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	<title>Comments on: Dark matter detected?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/</link>
	<description>I am an astronomer, writer, and skeptic. I likes reality the way it is, and I aims to keep it that way. My real name is Phil Plait, and I run the Bad Astronomy blog.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 14 Feb 2012 16:11:49 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: EXOman</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-227200</link>
		<dc:creator>EXOman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 23:34:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-227200</guid>
		<description>The WIPP facility in Carlsbad New Mexico is hosting an experiment that will be the first to detect dark matter in 2010.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The WIPP facility in Carlsbad New Mexico is hosting an experiment that will be the first to detect dark matter in 2010.</p>
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		<title>By: Tissa Perera</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83766</link>
		<dc:creator>Tissa Perera</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 May 2008 18:04:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83766</guid>
		<description>Do not waste time trying to find Dark Matter physically.
Go to my website &#039;cosmicdarkmatter.com&#039; and I give
a strong hint what the Dark Matter trick is all about
along with a few more hints of Physics.

/Tissa Perera</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do not waste time trying to find Dark Matter physically.<br />
Go to my website &#8216;cosmicdarkmatter.com&#8217; and I give<br />
a strong hint what the Dark Matter trick is all about<br />
along with a few more hints of Physics.</p>
<p>/Tissa Perera</p>
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		<title>By: the new shelton wet/dry</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83765</link>
		<dc:creator>the new shelton wet/dry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 May 2008 20:30:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83765</guid>
		<description>[...] team of researchers in Italy are claiming to have directly detected dark matter particles. More: Half of 1/25th of the missing Universe is [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] team of researchers in Italy are claiming to have directly detected dark matter particles. More: Half of 1/25th of the missing Universe is [...]</p>
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		<title>By: G. Evans</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83764</link>
		<dc:creator>G. Evans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 May 2008 17:20:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83764</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve read more skeptical assessments of the Italian experiment, and it appears that there are other, more likely, explanations for the observed signal.  The whole dark matter issue is problematic.  You say &quot;we know dark matter exists,&quot; but that isn&#039;t true.  What we know is that the current model of gravitational mechanics cannot account for the motion observed in large scale gravitational systems.  There is no observational evidence otherwise of dark matter.  To invoke dark matter is reminiscent of the concept of the ether.  The ether was invoked to explain otherwise inexplicable observations.  Ether failed as a useful concept, because the underlying thinking was flawed.  It seems quite possible that the current thinking behind gravitational theory is flawed and that dark matter will go the way of ether and phlogiston.  It is a disservice to science to make statements like, &quot;we know dark matter exists.&quot;  We know no such thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve read more skeptical assessments of the Italian experiment, and it appears that there are other, more likely, explanations for the observed signal.  The whole dark matter issue is problematic.  You say &#8220;we know dark matter exists,&#8221; but that isn&#8217;t true.  What we know is that the current model of gravitational mechanics cannot account for the motion observed in large scale gravitational systems.  There is no observational evidence otherwise of dark matter.  To invoke dark matter is reminiscent of the concept of the ether.  The ether was invoked to explain otherwise inexplicable observations.  Ether failed as a useful concept, because the underlying thinking was flawed.  It seems quite possible that the current thinking behind gravitational theory is flawed and that dark matter will go the way of ether and phlogiston.  It is a disservice to science to make statements like, &#8220;we know dark matter exists.&#8221;  We know no such thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard D. Saam</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83763</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard D. Saam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:30:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83763</guid>
		<description>In regards to DAMA observed annual oscillation,
a question comes to mind in terms of the following logic:

What about the following logic:

Given the statement:

--
The Milky Way is moving at around 600 km/s
with respect to the photons of the Cosmic Microwave Background (CMB).
This has been observed by satellites
such as COBE and WMAP as a dipole contribution to the CMB,
as photons in equilibrium at the CMB frame
get blue-shifted in the direction of the motion
and red-shifted in the opposite direction.
--

and also:

--
the solar system is orbiting galactic center at about 200 km/sec
--

and also:

--
the earth has a velocity of 30 km/sec around the sun.
--
and also

--
ref: Dark Matter search
http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0307403
Fig 10

Harmonic DAMA/NaI experimental data
indicates an annual oscillation of detected radiation flux
detected on earth.
--

Has anyone done the trigonometry in order to calculate
the correlation of annual DAMA/NaI experimental data
on earth due to earth_solar annual differential velocity projection
to CMB velocity vector?

