Geekologie reports that Microsoft has opened a chain of retail brick-and-mortar stores.
Of course, if you want to look at more than one item, you have to leave the store and come back in again.
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Phil Plait, the creator of Bad Astronomy, is an astronomer, lecturer, and author. After ten years working on Hubble Space Telescope and six more working on astronomy education, he struck out on his own as a writer. He's written two books, dozens of magazine articles, and 12 bazillion blog articles. He is a skeptic and fights the abuse of science, but his true love is praising the wonders of real science.
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February 16th, 2009 at 9:09 am
Will they have a “genius” bar?
February 16th, 2009 at 9:16 am
As long as it doesn’t have that damn paper clip.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:23 am
I think its cool. If anything it will give MS a face to consumers more directly than they’re huge reliance on crappy OEM’s.
I’ve spent 2 minutes of my life in an Apple store and i couldn’t wait to get out. Hopefully Microsoft’s store won’t feel so pretentious.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:24 am
Wait for the headline in a few weeks:
Microsoft Store Crashes – Dozens missing or dead when Microsoft store gets Blue Screen of Death.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:24 am
I wish i could edit my posts. *their*
February 16th, 2009 at 9:24 am
I don’t quite see the point when they have such a huge penetration in the 3rd party retail market. Seems like they’re throwing money out the window to try and be like Apple.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:25 am
I’ve actually seen the WSOD on the mac more than i’ve seen the BSOD Mr Squid
February 16th, 2009 at 9:25 am
It is worth noting that, historically, the best microsoft products have been hardware: great mice, great joysticks, top-notch keyboards. Their flight simulator is pretty fine too. The rest of their stuff… meh.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:31 am
Once you’ve shopped there once does that mean you’ll never be able to shop anywhere else again?
And Byron, there’s no way it could be as pretentious as Apple’s store, if anyone managed that I think the Universe would collapse in on itself. I suppose Bono managed to top those pretentiousness levels but he doesn’t count as he’s his own self-contained universe…
February 16th, 2009 at 9:32 am
Does Microsoft really want to give customers a place to confront its employees directly? Up to now, anonymity was the only way to keep employees safe. Now they’re going to be demanding danger pay.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:36 am
Yeah, mac folk love to trot out the BSOD canard. I have not had a PC crash on me in at least 6 years. I don’t even know if the BSOD exists in Vista. That said, I do think the idea of a Windows store is kind of stupid. As drksky points out, the best thing about a PC is that you can get anything you need from a 3rd or even 4th party.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:39 am
Yawn… Mac FanBoi says anti-Microsoft things.
(These kinds of posts are possibly the only thing NOT worth reading from Mr BA)
February 16th, 2009 at 9:47 am
more directly than they’re huge reliance on crappy OEM’s.
The OEMs may be “crappy”, but at least they support their own products *and* Microsoft’s products.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:49 am
This was unecessary.
February 16th, 2009 at 9:57 am
“Of course, if you want to look at more than one item, you have to leave the store and come back in again.”
Oh Phil… that joke is sooooo 1980′s.
February 16th, 2009 at 10:00 am
While I agree that this is a silly idea and that Microsft has its problem it could be worse. With Apple the only choice you have is the color of the shell of the machine.
February 16th, 2009 at 10:07 am
You need to make sure your vaccinations are up-to-date, too.
February 16th, 2009 at 10:32 am
How to go to a Microsoft store:
1. Press the Open Door button.
2. Wait for door to open.
3. At the next door with the sign “Are you sure you want to open this door?”, choose the “Yes” button.
4. At the next door, read the “Certified Microsoft Store Verification Form”, sign data and push the button “I agree”.
5. At the next door, “More than one person is currently visiting this store, are you sure you wish to continue?”, press the “Yes” button.
Note: You may be required to contact someone in another country to re-register to “Permit to speak with a Microsoft Store Employee” via phone before finally entering the store.
February 16th, 2009 at 10:41 am
Jason Hanford-Smith– you’re calling me a “Mac fan-boi”? Seriously? Wow, that’s pretty funny.
