Antivaxxers are doing real damage to society

By Phil Plait | December 18, 2008 8:00 am

There are people out there who think that vaccines are linked to autism. They are wrong. There is no evidence to support their belief, and tons of evidence against it.

However, because they have celebrity spokespeople who are loud but appealing, and because their targets are worried parents, they have made seriously headway in society. For that reason, I consider antivaxxers to be one of if not the largest health threat in the US. We have already seen a drop in vaccinations in the US and UK and an increase in measles outbreaks due to their efforts (pertussis is on the rise, too, though the cause is as yet unclear), and while there have been few deaths from their antiscientific crusade so far — and even one is too many — you can bet there will be more. Many more.

And now there may be a further impact. It appears some insurance companies are refusing to pay for some vaccinations. It’s not clear if this is due to the drop in requested vaccinations because of antivax efforts, or if rising costs and the usual insurance company reluctance to provide actual coverage is to blame. The survey on which this article is based doesn’t say, but it would be an excellent idea to find out why this is happening.

If we start to see an even higher increase in childhood diseases — and fatalities — that can be traced to the exhortations of Jenny McCarthy and Andrew Wakefield, then it is critically important that parents of young children know exactly what and who is behind the problem.

Comments (56)

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  1. John Keller

    My insurance company (blue cross) only pays 300$ per year towards vaccinations and it has been that way for at least 4 years. Fortunately all of my kids are well beyond toddler years, so it is not a problem. I suspect its more of a cost savings things than a “we worried about lawsuits” thing.

  2. Todd W.

    @Phil

    Typo in this line:

    We have already seen a rise a drop in vaccinations in the US and UK

  3. K

    RE: ‘anti-vaxer’ influence … “It appears…” “It’s not clear if this is due to…” and, “The survey on which this article is based doesn’t say, but it would be an excellent idea to find out why this is happening.”

    COMMENT: I agree it would be excellent to find out why. Here’s some clues:

    Follow the link in your post (“It appears some insurance companies are refusing to pay for some vaccinations.”), which takes one to an article. There’s a link in that article which takes one to, “Pediatrics, Official Jounal of the american Academy of Pediatrics,” published online Decenber, 2008. The paper is entitled, “Primary Care Physician Perspectives on Reimbursement for Childhood Immuniczations.” (LINK: http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/abstract/122/6/1319 ).

    The abstract is available right there — and it entirely focuses on finacial matters…not a peep about anti-vaxer activist influence.

    For a few dollars anyone can access the entire article.

    The authors are from the Univeristy of Michigan, the lead author, Dr. Gary L. Freed, has contact info readily accessible from the U of M website:

    http://www.sph.umich.edu/iscr/faculty/profile.cfm?uniqname=gfreed

    To save you the minute or two it would take to look him up, here’s the contact info from his website:

    Gary L. Freed, M.D., M.P.H.
    Professor, Department of Health Management and Policy
    Director, Division of General Pediatrics
    The Percy and Mary Murphy Professor of Pediatrics and Child Health Delivery
    300 NIB, 6E08
    Ann Arbor, Michigan 48109-0456
    Office: (734) 615-0616; Fax: (734) 764-2599
    E-mail: gfreed@med.umich.edu
    Website(s): General Pediatrics Faculty

    Feel free to write, phone, fax, or e-mail. I’m sure he’d be very interested in your “excellent idea to find out why this is happening” with complete facts. It should only take a few moments to ask the basic question & hit the “send” button for an e-mail query.

    Most likely the underlying issue is an contractual insurance payment structure that hasn’t kept up with actual costs. Like you, I’m interested in finding out if there’s ANY linkage to ANY antivaxxer(s) associated with the study referenced….or….if THAT is just some sensationalized non-news concocted by association.

    I do hope you complete this bit of innuendo & association by accurately reporting & representign the facts in lieu of partial reporting and presumed associations unsupported by anything…to do otherwise would be “Bad Science.”