I have found some information to answer the question.
Possibly you could comment.

The CMB &#039;hot spot&#039; or &#039;wind origin&#039; is in constellation Leo

http://aether.lbl.gov/www/projects/u2/

Now the earth moves around the sun at 30 km/sec
The hypothesis would be that average flux would be
when earth - sun line
would be parallel
to earth - Leo line
which occurs September 1 (sun in Leo) and March 1.
with maximum flux (earth against the CMB dipole wind) on December 1
and minimum (CMB dipole wind to earth&#039;s back) on June 1.

This is 180 degrees out of phase with your data
but perhaps that is a reflection of dark matter reality

This CMB dipole wind and earth solar rotation
are then approximately 180 degrees of phase with data expressed in:

http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0307403
Fig 10

http://arxiv.org/abs/0704.3543
Figure 2

where t0 = 152.5 is ~June 1 (maximum flux)

Is this a coincidence or an indication
of connection between DAMA/NaI observed data and CMB dipole wind.

I am interested in the above from the point of view
that dark matter exists in congruence with CMB
and critical space density as follows:

m/B3 ~ critical space density 2 H2 / (8 pi G) = 6E-30 g/cm3

where:

B = 22 cm
m = 56 Mev/c2 (110 x electron mass)

and may be a source of your observed annual DAMA NaI observation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In regards to DAMA observed annual oscillation,<br />
a question comes to mind in terms of the following logic:</p>
<p>What about the following logic:</p>
<p>Given the statement:</p>
<p>&#8211;<br />
The Milky Way is moving at around 600 km/s<br />
with respect to the photons of the Cosmic Microwave Background (CMB).<br />
This has been observed by satellites<br />
such as COBE and WMAP as a dipole contribution to the CMB,<br />
as photons in equilibrium at the CMB frame<br />
get blue-shifted in the direction of the motion<br />
and red-shifted in the opposite direction.<br />
&#8211;</p>
<p>and also:</p>
<p>&#8211;<br />
the solar system is orbiting galactic center at about 200 km/sec<br />
&#8211;</p>
<p>and also:</p>
<p>&#8211;<br />
the earth has a velocity of 30 km/sec around the sun.<br />
&#8211;<br />
and also</p>
<p>&#8211;<br />
ref: Dark Matter search<br />
<a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0307403" rel="nofollow">http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0307403</a><br />
Fig 10</p>
<p>Harmonic DAMA/NaI experimental data<br />
indicates an annual oscillation of detected radiation flux<br />
detected on earth.<br />
&#8211;</p>
<p>Has anyone done the trigonometry in order to calculate<br />
the correlation of annual DAMA/NaI experimental data<br />
on earth due to earth_solar annual differential velocity projection<br />
to CMB velocity vector?</p>
<p>I have found some information to answer the question.<br />
Possibly you could comment.</p>
<p>The CMB &#8216;hot spot&#8217; or &#8216;wind origin&#8217; is in constellation Leo</p>
<p><a href="http://aether.lbl.gov/www/projects/u2/" rel="nofollow">http://aether.lbl.gov/www/projects/u2/</a></p>
<p>Now the earth moves around the sun at 30 km/sec<br />
The hypothesis would be that average flux would be<br />
when earth &#8211; sun line<br />
would be parallel<br />
to earth &#8211; Leo line<br />
which occurs September 1 (sun in Leo) and March 1.<br />
with maximum flux (earth against the CMB dipole wind) on December 1<br />
and minimum (CMB dipole wind to earth&#8217;s back) on June 1.</p>