Macs are the worst computers on the market, except for all the other ones.
February 16th, 2009 at 10:43 am
The pictures of the store look essentially the same as Best buy or CompUSA. With Circuit City going out of business and a general economic downturn, I can’t imagine a worse time to be doing this. Considering computer and electronic retails are essentially Microsoft stores already, I think Microsoft would be much better off paying the stores to features their products more prominently, hiring full-time pushers for Microsoft products to work in the stores (like Apple had at one point in Compusa), and sending the stores highly-polished demo units along with enough money to guarantee they are placed well and that store employees tell people to buy them. Taking on the risk themselves when there doesn’t seem to be much more of a chance of reward seems silly to me.
February 16th, 2009 at 10:51 am
I was considering getting a Mac workstation but stuck with Microsoft after getting an iPhone. You wanna talk about running one app at a time? How about browsing and trying to do real work without cut and paste?
Apple: cute but stupid. I’d like to throttle the Apple Store “genius” who talked me into buying MobileMe, a service that’s not as good as free alternatives.
February 16th, 2009 at 10:51 am
@ Black Cat:
Yes indeed. Seems strategically questionable, at best.
I think the folks in Redmond have a serious jones about Jobs and his whole hipper than thou thing. I mean, seriously, Zune???
They should stick to being an evil monopoly. They do that pretty well.
February 16th, 2009 at 10:53 am
I don’t get it.
(No honestly, I actually don’t)
February 16th, 2009 at 11:01 am
As opposed to Apple, which sucks at it pretty badly. I don’t mind evil monopolistic corporations, but a corporation that is evil and monopolistic but too incompetent to be a success at it bugs me for some reason. Especially one that promotes being stupid as a life style choice. “Having to use two mouse buttons is way too complicated for our users, lets just stick to one.”
February 16th, 2009 at 11:08 am
@ Blackcat
Heh heh… Well, depends on your definition of success, I guess. Jobs wanted to change the world. He did. For better or worse is debatable.
I’ve been a mac user since 1987, but it still never ceases to amaze me how good they are at marketing their stuff as “lifestyle” not product. That’s something Microsoft has tried to do, but they always seem to fail miserably. Dunno why. Maybe it’s those gloomy Seattle winters? (Native Seattlite, so I’s can talk.)
February 16th, 2009 at 11:10 am
I would consider teaching consumers to value form over substance to be for the worse.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:12 am
I have to agree here. I have two machines on Vista (one Vista 64 Ultimate, the other Vista 32 Home) and they are both rock solid. I don’t even know if the Vista BSOD exists, or if it’s even blue. It could be the chartreuse screen of death for all I know.
Mip for mip, flop for flop, Macs are more expensive than an equivalent windows machine. But when you buy apple, it’s not about the computer (or the mediocre telephone, or the mp3 player which is really a simple piece of software and hardware)… it’s about being trendy. That’s why Apple can charge a premium, and why people will pay it.
Apple deserves kudos for selling an image. They do that very well.
Their products? meh. An iPhone is pathetic as a telephone… but it sure LOOKS slick when you use it. There are a zillion music and video players on the market that fundamentally do the same thing, but an iPod LOOKS slick when you use it.
The biggest giggle I get out of Mac folks is when they buy their Macintosh… then run windows on it so they can be compatible with the rest of the world. They never see the humour in that.
However, getting back on topic… someone up there mentioned about microsoft exposing their employees to the public through the store. I would think that will be an issue… everyone with a (real or imagined) axe to grind with microsoft products is going to take it out on Microsoft store employees. That first crop of employees is going to wish they were telephone solicitors.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:13 am
@bjn:
are you serious? Can you name any phone having better browser than iPhone? Android browser comes clostest, but it is based on the same Apple’s engine WebKit but lacks multitouch greatness.
Somehow I very much doubt you.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:15 am
Will all the exits be marked “Enter”?