    Here’s the quote, from the above journal link, posted online:

    OBJECTIVES. The purpose of this research was to explore physicians’ attitudes and behaviors related to vaccine financing issues within their practice. Amid the increasing number of vaccine doses recommended for children and adolescents, anecdotal reports suggest that physicians are facing increasing financial pressures from vaccine purchase and administration and may stop providing vaccines altogether to privately insured children. Whether these sentiments are widely held among immunization providers is unknown.

    METHODS. We conducted a cross-sectional mail survey from July to September 2007 of a random sample of 1280 US pediatricians and family physicians engaged in direct patient care. Main outcome measures included delay in the purchase of specific vaccines for financial reasons; reported decrease in profit margin from immunizations; and practice consideration of whether to stop providing all vaccines to privately insured children.

    RESULTS. The response rate was 70% for pediatricians and 60% for family physicians. Approximately half of the respondents reported that their practice had delayed the purchase of specific vaccines for financial reasons (49%) and experienced decreased profit margin from immunizations (53%) in the previous 3 years. Twenty-one percent of respondents strongly disagreed that “reimbursement for vaccine purchase is adequate,” and 17% strongly disagreed that “reimbursement for vaccine administration is adequate.” Eleven percent of respondents said their practice had seriously considered whether to stop providing all vaccines to privately insured children in the previous year.

    CONCLUSIONS. Physicians who provide vaccines to children and adolescents report dissatisfaction with reimbursement levels and increasing financial strain from immunizations. Although large-scale withdrawal of immunization providers does not seem to be imminent, efforts to address root causes of financial pressures should be undertaken.

  4. Charles Boyer

    When their children get polio, smallpox and/or other immunizable diseases, the insurance companies will probably reconsider their position.

  5. Yes, K, as it says at the bottom of your comment — and which I read in the original survey results — “… efforts to address root causes of financial pressures should be undertaken.”

    In other words, they didn’t find out what those root causes are in the survey, and it should be determined. Which is what I wrote.

  6. Todd W.

    @Phil

    and while there have been few deaths from their antiscientific crusade so far — and even one is too many — you can bet there will be more. Many more.

    While it is important to note deaths due to preventable illnesses, I would recommend, instead (or in addition), that you provide some info on the number of cases where serious, permanent injury resulted from these diseases. These injuries have a much higher risk and incidence rate than death, yet still have a significantly lower chance of occurring than any harm from the vaccines themselves.

    It may also be worth mentioning that vaccination isn’t just about whether your kid gets sick or not, but about helping those who, for medical reasons (allergy to something in the vaccine, compromised immune system due to disease or transplant, too young to receive the vaccine, etc.), cannot be vaccinated; that herd immunity lowers the risk that these people will get the disease.

  7. gopher65

    I agree with Todd W. Permanent injury and disfigurement is a serious problem with some of these diseases; I believe that potential anti-vax parents would respond to a greater degree when faced with a picture of a a child disfigured by a preventable (vaccinatable) illness than they would when faced with a list of %chance-of-death statistics.

  8. Michelle

    It’s pretty scary. My best friend belated the vaccines for her kid because she thought that if she vaxxed her too young she would get autism. How idiotic is that? Who crammed that nonsense into her brain without any proofs?

    the idea that seriously dangerous diseases which were considered extinct are now making a comeback is VERY scary… These kids are walking timebombs.

  9. JoeSmithCA

    K has a good point. I’ve dealt with several insurance companies who will not pay for vaccinations. It’s not about the anti-vaxxers, it’s about money. I was so annoyed that I pursued my last carrier blue cross about it, the declared rising costs deemed that they had to remove certain vaccinations from my plan “in order to keep your plan at a reasonable price.” A year later they dropped several allergy medications as well for the same reasons. They will, however pay for those if I change my plan to something more expensive.

    I hate to say it but insurance companies are businesses, they make decisions that drive profit. The whole health care system needs a good review, the costs have ballooned like the US housing market. Something needs to pop and I think before that happens, a lot of people are going to suffer.

  10. If I may interject, K, I got the sense that the assertion that antivaxxers are doing real damage to society is a separate and distinct statement from the reporting that Phil did indicating that insurance companies were lowering their coverage for vaccinations. The actual damage they’re doing is in changing people’s minds about getting vaccines — carpet-bombing fear, uncertainty and doubt in order to convince people not to vaccinate their children, thus breaking down herd immunity and allowing a niche for viruses that should be long-since extinct to cultivate and mutate and make a resurgance.