<p>This is 180 degrees out of phase with your data<br />
but perhaps that is a reflection of dark matter reality</p>
<p>This CMB dipole wind and earth solar rotation<br />
are then approximately 180 degrees of phase with data expressed in:</p>
<p><a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0307403" rel="nofollow">http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0307403</a><br />
Fig 10</p>
<p><a href="http://arxiv.org/abs/0704.3543" rel="nofollow">http://arxiv.org/abs/0704.3543</a><br />
Figure 2</p>
<p>where t0 = 152.5 is ~June 1 (maximum flux)</p>
<p>Is this a coincidence or an indication<br />
of connection between DAMA/NaI observed data and CMB dipole wind.</p>
<p>I am interested in the above from the point of view<br />
that dark matter exists in congruence with CMB<br />
and critical space density as follows:</p>
<p>m/B3 ~ critical space density 2 H2 / (8 pi G) = 6E-30 g/cm3</p>
<p>where:</p>
<p>B = 22 cm<br />
m = 56 Mev/c2 (110 x electron mass)</p>
<p>and may be a source of your observed annual DAMA NaI observation.</p>
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		<title>By: The AstroStat Slog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Is 8-sigma significant enough for you?</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83762</link>
		<dc:creator>The AstroStat Slog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Is 8-sigma significant enough for you?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 18:57:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83762</guid>
		<description>[...] of the direct detection of the effects of Dark Matter that is causing a lot of buzz. (The Bad Astronomer has a good summary.) They find yearly modulation in their detected scintillation rate that matches [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] of the direct detection of the effects of Dark Matter that is causing a lot of buzz. (The Bad Astronomer has a good summary.) They find yearly modulation in their detected scintillation rate that matches [...]</p>
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		<title>By: TMB</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83761</link>
		<dc:creator>TMB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Apr 2008 18:40:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83761</guid>
		<description>Oops, forgot my footnotes. ;-)

1: Don&#039;t get confused by the fact that the consensus is that we live in a &quot;cold dark matter&quot; (CDM) universe... although they both refer to the same aspect of dark matter (the relative velocity dispersion of nearby dark matter particles), the &quot;cold&quot; in CDM basically means that they&#039;re not moving relativistically, merely at a pedestrian 200 km/s. That&#039;s still plenty &quot;hot&quot; enough to keep them from clustering around the Earth, though.

2: This is known as the &quot;Jeans mass&quot;, and is actually the same quantity that&#039;s used when talking about the collapse of gas clouds to form stars. In that case, it&#039;s the individual atoms in the gas cloud that are moving about (we normally call that temperature... see point 1 above), and you need a given amount of mass to have enough gravity to overcome a given temperature.

Viggen, think of it this way: If you walk into a sprinkler, you&#039;ll get wetter than if you walk away from it. GR doesn&#039;t prevent water droplets from having a special direction with respect to the center of their distribution. Same thing with dark matter in a galaxy.