February 16th, 2009 at 11:19 am
I guess this is where I stand on the sidelines shouting “Linux!” and get pointed and laughed at.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:21 am
I should point out that Apple did NOT develop Webkit. Webkit was originally developed by KDE for Linux as KHTML. Apple forked the project, slapped a new name on it, and released it as their own. Actually, they did the same thing with the kernel that runs their OS. They didn’t even develop the AAC codec that iTunes is based on. This seems to be a thing with them lately, the core of most of their projects was developed by somebody else. They just fork the project, slap a new name and some fancy graphical front-end on it, and sell it to consumers.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:22 am
Dimestore:
I can state from first-hand experience that it does, in fact, still exist. (Though, honestly, it’s been few and far between.)
TheBlackCat:
Perhaps they got a good deal on all that freed-up retail space?
Romeo Vitelli:
Most people would probably understand that the salespeople on the floor didn’t design/write the software. Of course, many won’t make the distinction, given how tech support people are treated in general.
I do have to wonder, though. As many others have pointed out, Apple at least has its own hardware to sell in those stores. While there are Microsoft-branded keyboards, mice, and other accessories, they don’t have any computers themselves. I wonder what brand they use in their stores? I wonder how much they paid MS to use their brand?
And how long before someone walks through the store with a virus-laden USB stick and “tests” the computers on display? (“What do you mean we were supposed to turn off autorun?”)
February 16th, 2009 at 11:27 am
Todd:
Of course! Those are the doors that let you enter the mall.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:32 am
@ Evolving Squid:
it’s about being trendy.t.
Must…not…enter…THAT…debate….
But seriously, me? Trendy? In 1987? Heh heh…I wish.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:35 am
“Macs are the worst computers on the market, except for all the other ones.”
Having had the dubious pleasure of dealing with Windows, Linux (Susy, Fedora, and Ubuntu) and OS-X, I can truly say that this sums it up for me.
After more than a year, my MacBook still boots completely in about 45 seconds. After three months, my desktop (Windows XP) took about ten minutes to be fully functional after switching it on. It was the reason I moved away from Microsoft. I don’t know how Vista performs on this front. Anyone?
February 16th, 2009 at 11:42 am
I don’t see why boot time is really that important. I only reboot my computer once a week or so (if I don’t forget). But out of curiosity, mine boots in 65 seconds. And it shuts down in maybe 10. And the first 30 seconds is getting through the bios (which independent of the OS) and the bootloader (which I could turn off entirely if I wanted).
February 16th, 2009 at 11:43 am
And appropriately enough, the Microsoft stores don’t have any locks on their doors.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:46 am
TheBlackCat: Are you running Vista?
FYI: I like to switch off my desktop because I am not using it as a server, and there is no point in wasting the energy by having it run idly.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:49 am
No, I’m using Linux. Vista boots faster, but I’ve only used it two or three times.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:55 am
Well, that obviously does not count. I want to know how fast Vista boots after several months of regular use.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:56 am
Everyone should remember that the xbox is also a Microsoft product, and the most popular console right now. So I’m betting these stores will rely heavily on that demographic instead of computer users.
February 16th, 2009 at 11:57 am
Uninstall the 50 different apps that are loading on start-up. The reason the mac doesn’t take that long is there aren’t any compatible garbage apps for it to load.
I had a friend who wanted me to look at why his computer was running so slow. I kid you not, his system tray was about 1/3 of the total taskbar length.
February 16th, 2009 at 12:03 pm
drksky, been there done that. The “uninstall” function rarely removes all the dll files.
February 16th, 2009 at 12:04 pm
@ uselesstwit: No, depending on how you measure it either the PS2 or the Wii is the most popular console right now, by far. Neither the Xbox nor the Xbox 360 even come close.
February 16th, 2009 at 12:31 pm
While we are on the subject of how trendy Mac is, take a look at Apple’s newest laptop, the Macbook Wheel:
http://tinyurl.com/8x53o8
February 16th, 2009 at 12:38 pm
Points out that when you install iTunes on a PC, it puts “garbage” in the start tray. And installs stuff you don’t want. Not funny.