  11. Todd W.

    @JoeSmithCA

    So, if rising costs are the issue, then the question becomes, what is driving the costs up? If vaccine manufacturers are increasing the prices of the vaccines, why?

    I don’t think that lawsuits would have a significant affect on the price of vaccines, since the Federal government has set up a fund specifically for vaccine-related injuries. Suits need to go through the Federal system first before the manufacturer can be sued.

    One possible scenario is that due to anti-vax fears, manufacturers are producing fewer vaccines. In order to keep making a profit, though, they need to increase the price/vaccine, since there are fewer doses being administered.

    The removal of thimerosal from vaccines would also impact this. Before, the vaccines would have had a longer shelf life, so there would not be as much of a need to replenish the vaccine supply as frequently. Removal of the preservative means a shorter shelf life, which means greater demands on the production cycle, leading to increased costs.

    These are just a couple possible guesses as to the cause of increased costs.

  12. What do you say to someone who says that the reason the studies have shown no link between vaccines and autism is because the studies are funded by the drug companies?

  13. jotrry

    I’m lost. Where in the article does it state that insurance companies are not covering vaccines? I found the section noting that they are not covering the full cost, which is entirely different.

  14. Astronomynut

    Part of the problem with anti-vaxxers is that, while on the surface Jenny McCarthy seems to be just another celebrity pretty face, her website is well written and seems, to the uninformed, to be full of science. Her Battling Misinformation page (http://www.generationrescue.org/misinformation.html) clearly spells out their positions and the facts as they see them. The sources they site seem legitimate.

    Calling them uninformed airheads makes us seem mean. We need to refute the “proof” the have listed on their site.

  15. Dr. Voodoo

    The only ones that should get the vaccinations are the ones who would get the disease. For the others, vaccinations are overmedication so we should strive to reduce vaccinations since most of them are unnecessary.

  16. Todd W.

    @Ken B

    Then you point them to the studies that are not funded by drug companies (CDC, NIH, independent, international, etc.).

    If they say that it is the MMR combination vaccine and argue that the three vaccines should be administered separately, still criticizing the studies showing no difference between MMR, separate vaccines, or no MMR, and still claiming the studies are funded by the drug companies, then point out that the drug companies would be able to make a bigger profit if the MMR was administered as three separate vaccines (regular vaccine price charge 3 times, for example).

  17. Alex

    hi,

    I dont comment here too much. I am Scottish and would like to say our county seems to be on the rebound, i know a few people who have decided against the MMR jab, even someone who blames it (wrongly) for her childs severe autism. I mention the MMR vaccine because it has had the most press coverage in recent years.

    However this year 95% of children between 1 and 5 recieved at least one dose, the highest ever in my country. Just thought i would throw that into the debate.

    Alex

  18. At the risk of being accused of an ad hominem logical fallacy, that the standard barer for this movement is a person known primarily for posing nude in a magazine, having several failed TV shows, a less than lukewarm movie career, and eating her own boogers on MTV. (Okay, I admit, that last one might be a legend. Anybody have a video).

  19. Sorry, left out the words, “I would like to point out…” (Gotta learn to proof read ;)

  20. JoeSmithCA

    @Todd W.
    We can only guess, to quote Phil:

    “It’s not clear if this is due to the drop in requested vaccinations because of antivax efforts, or if rising costs and the usual insurance company reticence to provide actual coverage is to blame.”

    The only thing I respectfully disagree with the direction of his article is that it gives me the *perception* of leaning towards anti-vaxxers as the cause. Althought I whole heartedly agree that anti-vax proponents are a problem, I just can’t find that it (anti-vax as a cause) carries any more weight than any other reason an insurance barfs up an excuse to not pay for something.

  21. David D

    @K–

    See Phil’s recent post about the evil Romanians who removed evolution from the school curricula. Sometimes there is a tendency to look before you leap here. . .