[TMB]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oops, forgot my footnotes. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>1: Don&#8217;t get confused by the fact that the consensus is that we live in a &#8220;cold dark matter&#8221; (CDM) universe&#8230; although they both refer to the same aspect of dark matter (the relative velocity dispersion of nearby dark matter particles), the &#8220;cold&#8221; in CDM basically means that they&#8217;re not moving relativistically, merely at a pedestrian 200 km/s. That&#8217;s still plenty &#8220;hot&#8221; enough to keep them from clustering around the Earth, though.</p>
<p>2: This is known as the &#8220;Jeans mass&#8221;, and is actually the same quantity that&#8217;s used when talking about the collapse of gas clouds to form stars. In that case, it&#8217;s the individual atoms in the gas cloud that are moving about (we normally call that temperature&#8230; see point 1 above), and you need a given amount of mass to have enough gravity to overcome a given temperature.</p>
<p>Viggen, think of it this way: If you walk into a sprinkler, you&#8217;ll get wetter than if you walk away from it. GR doesn&#8217;t prevent water droplets from having a special direction with respect to the center of their distribution. Same thing with dark matter in a galaxy.</p>
<p>[TMB]</p>
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		<title>By: Count Iblis</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83760</link>
		<dc:creator>Count Iblis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Apr 2008 17:00:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83760</guid>
		<description>Excluding small subtle effects like the Ski season meantioned by Sean above somehow causing the modulation looks difficult. But there are a few reasons to believe that the detected effect is nontrivial. Apart from the detailed limits on background effects given by DAMA in their paper, there are a few things we can see from the data itself:

1) The amplitude and phase of the annual modulation are consistent with what you would expect from a DM signal.


2) The DAMA/LIBRA signal is within the error margin of the DAMA/NaI signal, except for a 2 sigma deviation in one energy bin. After  dismantling the old apparatus, and installing the new detector and presumably making changes to other things as well, how likely is it for the alleged systematic error to cause a fake DM like signal within the bounds of the previously &quot;detected&quot; signal?


3) Absense of spurious signals. Sean&#039;s hypothetical ski season effect has a period of one year, but such an effect, however it is supposed to work, will generically have higher harmonics with relatively large amplitudes. The effect causing the detected signal does not. It seems to vary quite smoothly over the course of a year, consistent with how an expected DM signal should behave.


4) Absense of an annual modulation in the multiple hit  signal. The DAMA/NaI and DAMA/LIBRA experiment use not one but a few detectors. Unlike weakly interacting DM particles, cosmic rays like muons have a significant probability of hitting more than one detector. By looking at the multiple hit events you can estimate the background. If the annual modulation were to be caused by variations in the muon flux you would see an annual modulation in the multiple hit rates as well.

Another thing to think about:

The DAMA team made public a very significant effect, but there are smaller effects like a diurnal modulation (caused by the rotation of the earth) that by now should be visible but are probably not yet statistically significant. If such signals turn out to be nonexisting in the future as more data comes in, then that would falsify that the annual modulation is due to DM.

So, I guess that the DAMA team waited until they saw a diurnal modulation constent with what one would expect given the annual modulation and went ahead with announcing the annual modulation results.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excluding small subtle effects like the Ski season meantioned by Sean above somehow causing the modulation looks difficult. But there are a few reasons to believe that the detected effect is nontrivial. Apart from the detailed limits on background effects given by DAMA in their paper, there are a few things we can see from the data itself:</p>
<p>1) The amplitude and phase of the annual modulation are consistent with what you would expect from a DM signal.</p>
<p>2) The DAMA/LIBRA signal is within the error margin of the DAMA/NaI signal, except for a 2 sigma deviation in one energy bin. After  dismantling the old apparatus, and installing the new detector and presumably making changes to other things as well, how likely is it for the alleged systematic error to cause a fake DM like signal within the bounds of the previously &#8220;detected&#8221; signal?</p>
<p>3) Absense of spurious signals. Sean&#8217;s hypothetical ski season effect has a period of one year, but such an effect, however it is supposed to work, will generically have higher harmonics with relatively large amplitudes. The effect causing the detected signal does not. It seems to vary quite smoothly over the course of a year, consistent with how an expected DM signal should behave.</p>
<p>4) Absense of an annual modulation in the multiple hit  signal. The DAMA/NaI and DAMA/LIBRA experiment use not one but a few detectors. Unlike weakly interacting DM particles, cosmic rays like muons have a significant probability of hitting more than one detector. By looking at the multiple hit events you can estimate the background. If the annual modulation were to be caused by variations in the muon flux you would see an annual modulation in the multiple hit rates as well.</p>
<p>Another thing to think about:</p>
<p>The DAMA team made public a very significant effect, but there are smaller effects like a diurnal modulation (caused by the rotation of the earth) that by now should be visible but are probably not yet statistically significant. If such signals turn out to be nonexisting in the future as more data comes in, then that would falsify that the annual modulation is due to DM.</p>
<p>So, I guess that the DAMA team waited until they saw a diurnal modulation constent with what one would expect given the annual modulation and went ahead with announcing the annual modulation results.</p>
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		<title>By: Lo'ihi</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83759</link>
		<dc:creator>Lo'ihi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 21:49:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83759</guid>
		<description>If DAMA experiment team is confident enough about the source of this monumental discovery, they should counter Juan Collar at the Cosmic Variance head on with their data and their interpretation.  I bet they welcome DAMA&#039;s response.  If they don&#039;t, that itself seems to provide a clue as to the confidence level of their
 claim.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If DAMA experiment team is confident enough about the source of this monumental discovery, they should counter Juan Collar at the Cosmic Variance head on with their data and their interpretation.  I bet they welcome DAMA&#8217;s response.  If they don&#8217;t, that itself seems to provide a clue as to the confidence level of their<br />
 claim.</p>
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		<title>By: ThomasJeffersonJr</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83758</link>
		<dc:creator>ThomasJeffersonJr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 21:15:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83758</guid>
		<description>What if we have tapped into the Galactic Internet?