February 16th, 2009 at 12:56 pm
I wonder if they’ll offer the Blue Screen of Death at competetive prices?
@Cannonball Jones:
Do NOT diss the Bono-man! He knows if you’re awake. He knows if you’ve been good or bad.
February 16th, 2009 at 1:03 pm
Windows is garbage. Plain and simple. Give me the BSD Unix core of OS X any day.
And before you call be an ignorant Mac fanboi, I am a registered Windows developer, and I write specialized Windows applications at work, in Visual Basic and C++, as part of my job. I have a deep understanding of the internal workings of both Windows XP and Max OS X. I don’t do Vista because my employer won’t let the install discs within the radar horizon of our campus.
What people forget is that in addition to the fanbois, you have the rabid anti-Apple folks who will pick on everything and anything.
as pretentious as Apple’s store
How is a store pretentious? Does pretentious mean “clean and well arranged” in this usage? I dropped off my sister’s iMac to have something fixed last year. At 8pm on a Saturday the Apple store was packed. All sorts of folks. There was a whole family learning how to digitize and edit their home movies.
But they’re all just cult members, right? Real computing is done in basements by fat, bearded, pale guys in dirty T-shirts, yes? Hey, I can play dueling stereotypes all day if you want.
Their products? meh. An iPhone is pathetic as a telephone… it’s about being trendy.
You just don’t understand the attractiveness of ease of use. Function without form can stink as badly as form without function. I know several PhDs with extensive computer experience who love their iPhones. They have a different opinion on what makes a good, useful phone than you. Is that not allowed? Are they dumb because of that? The only reason people buy an iPhone is trendiness?
I also know people with cheaper phones who never use it for anything other than a phone because the more advanced functions are so obfuscated by sub-simian interface design they never learn or never bother with them because they are such a pain in the butt.
Disclaimer: I do not have an iPhone. I have an ancient Motorola i510 that is built to the Mil-Spec standard for iPhones. It was once run over by a Mini-Cooper, and another time it fell down two flights of stairs. Still working and not a scratch on it. With it’s dimming, monochrome LCD text screen, it pwns all!
The biggest giggle I get out of Mac folks is when they buy their Macintosh… then run windows on it so they can be compatible with the rest of the world. They never see the humour in that.
That’s because you are manufacturing humor where there is none. Some applications are Windows only (games being a big one). Many people, like me, have a use for both OSes, and running them on a single box is convenient. I run Linux, too. Platform agnosticism is the only realistic position on this.
They just fork the project, slap a new name and some fancy graphical front-end on it, and sell it to consumers.
Well, there’s the whole pile of well funded additional development done in house by Apple. WebKit quickly left KHTML in the dust. In fact, last I checked, the KHTML folks were looking to unfork the whole thing with a merge into Webkit.
The use of open standards and open source is a *GOOD* thing. Webkit is still open source and actively developed at webkit.org. Apple gives back to the open source community. Can you even imagine Microsoft doing that?
“Having to use two mouse buttons is way too complicated for our users, lets just stick to one.”
The 1990s called. They want their talking point back. The Mac OS has supported multibutton mice since before OS X. The Microsoft Intellimouse series, for example, works without any additional drivers. Also, the one button mouse for absolute newbie users is supported by actual research in human interfaces.
Honestly, some of you sound as if you haven’t even touched a Mac since OS 6.
I don’t see why boot time is really that important.
There are many corporate environments where computers are shut down at the end of the day, especially if the computers are part of a secure network. I know some areas where employees are required to shut down when they go to lunch. This is due primarily to the insecure nature of Windows.
February 16th, 2009 at 1:15 pm
what about the arctic ice pack? is it increasing or decreasing?
February 16th, 2009 at 1:32 pm
Vista = teh awesome
February 16th, 2009 at 1:33 pm
>>They have a different opinion on what makes a good, useful phone than you
Agreed.