    As I understand it, vaccine costs have risen dramatically in recent years due to liability concerns regarding adverse events “associated” with their administration, not necessarily autism. There is a truckload of money to be made in suing deep pockets. The recent addition of the Federal fund for vaccine-related injuries is a welcome addition to the equation, but it hasn’t exactly prompted drug companies to abandon their well-founded fears of a lawsuit just yet.

    Are anti-vaxxers doing “real damage to society?” You bet. I just don’t think it has that much to do with this story.

  22. PhilB

    It’s worth considering that although the insurance companies are purely finance driven, they are also market driven. 10 years ago, non-coverage of vaccination wouldn’t have been considered an option at all. Now, market conditions have changed and becauase of new public resistence to vaccines, removal of a potentially expensive piece of health care coverage is now actually viable for a company looking to cut costs.

    All thought-experiment and theory I’m afraid, but there’s more to the profit side of analysis than just comparing cost vs profit.

  23. Brad Bittinger

    I work for the State of California Dept of Health Care Services, and our data show that it is simply an economic decision on the part of the doctors: the reimbursement rate for vaccinations is so low, the requirements for storage, tracking, etc., so high that the physicians see it as a money-losing proposition. One more reason for single-payer.

  24. TheWalruss

    Ok, this is why it’s really stupid to put things in the hands of private corporations and decisions in the hands of ordinary people.

    Private corporations are greedy, and ordinary people are stupid.
    The way it *should* work is that the government collects taxes and uses them to pay for the administration of vaccinations to all children. The vaccinations and reasons for them are well-documented by scientists, others can bring grievances and concerns to the political process, but eventually reason wins out and kids get vaccinated.

    I hear the cries already “but ooooh – socialism is bad and scary, and what if I dont want to pay for my neighbor’s medical expenses?” Too bad – if you’re insured (which you should be unless you’re either an antisocial rich person or an idiot), you’re already paying for your neighbor’s medical expenses. Or else they’re paying for yours. The way it works is that everyone that can puts money into a big-huge pool of cash each month, and then the people that need it (often mothers, young children and babies, the elderly, and the chronically ill) get to take money out in the form of medicine and professional treatment. I seriously don’t see why we need to put for-profit organizations into any of this – it just leads to bad decision-making because the dollar is valued the higher than public well-being (that’s the law, if you’re a publically traded company). Another benefit of socialized healthcare is that even people who can’t afford insurance get health care if they need it. Privatization advocates essentially are saying that poor people don’t deserve medical treatment. Good Lord, how disgusting.

    [/rant]

    PS. Sorry about that – there’s a lot of generalizations and poisonous comments in there, but I’ve had a very long week, and this sort of thing really gets me going, so I’ll post it anyway. I’m curious to see the responses…

  25. Troy

    “We have already seen a rise a drop in vaccinations in the US”

    According to a September 4, 2008 released CDC report:
    “Childhood immunization rates remain at or near record levels, with at least 90 percent coverage for all but one of the individual vaccines in the recommended series for young children”
    http://www.cdc.gov/media/pressrel/2008/r080904.htm
    ———————————————–
    “and an increase in measles outbreaks due to their efforts”

    Where is your proof that “they” are the cause?
    As you so often like to say “That’s a logical fallacy: post hoc ergo propter hoc,”

  26. Nyx

    Not only do children need their shots, but adults should get boosters. I had the vax for whooping cough when I was a baby and never had the illness.
    I am now as a 41-year-old recovering from it. I cannot imagine why anyone would risk putting their child through that.

  27. Elmar_M

    Yeah and then grown ups can get certain illnesses again too… Now at my partners childs kinder garden, there are frequent outbreaks of measles mumps and rubella (to many antivaxxers or kids from foreign countries that dont have immunisation programmes). He sometimes brings his kid to school and the kid brings those germs. Awesome, just awesome…
    For those insurance companies all I can say is: I hope you all get severe permanent injury or disfigurement from these illnesses plus I hope you get so many cases of this to pay for that your companies go bankrupt! Greedy slimy…
    Sigh, I have to try not to get so upset about these things…

  28. Troy– those are national rates. There are pockets of areas where immunizations are dropping due to antivax efforts. This is a matter of real concern.