Will they ban us?  Or did we pass the test thanks to the Italians?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What if we have tapped into the Galactic Internet?</p>
<p>Will they ban us?  Or did we pass the test thanks to the Italians?</p>
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		<title>By: Evolving Squid</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83757</link>
		<dc:creator>Evolving Squid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 17:09:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83757</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;While that is in principle true, galactic dark matter is too “dynamically hot”(1) to cluster around small bodies.&lt;/i&gt;

Nevertheless, it would seem that it exists in quantities that should have an effect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>While that is in principle true, galactic dark matter is too “dynamically hot”(1) to cluster around small bodies.</i></p>
<p>Nevertheless, it would seem that it exists in quantities that should have an effect.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Carroll</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83756</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Carroll</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 15:17:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83756</guid>
		<description>Phil, my point was that this signal seems very plausibly (much more likely, I would personally bet, but who knows) to be due to some unknown systematic effect right here on Earth with an annual modulation -- ski season, for example.  That wouldn&#039;t cause a change in the dark matter flux, but could cause changes in the count rate for all sorts of subtle reasons.  It&#039;s far too premature to definitely attribute the signal to something extraterrestrial -- these are hard experiments, and much shaking-down (and hopefully independent confirmation) will be necessary before we understand the signal that well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil, my point was that this signal seems very plausibly (much more likely, I would personally bet, but who knows) to be due to some unknown systematic effect right here on Earth with an annual modulation &#8212; ski season, for example.  That wouldn&#8217;t cause a change in the dark matter flux, but could cause changes in the count rate for all sorts of subtle reasons.  It&#8217;s far too premature to definitely attribute the signal to something extraterrestrial &#8212; these are hard experiments, and much shaking-down (and hopefully independent confirmation) will be necessary before we understand the signal that well.</p>
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		<title>By: Kol</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83755</link>
		<dc:creator>Kol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:50:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83755</guid>
		<description>Hmm... ExtraSolar?