I expect a telephone to function first and foremost as a telecommunications device when and where my service provider offers coverage.
iPhone fails that test… and fails it badly. It’s poor call quality combined with terrible 3G functionality relative to competing products on the market render it useless to me, interface notwithstanding. And it does have a nice interface. Too bad it doesn’t function as a telephone very well. The other stuff it can do is available in other telephones as well, so at the end of the day, it all boils down to “sexy interfaces” versus “telecommunications functionality”. I choose telecommunications.
Therefore it is a useless telephone. Anything else it does is secondary.
Some people don’t care if their phone functions well as a phone. They want all the other stuff. I think that’s silly, but that’s just my opinion. I suppose they figure my wanting a phone to work as a phone is silly. That’s their opinion, and they’re welcome to it.
If Apple wanted to sell a good telephone, they would. They want to sell an image. They have succeeded. But let’s call it what it is.
February 16th, 2009 at 1:47 pm
That is all.
February 16th, 2009 at 1:48 pm
They could have spent that development time and money on improving KHTML. Instead they made a fork, splitting the community and forcing people to code everything twice. That is part of the problem with Apple, they demand complete control over everything.
And the KHTML developers rejected the idea of a merge because Apple was keeping too tight of control over the Webkit project. They wanted a community-driven project like KHTML, while Apple wants complete and total control over Webkit. Especially considering how bad a partner apple was before the fork, they are very wary of investing too much time and effort in a project that nobody but Apple ultimately has any real say in.
You really think Apple did that voluntarily? KHTML was and remains LGPL. Because of this Apple was legally required to make any fork of the KHTML project LGPL as well. They had no choice but to keep it open source. They would have gotten sued by the FSF is they hadn’t.
Yeah, it is called ooxml. Although there are a lot of complaints about it, and I do not support it myself, the fact is Microsoft voluntarily opened up their format, while Apple only did it because they were legally required to. They opened the older office 97 formats as well. They have also been closely cooperating with the open-source Mono project for using .Net on Linux. That is three right there. How many instances can you show me where Apple voluntarily opened their projects (as opposed to simply obeying the license of an existing open project)?
I know they support it, but when all the their computers come with one-button mice, and their laptops all only have one button, it sort of tells you where their focus lies.
My father had a Mac OS X computer (PowerMac G4, to be specific),which I used extensively. That was where I really learned to dislike Mac.
February 16th, 2009 at 2:04 pm
I’ve never owned a PC that could run for more than a year without a complete reinstall.
I still run Win 2000 though, which I have always found to be very very solid (though unless you have pre-installed up-to-date virus software, the machine is literally compromised 11 seconds after you plug it into an internet connection). I’m about to wipe that system after 10 months. It got hit, and now a number of programs fail to run.
My Macbook G4, on the other hand, is almost 3 years old, and hasn’t had a reinstall. Hasn’t needed it. Heck I’ve upgraded to a new laptop just because I wanted something faster that would do what I need for music and video capabilities.. I still use the old one though.
I think some people here get their noses out of joint because they think Mac users think they’re special. I run both Mac and Windows, and they both have their merits. Windows is great for games, but often pissy with drivers. Mac does a lot of what I need, though games (which I hardly play anyway) aren’t usually designed for this platform. Fortunately I could run a dual-boot with WinXP (which I still don’t own – how many years did it take them to perfect it again?!).
A friend of mine recently reinstalled his XP, and hilarity ensued. The onboard sound won’t work (and he’s not a novice at this stuff), and Microsoft wouldn’t recognize his….. Microsoft headset. D’oh!
February 16th, 2009 at 2:36 pm
I have an iPhone. it’s the best phone I ever had. *phone*.
My mother had many phones over the years. She now has an iPhone. For the first time in her whole life, she understands how to send SMS.
And BlackCat, your description of the Mac or of Apple open source projects is so totally horse shit that I won’t ever start to debunk it.
I work professionally with PCs. That’s why I recommend Macs to all my friends and family.
February 16th, 2009 at 2:39 pm
I know they support it, but when all the their computers come with one-button mice, and their laptops all only have one button, it sort of tells you where their focus lies.
All their computers come with a Mighty Mouse now. Four programable buttons… or one. It’s up to you.