  29. @Phil … all this talk of anti-vaxxers has finally got into my head and today I am going to do something about it…

    The Command and Conquer series of games is among my favourite. Especially the Red Alert series. The newest version Red Alert 3 stars … guess who? McCarthy. Although it will be hard I am going to resist buying and playing this game. And right after this I am going to right a letter to the games publisher to give them my two cents.

    It isn’t much but it is all I can do.

  30. Greg in Austin

    TheWalruss said,

    “Another benefit of socialized healthcare is that even people who can’t afford insurance get health care if they need it. Privatization advocates essentially are saying that poor people don’t deserve medical treatment.”

    While that sounds good in theory, in practice, its not so easy. Show me that the government can simply keep track of its own spending, much less maintain a program that will most likely cost trillions of dollars a year, and I’ll consider socializing medicine. Programs like Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid are already boondoggles, where by their own admission the government takes money from me right now to pay for someone else’s retirement, but will be bankrupt before I retire.

    And I will argue strongly that everyone (rich or poor) can get medical treatment at any time, but many CHOOSE not to have their own insurance. Anyone with a house or apartment, a car, a television, a cellphone, a Wii, etc. but no insurance has no excuse.

    In my opinion, of course.

    8)

  31. Old Muley

    I had the opportunity to hear Dr. Eric Courchesne, Ph.D. of UC-San Diego speak at an autism conference about 7 months ago. The audience was probably 1/2 educators and service providers, 1/4 parents of children with autism and 1/4 individuals with autism themselves. From the very beginning of Dr. Courchesne’s presentation, he stated unequivocally that immunizations DO NOT cause autism. There was a noticeable bristling in the audience, however Dr. Courchesne presented very clear arguments for abnormal brain growth & development as a cause for autism. What was not known was the trigger for abnormal growth of neurons but it was clearly not caused by a vaccination.

    “post hoc ergo propter hoc”- I’m gonna have to bone up on my Latin if I’m gonna keep hanging around here…

  32. JoeSmithCA

    @Nyx
    Good point, I’ve seen doctor’s not following through on adult immunization. The ones I’ve gone to generally don’t bother to consider it unless you say “I’m going out of the country….”

    This brings up a good point that adults should make sure they’re immunized and *still* immunized. Sure I worry about my son, but the concept of heard immunity is immunization of the group en-total not just children.

    @Phil
    Thanks for the info. The Red Alert series was going down hill now I’m definitly not going invest my money on the game. I’ll bring the pro-vax fight to the gaming forums :)

  33. Email to EA sent :)

    Here is a copy of it if anyone is interested: http://docs.google.com/View?docid=ddp7nf4k_83fk3xj9cg

  34. Torbjörn Larsson, OM

    While that sounds good in theory, in practice, its not so easy. Show me that the government can simply keep track of its own spending, much less maintain a program

    Swden, Norway, Finland, Denmark, … and the list goes on and on.

    It can be made to work, quite easily even, despite the occasional hiccup, mostly in the form of long queue times; but if it’s worth the money, potential death and harm from possible time wasted waiting (statistics shows it’s not a large problem AFAIU), et cetera is another matter which I don’t intend to go into here.

  35. Paul M.

    I’ll add Australia to that list – vaccines are provided at no charge, and for children who complete the full program of immunisations a benefit is paid to the parents.

    http://www.immunise.health.gov.au/internet/immunise/publishing.nsf/Content/parents

  36. George E Martin

    @Old Muley

    “post hoc ergo propter hoc”- I’m gonna have to bone up on my Latin if I’m gonna keep hanging around here…

    From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Latin_phrases_(full)#P

    It’s “after this, therefore because of this”. Or as the notes give for this entry, “A logical fallacy where one assumes that one thing happening after another thing means that the first thing caused the second.”

    George

  37. SteveB

    Some insurance pays/paid for immunizations? I have never had health insurance that paid for them. The company I work for provides annual flu shots for employees for free, but family members must pay. So, no change here – they’ve never paid for preventative measures, such as physicals or immunizations. That seems rather short-sighted, but I guess in today’s world with no long-term commitment, they’d rather not spend the money today for these things and negotiate what they have to pay the doctors tomorrow for treating what could have been avoided.