Pfft. Have fun on your voyage while we debate semantics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm&#8230; ExtraSolar?</p>
<p>Pfft. Have fun on your voyage while we debate semantics.</p>
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		<title>By: John -- moonposter.ie</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83754</link>
		<dc:creator>John -- moonposter.ie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:36:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83754</guid>
		<description>Like the Earth, our nearest, natural satellite -- the Moon -- must also be encountering this Dark Matter fluctuation/field. A theory some years ago suggested that the Dark Matter field may have imparted enough energy to the mass of the Moon that it caused it to recess and lengthened our earth-day. Moreover, this DM effect, according to the research, showed that the DM field may have slowed down the acceleration rate of Mars&#039;s rotation. While I&#039;m not sure if this setup (Earth/DM in comparison to Moon/DM) is related, it begs the question, is there any way that we could look at the Moon &#039;now&#039; from Earth for this DM oscillation effect?
John -- www.moonposter.ie</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Like the Earth, our nearest, natural satellite &#8212; the Moon &#8212; must also be encountering this Dark Matter fluctuation/field. A theory some years ago suggested that the Dark Matter field may have imparted enough energy to the mass of the Moon that it caused it to recess and lengthened our earth-day. Moreover, this DM effect, according to the research, showed that the DM field may have slowed down the acceleration rate of Mars&#8217;s rotation. While I&#8217;m not sure if this setup (Earth/DM in comparison to Moon/DM) is related, it begs the question, is there any way that we could look at the Moon &#8216;now&#8217; from Earth for this DM oscillation effect?<br />
John &#8212; <a href="http://www.moonposter.ie" rel="nofollow">http://www.moonposter.ie</a></p>
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		<title>By: BB</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-2/#comment-83753</link>
		<dc:creator>BB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:34:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83753</guid>
		<description>Is it just me or is this experiment extremely similar to the Michelson-Morley experiment?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is it just me or is this experiment extremely similar to the Michelson-Morley experiment?</p>
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		<title>By: The Bad Astronomer</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83752</link>
		<dc:creator>The Bad Astronomer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 08:10:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83752</guid>
		<description>I changed the word &quot;interstellar&quot; to &quot;extraterrestrial&quot;, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.badastronomy.com/bablog/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-169674&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Sean&lt;/a&gt;, since you make a valid point. It could be solar, though the amplitude of the effect seems to belie that. I was thinking &quot;outside the Earth&quot; as I wrote that, but put down &quot;interstellar&quot; since that seemed more likely. Better to be safe, I suppose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I changed the word &#8220;interstellar&#8221; to &#8220;extraterrestrial&#8221;, <a href="http://www.badastronomy.com/bablog/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-169674" rel="nofollow">Sean</a>, since you make a valid point. It could be solar, though the amplitude of the effect seems to belie that. I was thinking &#8220;outside the Earth&#8221; as I wrote that, but put down &#8220;interstellar&#8221; since that seemed more likely. Better to be safe, I suppose.</p>
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		<title>By: Arthur Maruyama</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83751</link>
		<dc:creator>Arthur Maruyama</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 05:48:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83751</guid>
		<description>Tom Marking,

The significance of June/December vs. other months is that it is during those months that the Earth&#039;s movement around the Sun is best aligned with the motion of the Sun around the Milky Way. If an observer on the Sun were watching the Earth as it was being lit by the radiation escaping from the accretion disk around the black hole at the center of the Milky Way, at June 2 that observer would see a &quot;Full Earth&quot; while at around December 2 (presumably) would be a &quot;New Earth.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom Marking,</p>
<p>The significance of June/December vs. other months is that it is during those months that the Earth&#8217;s movement around the Sun is best aligned with the motion of the Sun around the Milky Way. If an observer on the Sun were watching the Earth as it was being lit by the radiation escaping from the accretion disk around the black hole at the center of the Milky Way, at June 2 that observer would see a &#8220;Full Earth&#8221; while at around December 2 (presumably) would be a &#8220;New Earth.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83750</link>
		<dc:creator>Kyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 03:25:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83750</guid>
		<description>The DAMA experiment used 250 kg of really radiopure sodium iodine surrounded by a copper shield divided into 5 detectors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The DAMA experiment used 250 kg of really radiopure sodium iodine surrounded by a copper shield divided into 5 detectors.</p>
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		<title>By: Blue Collar Scientist &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Dark Matter Directly Detected?</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83749</link>
		<dc:creator>Blue Collar Scientist &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Dark Matter Directly Detected?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 01:46:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83749</guid>
		<description>[...] Yes, we do indeed. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Yes, we do indeed. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: RayCeeYa</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83748</link>
		<dc:creator>RayCeeYa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 01:36:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83748</guid>
		<description>This is sooo much liek th Michaelson-Morley Experiments of a century ago to detect the Aether of Aether Theory.  Only this seems to have returned a positive result.