My MacBook, OTOH, appears to have about 107 buttons.
February 16th, 2009 at 3:11 pm
I have used both Mac and PC and they both have their issues. Neither is perfect. However, the last Mac laptop I had took several minutes to boot and then ran like molasses in PC emulator. I was continually frustrated with how user-unfriendly — or perhaps user-condescending it was. But, I soldiered on, thinking that “hey, this is Mac, it’s supposed to be cool.” It never got better and I finally reverted to my PC laptop. Many of the apps I use (graphics, video editing, sound editing, etc.) are much more stable on PC and some don’t even run on Mac (or if they do, they don’t play well).
Truth to tell, both PC and MAC have their good and bad points.
About that iPhone, I have to echoe PZ’s thoughts about it. I want my phone to be a phone, not a dancing bear with twinkly ribbons and a disco ball twirling on its head. Which is about what I thought of the iPhone. I’d get a Crackberry first, but I’m sticking with my trusty Motorola biscuit until it wears out.
February 16th, 2009 at 3:34 pm
I’d say, you guys are all cracking me up. I read every comment until this one, and the OS-OS arguments are getting more and more fun to read.
I must say, no OS is perfect, so we’ll just have to live with that. As far as I know, all the OSes I’ve encountered have their advantages and disadvantages, from Macs, to Linuxes, to Wins.
February 16th, 2009 at 3:35 pm
I hear they’re a consumer trap – once you walk through the doors you’re locked in.
I’m rather disappointed that even astronomers have moved away from their earlier UNIX heritage and now suffer from MSWinduhs. I would probably be using QNIX for most of my instrument work if it weren’t for Linux. So when friends tell me about problems they have with an instrument they built or are trying to build and they mention MSWinduhs, I just fall on the floor laughing.
February 16th, 2009 at 3:50 pm
Well, there’s your problem. You’re running an OS that hasn’t been supported for about 2 years now. Do they still even release security patches for 2K any more? I’m sure there are plenty of people who would be thrilled to see your unpatched machine pop up on a public net. …and you’re hooking a windows machine directly to an internet connection why?
Let me guess, he reinstalled XP from an original disk with no new drivers or service packs? Onboard sound doesn’t just quit because you install Windows. Either the hardware fails, or the driver is incorrect. Sounds like he’s more of a novice than you think he is.
I’m no Microsoft apologist, but is anecdotes like these that really get my dander up. Properly maintained (and I mean that as simple as letting it get updates) a Windows box will run for years without problems.
Outside of issues with bad hardware, I’ve never received a BSoD, and I have machines that run for months without being rebooted.
I think Windows does a pretty good job considering the amount of different hardware configurations it supports. As opposed to OS X, which run on only certain configurations that Apple tells you it runs on.
February 16th, 2009 at 3:57 pm
@jest:
“I’ve never owned a PC that could run for more than a year without a complete reinstall.”
I have a PC (well, Opteron252 uh… ‘desktop’ – yeah, I’ll call it a desktop) which has been running since mid 2005 without any reinstall. It’s running Linux though. It has w2k for dealing with government agencies who hire people who don’t know what they’re doing and force people to interact with MS software. w2k is really showing its age though, but just at the time I thought I’d shuck out some money for XP, it was taken off the shelves and replaced with Visduh (or Visdud – whatever). I’m developing a phobia for booting the w2k partition thanks to the anticipation of all the painful things which will happen and which just don’t happen (or at least not as frequently) on my usual systems.
February 16th, 2009 at 4:01 pm
@MadScientist: I might have you beat. I’ve got a Pentium III 450 that’s been running, as my firewall, for the better part of 9 years. RedHad linux, of course. Granted, it doesn’t do much more than pass packets back and forth, but it’ll probably do that well for another 10 years.
February 16th, 2009 at 4:41 pm
Evolving Squid: I know! I loved my Microsoft Natural Keyboard Elite and my Microsoft Intelimouse that I went though the (for me) unprecedented trouble to actually track down the newer editions of the same products last time I bought a new computer.