  38. @Greg in Austin
    “And I will argue strongly that everyone (rich or poor) can get medical treatment at any time, but many CHOOSE not to have their own insurance. Anyone with a house or apartment, a car, a television, a cellphone, a Wii, etc. but no insurance has no excuse.”

    Last time I checked, I could by a few plasma TVs a year with what my family of 3 spends on Insurance. We’ve also had about $600 in out of pocket expenses. While I don’t have the exact numbers, I’ve also seen multiple studies that show the tax increase from socialized healthcare would be less than most families currently pay for insurance. Anti-Vaxxers and Anti-Healthcare advocates share one common trait. Ignorance.

  39. AnthonyK

    It’s often said (by anti-vaxers) that the drug comapanies make huge amounts of money from vaccines, and therefore push them on doctors and parents. I doubt this is true and think that vaccines are supplied by charitable pharma for next to nothing. What’s the true position?

  40. Greg in Austin

    Ian Muir said,

    “Last time I checked, I could by a few plasma TVs a year with what my family of 3 spends on Insurance. “

    How much would your medical, dental, and prescription drugs cost if you did not have insurance? More importantly, what is your family’s health worth to you? You chose to have children, right? Can you afford it? Aren’t you and your family worth more than a few plasma TVs?

    Several years ago, my medical insurance was less than $50 per month, but my deductible was $2,000. Until I spent two thousand dollars on medical costs, my insurance covered nothing. My choices were: A) Live a healthy lifestyle and never get injured, 2) or B) Pay the cost for medical treatment out of pocket, C) or 3) get a better job that had better health benefits/ shop around for a better insurance plan, and finally D) or 4) save enough money so that if indeed a medical emergency occurred, I could pay for it.

    Let’s take another example that everyone in the United States understands: Car Insurance. The sole purpose of auto insurance is to 1) Cover the damages to the other persons and property if you are at fault, and 2) Cover the damages to your own person and property if you are at fault, or if the other driver is uninsured. Coverage 1 is mandated by many states in the US, but coverage 2 is optional. If auto insurance mandated by the state is so dang important, why isn’t it covered by state tax? Answer: Owning and driving a car is a choice.

    I guess the real question is: Is medical care a choice?

    8)

  41. Greg in Austin

    Torbjörn Larsson said,

    “Swden, Norway, Finland, Denmark, … and the list goes on and on.”

    RIGHT. I should have clarified: “Show me that the AMERICAN government can simply keep track of its own spending, much less… blah blah blah…”

    No offense intended. I’ve never lived in any of those countries, so I cannot speak to the quality of life or the cost of living over there vs. living in the US. I am perfectly content living where I am. I have a nice house, a great job, all the necessities of life, and I live in arguably one of the best cities in the country. If the only thing I have to complain about is my own government (of the people) spending my tax money unwisely, I think I have it pretty good.

    8)

  42. The Australian government also have a really good vaccination myth hand-out (click my name for it – it’s a pdf file, so make sure your computer can handle those!) available. And before anyone comments on it, it’s by the Australian Department of Health and Ageing, NOT a pharmaceutical company. Has a lot of interesting stuff, including showing the rates of diseases reported before and after vaccines were introduced, as well as deaths over a period of time for some common ones.

  43. Autumn

    @ Greg in Austin,
    Show me a large American corporation that can keep track of the millions it spends with any degree of precision.
    The main differences between a governmental bureaucracy and a corporate bureaucracy is that the government is, in theory at least, both transparent and able to be changed from the bottom up.

    Oh, and I live in Florida, so I am very familiar with what happens when insurance companies are faced with actually honoring their contracts; they whine until the taxpayers are forced to pay their debts.

    Costs are public, but somehow the profit remains private.

  44. Henning

    Regarding the unclear cause for rise of pertussis (Bordetella pertussis): Here in Denmark we vaccinate against Bordetella pertussis (pertussis is called “kighoste” in Danish). So could the cause for a rise simply be that a lower number than before are being vaccinated?