Very Cool!!

The most important thing is that if confirmed it proves that Dark Matter exists!  The only other option besides dark matter is another theory of gravity and gravity as it is is complicated and mysterious enough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is sooo much liek th Michaelson-Morley Experiments of a century ago to detect the Aether of Aether Theory.  Only this seems to have returned a positive result.</p>
<p>Very Cool!!</p>
<p>The most important thing is that if confirmed it proves that Dark Matter exists!  The only other option besides dark matter is another theory of gravity and gravity as it is is complicated and mysterious enough.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Martin</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83747</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 01:07:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83747</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s what&#039;s happened: The Gran Sasso National Laboratory has several independent detection experiments running on site. One is a neutrino oscillation experiment which intersects a neutrino beam projected from CERN. Turns out, interestingly enough, that the DAMA detector is pretty good at registering weak interactions from that beam. CERN, in turn, modulates its beam strength with an annual periodicity, which is due to vacation schedules, which in Switzerland are strictly enforced by law.

Now you know the awful truth. The Dark Matter signal is rooted in peoples&#039; insatiable hunger for regular time off.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s what&#8217;s happened: The Gran Sasso National Laboratory has several independent detection experiments running on site. One is a neutrino oscillation experiment which intersects a neutrino beam projected from CERN. Turns out, interestingly enough, that the DAMA detector is pretty good at registering weak interactions from that beam. CERN, in turn, modulates its beam strength with an annual periodicity, which is due to vacation schedules, which in Switzerland are strictly enforced by law.</p>
<p>Now you know the awful truth. The Dark Matter signal is rooted in peoples&#8217; insatiable hunger for regular time off.</p>
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		<title>By: Pop</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83746</link>
		<dc:creator>Pop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 00:45:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83746</guid>
		<description>Is DM uniform in distribution, or maybe in clumps.  Visible matter certainly clumps (think earth, sun, Milky Way, local groups, branes).  Visible matter clumps in gaseous states as well.  The results from the Italians seems to indicate a uniform distribution of DM at least in the local area.  To put a completely silly spin on this, consider how &quot;dust bunnies&quot; are formed under beds.  One thought is that the scarey monsters hiding under beds roll dust bunnies together durning the day when nothing is happening and no one is around to scare.  DM could very well be like the idea of monsters and dust bunnies.  &quot;We know monsters are under beds because ther are dust bunnies.&quot;  &quot;We know there is DM because we have  a cyclic variation if flashes of light.&quot;  Just a thought.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is DM uniform in distribution, or maybe in clumps.  Visible matter certainly clumps (think earth, sun, Milky Way, local groups, branes).  Visible matter clumps in gaseous states as well.  The results from the Italians seems to indicate a uniform distribution of DM at least in the local area.  To put a completely silly spin on this, consider how &#8220;dust bunnies&#8221; are formed under beds.  One thought is that the scarey monsters hiding under beds roll dust bunnies together durning the day when nothing is happening and no one is around to scare.  DM could very well be like the idea of monsters and dust bunnies.  &#8220;We know monsters are under beds because ther are dust bunnies.&#8221;  &#8220;We know there is DM because we have  a cyclic variation if flashes of light.&#8221;  Just a thought.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Marking</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83745</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Marking</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 23:54:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83745</guid>
		<description>&quot;Nothing implies that whatever-it-is needs to be “stationary with respect to the Milky Way”.
When the Earth is “facing into the wind”, it’s moving faster, and therefore sweeps through a larger are of space during the same time span, than when it’s on the opposite side of its orbit, and thereby encountering more “whatever”.&quot;