Who’d have thunk that Microsoft makes good hardware?
February 16th, 2009 at 4:46 pm
“As opposed to OS X, which run on only certain configurations that Apple tells you it runs on.”
For a computer user rather than a tinkerer, this is actually a good business model; it makes it much easier to make a user-friendly interface.
February 16th, 2009 at 5:06 pm
@Pieter: That’s just fine and dandy. If that’s what you want, that’s fine. But the holier than thou Apple super-freaks use this argument to prove that Apple is superior, because “it just works”.
“It just works” isn’t good enough for the tinkerers. But it certainly doesn’t mean that PC hardware or OSes are inferior.
The point is that Windows runs just fine if you keep it up to date, and don’t install every piece of junkware or stupid browser toolbar that comes through your inbox.
February 16th, 2009 at 5:24 pm
Entry to Microsoft store:
3 doors:
Retry (returns, complaints, questions)
Ignore (entrance)
Abort (exit only)
J/P=?
February 16th, 2009 at 5:45 pm
About that iPhone, I have to echoe PZ’s thoughts about it. I want my phone to be a phone, not a dancing bear with twinkly ribbons and a disco ball twirling on its head.
That’s fine. Some people want a phone to do more, and calling them trendy and implying they are stupid is nonsensical. I may think Windows is a pile of duct taped garbage, and I have the underlying knowledge to think that, but I don’t pick on Windows users. I have a Windows machine myself to telecommute because my employer, in the name of network security, only allows the most insecure commercial OS to connect. Yeah, go figure.
They could have spent that development time and money on improving KHTML. Instead they made a fork, splitting the community and forcing people to code everything twice.
This is a silly complaint. OSS projects fork all the time. It’s the nature of things. Apple and the KHTML folks had different goals. That’s life, BC. As a result, we now have WebKit which is highly thought of amongst the web design community. Some designers have even campaigned for MS to simply adopt WebKit for IE8.
If you must complain, go grouse at MS for not following web standards. IE6 has been the albatross around the neck of web developers for years. MS couldn’t even be bothered to release a simple PNG transparency patch. IE7 was a mess, but IE8 might be better.
OOXML? You mean that broken, patent riddled mess? You’re kidding, right? You’re comparing OOXML to WebKit? Really?
That is part of the problem with Apple, they demand complete control over everything.
Because at the end of the day they are a commercial company trying to earn a profit. The OS and its components have to work well and securely. I know this offends the pants off many a idealist hippie type [;-)] but there it is.
February 16th, 2009 at 5:48 pm
Entry to Microsoft store: 3 doors: Retry (returns, complaints, questions) Ignore (entrance) Abort (exit only)
And a full size Jerry Seinfeld and Bill Gates at the entrance with Gates wagging his rear.
Actually, that might make potential customers run away screaming with bleeding eyes. Never mind.
February 16th, 2009 at 5:56 pm
My old computer was used day and night for 7 years (bought in 2001, retired in late 2008), runs XP, and I never formatted or reinstalled.
But then, I’m not dumb enough to install every fraking toolbar that comes my way, I was careful about spyware and the like, and I didn’t make a habit of constantly installing and uninstalling programs for no reason like some people do (to make more room for pr0n, I assume).
February 16th, 2009 at 7:19 pm
@ gopher65 : the issue is, why should installing and uninstalling programs make any difference whatsoever? Why should it have such a negative impact on the computer’s performance? Uninstalling something should uninstall it, remove it from your computer entirely. Installing something should only make a difference if you actually run the installed program. Neither is the case with windows.
February 16th, 2009 at 7:38 pm
Kudos to Microsoft for opening stores in this economy. I’m sure there will be tough competition to get one of the few retail jobs available. I wish them well, as I wish Apple well with their stores. I have a fully decked-out 17″ MacBook Pro which proudly runs Windows Vista Ultimate full-time under Boot Camp. Flawlessly. It’s truly the best of both worlds–the very slickest hardware running the most widely supported and connected consumer/business operating system on the planet. And did I say it runs flawlessly?
We now return you to your regularly scheduled religious war.