  45. Harold McTestes

    I still say this is Darwinism at work… apples don’t tend to fall far from the tree if you catch my drift.

  46. P

    So what’s the solution? Manadtory vacinations?

  47. Gary Ansorge

    Mandatory vaccinations? No!

    Mandatory education? Yes!

    GAry 7
    PS. In all my travels around the globe, I’ve been repeatedly vaccinated against,,,well, just about everything. Wouldn’t you know, the one I wasn’t able to be Vaccinated against(malaria) would be the one I caught?
    Bummer!

  48. Okay. There is no link. Says who? The vaccine manufacturers? ACTUALLY, Autism is listed as a possible side effect to the Tripedia vaccine. DUH? After my baby and I were injured by vaccines in 2007 I then began to do my homework. Not only do they cause Autism (aka brain damage), but they cause so much more in people who are genetically intolerant. You have to be a real idiot these days to vaccinate your child without doing your homework. Start by reading the package inserts that come in the box with the vaccine. After that, you will probably want to assault your doctor and vomit in the closest bucket.

  49. Todd W.

    @Dawn

    I took a look at the label for Tripedia on the FDA web site, but I did not see autism listed anywhere in it. Could you point me to which page it is on?

    What kind of injuries did you and your baby suffer?

  50. Todd, scroll down to CNS, Tripedia…..Autism is listed as a possible side effect on this website below.

    tinyurl.com/55zesx

    I sustained partial hearing loss from just one vaccine in 2007 – the rubella which was given to me after delivery. So, the vaccine can cause the same injuries (your risk of injuries are far greater from the vaccine than the disease though) that the disease can and hearing loss is listed as a side effect to many vaccines. My baby endured high-pitched screaming off/on for 3 days after his 2 & 4 mo. vaccines. I did call both times and was told this is quite “normal”. I now know that “normal” means it happens frequently to many children. It is also indictative of brain swelling. Like a fool I had my child vaccinated again at 6 mo. and he endured partial seizures (head to toe spasms with eyes rolling back). It was then that his doctor was alerted to his reactions with all three rounds (the nurses never told her??) and she informed me that his risks outweigh his benefits at this time. He is now on the Autism spectrum and I blame the vaccines after what I saw. To read my entire story – I have 3 more victims I’ve learned….go to http://vaccinesexposed.blogspot.com

    My family will never receive another vaccine again and I will continue to educate others to spare them the pain that I’ve had to go through.

  51. Adrian Lopez

    From rxlist.com, on Tripedia:

    “Adverse events reported during post-approval use of Tripedia vaccine include idiopathic thrombocytopenic purpura, SIDS, anaphylactic reaction, cellulitis, autism, convulsion/grand mal convulsion, encephalopathy, hypotonia, neuropathy, somnolence and apnea. Events were included in this list because of the seriousness or frequency of reporting. Because these events are reported voluntarily from a population of uncertain size, it is not always possible to reliably estimate their frequencies or to establish a causal relationship to components of Tripedia vaccine.” [http://www.rxlist.com/tripedia-drug.htm]

    The key sentence is this: “Because these events are reported voluntarily from a population of uncertain size, it is not always possible to reliably estimate their frequencies or to establish a causal relationship to components of Tripedia vaccine.”

    People who think their kid has developed autism because of exposure to Tripedia will report it as such, whether or not it is true.

  52. Todd W.

    @Dawn

    Thank you for the link. I am curious, though, where that information came from, as it is not the official product labeling registered with the FDA. It may include unofficial information gather by people outside of the product manufacturer or FDA, which may or may not be causally linked to the product.

    As Adrian Lopez mentions, by law, product manufacturers must reports any adverse event feedback they receive in relation to their product, whether it is actually resulting from the product or not. So there may be adverse reactions that occur subsequent to administration of the product but are not caused at all by the vaccine. Also, with a “vaccines cause autism” atmosphere, many people are likely to report X, Y or Z vaccine as causing their child’s autism.

    Also, I would like to know where you get your data that the risks of complications from vaccines are higher than the risks of complications from the diseases they prevent. According to the CDC, the risks of adverse events from vaccines are significantly lower than risk from preventable diseases.

