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	<title>Comments on: ISS boosted by Jules Verne</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/</link>
	<description>I am an astronomer, writer, and skeptic. I likes reality the way it is, and I aims to keep it that way. My real name is Phil Plait, and I run the Bad Astronomy blog.</description>
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		<title>By: Buzz Parsec</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/comment-page-1/#comment-84799</link>
		<dc:creator>Buzz Parsec</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 06:10:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/#comment-84799</guid>
		<description>Jack,

Before the ATV, they used engines on one of the Russian modules  (Zvezda,, IIRC), Progress supply ships and the shuttles to reboost the ISS.

To keep the thrust vector aligned with the CG, I think the ATV engines are steerable and they also use its steering thrusters (and probably the stations&#039; gyros) to damp out any residual rotation caused by misalignment.  Right now, there are two sets of solar arrays on the port end of the truss and only one on the starboard end.  Compensating for that somewhat is the Columbus lab and the airlock on the starboard side.  But next month they&#039;ll be adding the Kibo lab on the port side, which means if it&#039;s more or less balanced now, it won&#039;t be in June, at least until they add the last set of solar wings to the starboard side, currently scheduled for December.  I&#039;m sure this was all considered in excruciating detail when they were planning the assembly sequence.

JB - I know that at one time NASA planned to have an early shuttle flight dock with Skylab and give a reboost, but the shuttle was delayed a couple of years and the Sun was more active than expected (which causes the upper atmosphere to expand, increasing drag on objects in low orbit), and Skylab came down before the shuttle was ready.

BTW, Jack - the Ley/Von Braun donut station was planned to orbit at 1000 miles (or Km, but it was the 50&#039;s, I&#039;m pretty sure they used miles in the US), which would have put it high enough that reboost wouldn&#039;t be a serious issue, but also right in the middle of the inner Van Allen Belt.  :-(  BTW, I have that book that appears in the titles for Napoleon Dynamite...  An endless source of amusement for my younger siblings.)

And Joe, yes, there&#039;s only one issue preventing that, $$$$.
(But it would have to be a low-acceleration booster...  The ISS isn&#039;t
that strong!  Speaking of which, wouldn&#039;t this be a perfect application for an ion engine?  Scotty, give me full impulse!)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jack,</p>
<p>Before the ATV, they used engines on one of the Russian modules  (Zvezda,, IIRC), Progress supply ships and the shuttles to reboost the ISS.</p>
<p>To keep the thrust vector aligned with the CG, I think the ATV engines are steerable and they also use its steering thrusters (and probably the stations&#8217; gyros) to damp out any residual rotation caused by misalignment.  Right now, there are two sets of solar arrays on the port end of the truss and only one on the starboard end.  Compensating for that somewhat is the Columbus lab and the airlock on the starboard side.  But next month they&#8217;ll be adding the Kibo lab on the port side, which means if it&#8217;s more or less balanced now, it won&#8217;t be in June, at least until they add the last set of solar wings to the starboard side, currently scheduled for December.  I&#8217;m sure this was all considered in excruciating detail when they were planning the assembly sequence.</p>
<p>JB &#8211; I know that at one time NASA planned to have an early shuttle flight dock with Skylab and give a reboost, but the shuttle was delayed a couple of years and the Sun was more active than expected (which causes the upper atmosphere to expand, increasing drag on objects in low orbit), and Skylab came down before the shuttle was ready.</p>
<p>BTW, Jack &#8211; the Ley/Von Braun donut station was planned to orbit at 1000 miles (or Km, but it was the 50&#8217;s, I&#8217;m pretty sure they used miles in the US), which would have put it high enough that reboost wouldn&#8217;t be a serious issue, but also right in the middle of the inner Van Allen Belt.  <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':-(' class='wp-smiley' />   BTW, I have that book that appears in the titles for Napoleon Dynamite&#8230;  An endless source of amusement for my younger siblings.)</p>
<p>And Joe, yes, there&#8217;s only one issue preventing that, $$$$.<br />
(But it would have to be a low-acceleration booster&#8230;  The ISS isn&#8217;t<br />
that strong!  Speaking of which, wouldn&#8217;t this be a perfect application for an ion engine?  Scotty, give me full impulse!)</p>
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		<title>By: JB of Brisbane</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/comment-page-1/#comment-84798</link>
		<dc:creator>JB of Brisbane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Apr 2008 00:17:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/#comment-84798</guid>
		<description>If only NASA had thought of something like this when Skylab was sent up, but it was thought that the shuttle would be up and running before Skylab would require boosting. I wonder if any records still exist of shuttle-based solutions to Skylab&#039;s predicament.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If only NASA had thought of something like this when Skylab was sent up, but it was thought that the shuttle would be up and running before Skylab would require boosting. I wonder if any records still exist of shuttle-based solutions to Skylab&#8217;s predicament.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Meils</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/comment-page-1/#comment-84797</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Meils</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Apr 2008 15:11:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/#comment-84797</guid>
		<description>This sort of thing facinates me. If we can boost the ISS to a slightly higher orbit, is there any reason we couldn&#039;t dock a lander or two to it, put a booster on it as well, and take the whole thing to the moon for an extended mission?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This sort of thing facinates me. If we can boost the ISS to a slightly higher orbit, is there any reason we couldn&#8217;t dock a lander or two to it, put a booster on it as well, and take the whole thing to the moon for an extended mission?</p>
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		<title>By: Jack Hagerty</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/comment-page-1/#comment-84796</link>
		<dc:creator>Jack Hagerty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Apr 2008 05:13:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/#comment-84796</guid>
		<description>Very nice video, Paolo. The only thing I would change is the simulation showing the final approach happening in the direction of travel (this has to be done cross track to keep from raising or lowering the altitude when closing).