Then what is the significance of a peak in June and a trough in December?  Why not a peak in April and a trough in October?  Why is the earth moving &quot;into the DM wind&quot; in June?  Doesn&#039;t it signify something about the relationship of DM to the galaxy?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Nothing implies that whatever-it-is needs to be “stationary with respect to the Milky Way”.<br />
When the Earth is “facing into the wind”, it’s moving faster, and therefore sweeps through a larger are of space during the same time span, than when it’s on the opposite side of its orbit, and thereby encountering more “whatever”.&#8221;</p>
<p>Then what is the significance of a peak in June and a trough in December?  Why not a peak in April and a trough in October?  Why is the earth moving &#8220;into the DM wind&#8221; in June?  Doesn&#8217;t it signify something about the relationship of DM to the galaxy?</p>
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		<title>By: MandyDax</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83744</link>
		<dc:creator>MandyDax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 23:31:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83744</guid>
		<description>Kol said: &lt;blockquote&gt;I’m rooting for DM being something that has absolutely no physically detectable connection with this universe other than gravity. If it doesn’t turn out to be the gravitational interaction of baryon-like particles across branes, I will be sorely disappointed.&lt;/blockquote&gt; That would be great.  If that could be shown, then brane theory would get a huge boost.  The reason it seems like a possibility is that there are some hypotheses that state that the reason gravity is so weak compared to (and hence hard to unify with) the other forces is that it really isn&#039;t weaker, but that much of the force &quot;leaks&quot; out of our universe.  That would be brilliant.  Of course, my knowledge of this is very limited, so perhaps Phil will come back and smash our hopes to tiny, yet massive, hard to detect bits. ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kol said:<br />
<blockquote>I’m rooting for DM being something that has absolutely no physically detectable connection with this universe other than gravity. If it doesn’t turn out to be the gravitational interaction of baryon-like particles across branes, I will be sorely disappointed.</p></blockquote>
<p> That would be great.  If that could be shown, then brane theory would get a huge boost.  The reason it seems like a possibility is that there are some hypotheses that state that the reason gravity is so weak compared to (and hence hard to unify with) the other forces is that it really isn&#8217;t weaker, but that much of the force &#8220;leaks&#8221; out of our universe.  That would be brilliant.  Of course, my knowledge of this is very limited, so perhaps Phil will come back and smash our hopes to tiny, yet massive, hard to detect bits. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Ed Davies</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/comment-page-1/#comment-83743</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Davies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 23:26:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/21/dark-matter-detected/#comment-83743</guid>
		<description>Jeffersonianon 21 Apr 2008 at 2:46 pm:

&quot;.... If weâ??re spinning relative to the center of the galaxy, wouldnâ??t our view of the stars change? ....&quot;

Most of the stars we can see are pretty close to us on a galactic scale and are moving around the galactic centre at about the same speed and in roughly the same direction so their positions relative to us change pretty slowly (though stars do have &quot;proper motions&quot; across the sky).  Also, it takes us about 200 million years to go round the galaxy so any change of perspective is not likely to be blindingly obvious over the course of an evening or two.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeffersonianon 21 Apr 2008 at 2:46 pm:</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;. If weâ??re spinning relative to the center of the galaxy, wouldnâ??t our view of the stars change? &#8230;.&#8221;</p>
<p>Most of the stars we can see are pretty close to us on a galactic scale and are moving around the galactic centre at about the same speed and in roughly the same direction so their positions relative to us change pretty slowly (though stars do have &#8220;proper motions&#8221; across the sky).  Also, it takes us about 200 million years to go round the galaxy so any change of perspective is not likely to be blindingly obvious over the course of an evening or two.</p>
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