    That said, some people are more susceptible to harm from vaccines than others, and I would question the medical staff administering the vaccines, rather than the vaccines themselves. It sounds as if your child may have shown signs that, according to the labeling for Tripedia, would contraindicate the vaccine for him. I admire your efforts to get people to educate themselves and read the vaccine product labeling, but I still question your strong anti-vaccine tones.

    Vaccines do have risks. In general, those risks are low, while the benefits of the vaccines are quite high, for both the recipient and those who come in contact with the recipient. The documentation accompanying the vaccines are very thorough about what those risks are, and when the vaccine should not be administered. It seems like a lot of situations where children do suffer harm, it is after the medical staff (nurse, physician, pediatrician) ignored signs of a bad reaction.

    As to the research, there still is no quality research that causally links vaccines directly to autism.

    I feel for you and your family, and I hope the best for you. Do you have any Applied Behavior Aanalysis programs in your area? I’ve seen firsthand the benefits of such programs started early on.

  53. jason

    For the provaxies!!! Wake up!!! Your body is equipt with all the necessary means to fight off any disease. You interfere with its capabilities when you inject poisons into your body that incapacitate this ability to fight disease. Diet that includes red#40 yellow #6, MSG, any fructose corn syrups, hydrogenated anything, hell 90% of ingrediencts in food now days you can’t even pronounce, and you need a short story to list the ingredients. Back in the 8th grade I remember home economics(cooking class) cookies consisted of flour, eggs, salt, sugar and chocolate chips. So why if you buy cookies from the store you need 5 minutes to read the ingredients. This is what kills your immune system. Wake up people. Your sheeple. Follow the idiot in charge huh? You all voted for Obama huh? Retards. Voting, all this vax anti-vax, Nasa, its all a hog and pony show, smoke and mirrors. You are ignorant. You probably think Edison invented the light bulb too. You all come home after work and watch some reality show to keep your dull mind occupied until you feel sleepy enough to go to sleep, that is if you haven’t ingested 4 energy(sugar) drinks during your day. Got the shakes huh? Your addicted to your emotions. Your cells have little to no nutrient receptor sites left by age thirty. Which is why you will most likely be on several medications for several health issues between your 30th-40th birthday. You are all ADD, you can’t focus on anything that doesn’t make you feel good, or benefit one of your many emotional crack habits. You look so good in your BMW. Your clothes are High dollar. Wow, look at you. You got a degree, wow. I know lots of idiots with degrees. I could be a doctor too, just hand me a prescription pad. Theres enough ads on tv for drugs being pushed who needs anything else. By the way, who do you think has more money?, the drug company’s or the few doctors that actually have the balls to stand up and say the truth about vaccines? If you think for one second that your doctor wants to cure you, your asleep at the wheel. 30% of our economy is based on sick people getting treatment, insurance, drugs, vaccines, and the like. Do you think they actually want you to be well? Then they wouldn’t make any money. So wake up!

    Oh and the blog I’m commenting on doesn’t offer any evidence. Quoting the CDC or any other monster fraudsters isn’t evidence. The USDA by law says you can’t cure, treat or prevent any disease without drugs or surgery. Well I cut my finger and it heals all by itself, I must be breaking the law. I was diagnosed hypothyroidistic ten years ago. I refused medication, changed my habits(mostly diet) and wow, I’m no longer diseased. Again, my body broke the law. WAKE UP PEOPLE!!! Your being lied to by your Obamacare advisors. Enjoy your socialism you lazy sheeple.

  54. jason (#54): You said, and I quote: “Your body is equipt [sic] with all the necessary means to fight off any disease.”

    This is so painfully untrue that anything else you say is immediately suspect. If you think otherwise, perhaps you’d care to explain what you mean to the hundreds of millions of people who have died from smallpox. Or cancer. Or AIDS. Or any of thousands of other illnesses which eventually do us in.

    But given your rambling treatise above — which violates my one commenting rule, by the way — I suspect you are impervious to reason, no matter how basic and clear it may be.

  55. I located your web site when looking for some thing different on Bing about topics related to movies, although I had the opportunity to look over this posting and I found it extremely useful indeed.

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