I have a couple of questions about this maneuver, though, that I&#039;m sure someone here can answer.

1) How did they do the re-boost on the ISS previously?

2) How do they guarantee that the centerline of the thrust from the JV module passes through the CG of the ISS? With such an ungainly structure, how do they even know where the CG is? Are all the crew and their equipment stowed in specific locations? What about the trash stuffed into the other service vehicles? How accurately does all that have to be placed? I would think there are limits to how much the guidance controller on the JV would be able to compensate and keep the station from pitching when you turn on the thrusters.

It would seem that if they&#039;d gone with the Ley/von Braun &quot;doughnut&quot; station, the drag would be a lot less than with those flat panels out there, maximizing the drag :-)

- Jack</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very nice video, Paolo. The only thing I would change is the simulation showing the final approach happening in the direction of travel (this has to be done cross track to keep from raising or lowering the altitude when closing).</p>
<p>I have a couple of questions about this maneuver, though, that I&#8217;m sure someone here can answer.</p>
<p>1) How did they do the re-boost on the ISS previously?</p>
<p>2) How do they guarantee that the centerline of the thrust from the JV module passes through the CG of the ISS? With such an ungainly structure, how do they even know where the CG is? Are all the crew and their equipment stowed in specific locations? What about the trash stuffed into the other service vehicles? How accurately does all that have to be placed? I would think there are limits to how much the guidance controller on the JV would be able to compensate and keep the station from pitching when you turn on the thrusters.</p>
<p>It would seem that if they&#8217;d gone with the Ley/von Braun &#8220;doughnut&#8221; station, the drag would be a lot less than with those flat panels out there, maximizing the drag <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>- Jack</p>
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		<title>By: John Phillips, FCD</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/comment-page-1/#comment-84795</link>
		<dc:creator>John Phillips, FCD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Apr 2008 16:32:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/#comment-84795</guid>
		<description>Michael Lornegan. The Jules Verne is already human rated and there is talk, but only talk for now, about making it a full manned launch and recovery vehicle. However, for now, it is only being used as ESA&#039;s contribution to the ISS and so was more a proof of concept and recovery wasn&#039;t a necessary part of the equation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael Lornegan. The Jules Verne is already human rated and there is talk, but only talk for now, about making it a full manned launch and recovery vehicle. However, for now, it is only being used as ESA&#8217;s contribution to the ISS and so was more a proof of concept and recovery wasn&#8217;t a necessary part of the equation.</p>
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		<title>By: Arnaud</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/comment-page-1/#comment-84794</link>
		<dc:creator>Arnaud</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Apr 2008 15:11:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/#comment-84794</guid>
		<description>Michael,

The &quot;Jules Verne&quot; is the first of a batch of 4 vehicles, if I remember correctly. That first one was pretty much a test launch and flight which is why it wasn&#039;t carrying as much cargo as it could have. There may be further orders coming later.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael,</p>
<p>The &#8220;Jules Verne&#8221; is the first of a batch of 4 vehicles, if I remember correctly. That first one was pretty much a test launch and flight which is why it wasn&#8217;t carrying as much cargo as it could have. There may be further orders coming later.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Lonergan</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/comment-page-1/#comment-84793</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Lonergan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Apr 2008 13:57:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/04/26/iss-boosted-by-jules-verne/#comment-84793</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m just wondering if the &quot;Jules Verne&quot; is a one-off, or are they planning on building more of these vehicles?  Also, even though the ISS is not completed yet, what are the plans to bring it down at the end of it&#039;s life?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m just wondering if the &#8220;Jules Verne&#8221; is a one-off, or are they planning on building more of these vehicles?  Also, even though the ISS is not completed yet, what are the plans to bring it down at the end of it&#8217;s life?</p>
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