if you don’t, you go to hell.” Others would say, “You are dead. Your existence is over. Your body disintegrates and that is it.” Still others might say, “I simply don’t know.” At this time in my life, that is where if fit.
December 21st, 2007 at 9:40 am
One more thing to ponder that relates to this. I am amazed and confounded when I see Criss Angel perform some of his illusions. But I am not willing to say that he has some kind of divine, supernatural power. Even he states it is all an illusion.
December 21st, 2007 at 10:15 am
I guess Carl Sagan was the one who originally set me down the right path when I used to watch Cosmos way back in the day. When I came across this site, I was already very much the skeptic. I visit this site nearly every day to read how much further down the drain rational thinking has swirled. So it is quite nice to read this story about someone who worked long and hard to ‘save’ the one she loves!
Heck, I’ve got such a warm fuzzy that I’m not even going to point out that religion is, indeed, a pseudo science, what with divine intervention being akin to psychic powers, with zero evidence of either.
Nope, just gonna let that one drop!
December 21st, 2007 at 1:35 pm
Doc said:
Religion in itself does not equate with pseudoscience. That being said, holding to some religious beliefs (e.g. biblical inerrancy) indicate either a lack of critical thinking ability, a tendency to assert something that hasn’t been critically examined, or an unwillingness to examine beliefs when doing so might cause discomfort. None of those traits are desireable when engaging in scientific thought.
Nicely put, Doc! You said it much more clearly than I could have.
Barton Paul Levenson, I read That Guy’s post the same way Doc apparently did: that he was saying skepticism led him away from pseudoscience and also from religion, not that it led him away from religion because it is a pseudoscience.
In fact, religion is not a pseudoscience. It’s a non-science, like ethics, morality, esthetics. The basic tenets are generally things that can’t be tested empirically, and so just aren’t there, scientifically, to be proved or not.
December 21st, 2007 at 2:20 pm
My GF is an eastern European with an ingrained belief in various types of traditional healing, which she received from her mother, a nurse. I can’t get into arguments with her on why ‘cupping’ isn’t going to relieve chest congestion any more, but I have been able to explain why homeopathic remedies don’t work. And I’ve developed a useful shorthand to get straight to the point and limit the emotional fireworks, and have tried it on others as well.
“Magic Doesn’t Work.”
I find this statement tends to make people stop and think about what they are claiming, because they think they agree with it already. I have seen some of them realize a need to examine their own beliefs on the subject when faced with it. Otherwise how could I be calling it magic?
Steve “From Homeo, meaning expensive, and pathic, meaning ‘doesn’t work’.” James
December 22nd, 2007 at 12:57 pm
Lidsay, you had the dude when you spread it all out on the bed, forget facts & logic, that’s all it takes to win an argument with a man.
December 29th, 2007 at 4:27 am
“In fact, religion is not a pseudoscience. It’s a non-science, like ethics, morality, esthetics. The basic tenets are generally things that can’t be tested empirically, and so just aren’t there, scientifically, to be proved or not.”
That’s entirely true, _but_ the religious mode of thought has a great deal in common with pseudoscience and conspiracy hypotheses. (No, I won’t use the word “theory” to describe them.)
In all three, the conclusion comes before the premises, whether that conclusion is that god exists, that arranging your furniture a certain way will make you rich, or that little green men crashed in the New Mexico desert. The mode of thought and the methods of denying reality are all the same.
*ahem*
Congratulations, Linda! I wish you and your newly minted skeptic many happy years together. =)