February 16th, 2009 at 7:47 pm
Naw religious wars are more logical then this.
February 16th, 2009 at 8:26 pm
@Drksky: Windows 2000 is in fact still supported with security patches. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/891861 says, “The end-of-life date for Windows 2000 will be no sooner than January 1, 2010.” There weren’t any new ones this month, though.
February 16th, 2009 at 8:43 pm
Ah. I stand corrected. It’s been so long since I’ve seen a 200 machine, I figured they had given up on it too.
February 17th, 2009 at 12:32 am
I am not knowledgable enough to comment on the hardware issue, but it seems highly likely that there is both inferior and superior PC hardware out there, compared to Apple’s hardware.
As for “constantly installing and uninstalling programs for no reason”, I thought that the point is that this is up to the user. How is it even acceptable that regular use, like installing and uninstalling software, is going to slow down the OS? That’s just a bad product.
February 17th, 2009 at 7:22 am
Ah! But that isn’t Windows’ problem. The problem that comes with installing and uninstalling software is because of poor registry clean-up by the 3rd party software’s installer. So blame your problems on the badly written software, not Windows.
February 17th, 2009 at 7:55 am
We now return you to your regularly scheduled religious war.
Actually, that’s yet another stereotype- that any OS discussion at all is a religious war. No one is being religious here. In fact many commentators, me included, use multiple OSes. We’re just shooting the breeze.
Uninstalling something should uninstall it, remove it from your computer entirely.
I felt Apple was on the right path with packages, but they missed a little bit it by having a common area for preference files and the like. I’ve always advocated self contained applications that could be dragged and dropped from one computer to another.
February 17th, 2009 at 9:46 am
Why should the person writing the program even have to worry about that? A smart installation program would keep track of every file and configuration option it has added (or a list of all the files and configuration options it will add), and then go back and remove them one by one. Or it should just stick all the files for a given program in one directory and just remove that directory. Uninstalling should be the opposite of installing, so the one making the installation should only have to define one of the two.
February 17th, 2009 at 10:47 am
@ drksky, you were proven wrong regarding security updates with Win2k. Mind you, there are companies who never bothered to make drivers for it (like for my M-Audio external audio box, which won’t run on that machine though their older PCI sound cards will work fine).
“and you’re hooking a windows machine directly to an internet connection why?”
Um… seriously? Are microsoft OS’s not supposed to be used in conjunction with the internet? As long as I have the ISP-provided anti-virus software on it, it seems to do fine, provided I don’t take a wrong turn on the Web. I’m not trying to be a bastard here, but you need to clarify what you meant by that. Seems a bit silly running a machine that you’re not supposed to connect to the ‘net?
Also, you should really think about what you say regarding people you don’t know. I simply can’t see how you can come to a conclusion based on a tiny bit of information. This “novice” friend of mine, who reinstalled XP and had hardware problems, didn’t do anything different from the last time. He did the service packs. He grabbed the newest drivers. Why would this be such a hassle? The only thing I can think of, and this has happened to me in the past as well, is being careful WHAT you install first, in which sequence He actually did contact Microsoft about it, and they never did resolve the issue. I’m betting a system wipe and another clean install will somehow work better if he chooses to install, say, the network drivers, first.
@Mad Scientist, I can understand why you answered the way you did. When I referred to reinstalling an OS on a PC once a year, I was referring to Windows (not XP though, as I never got around to bothering with it based on what I saw on friends systems). Linux is a whole other OS, obviously. I should say that the PC, as a machine, is perfectly good. I actually have a Win98 machine that still runs (Duron 750mhz), and I have had it up for 50 days without problems (though if used steadily, that number will diminish because of system resources). But of course, there’s not much use for that machine anymore
And I suppose that I have gone over a year without a clean install, but not always.
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One of my favorite things is when I install a program and there’s a DLL file missing. Sometimes it’s simply not in the right directory, whereas other times I have to google the answer to what’s going on. I usually find the answer, download the DLL, and things are fine. Except the time wasted, which should never happen.