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	<title>Comments on: LCROSS didn&#8217;t destroy the Moon. Whaddya know?</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/10/20/lcross-didnt-destroy-the-moon-whaddya-know/</link>
	<description>I am an astronomer, writer, and skeptic. I likes reality the way it is, and I aims to keep it that way. My real name is Phil Plait, and I run the Bad Astronomy blog.</description>
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		<title>By: StevoR</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/10/20/lcross-didnt-destroy-the-moon-whaddya-know/comment-page-2/#comment-225487</link>
		<dc:creator>StevoR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 07:40:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=6265#comment-225487</guid>
		<description>@ 65. Sully: Good one - I like it! :-)

@ 25 (me)

&lt;i&gt; ... not only does this letter writer have no idea about LCROSS, not only hasn’t he (?) heard of – d’uh! – craters; s/he  thinks the Moon controls our *weather* and *atmospheric pressure* for pity’s sake! Plus he (?) seems to imply that scientists aren’t even human or, as AE sexist~ally (not a word? It is now!) put it, “man”. Depressing really. :-( I’m writing a response to hopefully go in the paper too but we’ll have to wait &amp; see if that gets published.&lt;/i&gt;

&lt;b&gt;Update :&lt;/b&gt; 

It did! Took a while but finally my letter in reply to that anti-science whackjobs ravings was indeed published :

I&#039;d written :

*** 
[QUOTE] In a letter texted to the[I] ‘Sunday Mail’  [/I](2009 Oct. 18th) A.E. Swain of Semaphore spouted  &amp; I quote verbatim:

&lt;I&gt;”Are NASA insane? Bombing our moon that controls our weather, tidal changes and atmospheric pressure? It won&#039;t be man that causes his own destruction it will be those silly scientists.” &lt;/I&gt;
 
Well A.E. Swain, haven’t you ever heard of craters? Our Moon is naturally covered in them. Hundreds can be observed with a decent telescope and many are visible even through your garden variety binoculars. All these naturally occurring craters are considerably larger than that made by the LCROSS impact - which, by the way, was not a “bomb” but a spaceprobe. There was absolutely never any danger to Earth or of causing any real harm to the lifeless rock  which is our Moon. Incidentally, A.E., I think you need to do a lot more research and thinking before you write your next letter because our Moon has nothing whatsoever to do with our planets atmospheric pressure or weather and where you got such silly notions is beyond me. Finally, A.E. Swain, I can assure you that scientists and &quot;man&quot; are not mutually exclusive but the same thing - scientists are men and women too! In fact they are intelligent, compassionate and curious women and men who merely seek to understand and learn from our wonderful cosmos in ways that very often benefit humanity - for instance being responsible for the computers and mobile phones we use to convey these messages! [/QUOTE]

***

This was published albeit in slightly edited &amp; toned down form in last Sunday&#039;s &lt;I&gt;&#039;Sunday Mail&#039; &lt;/I&gt;(2009- Nov -8th) &quot;letters&quot;, page 72, second letter down under the header : &lt;I&gt;&quot;Its not rocket science&lt;/I&gt;.&quot; (I&#039;d have preferred &lt;I&gt;&#039;Hasn&#039;t AE heard of craters?&#039;&lt;/I&gt; &amp; there were a couple of typos of their making too but still quite buzz. :-) 

Just thought I&#039;d let y&#039;all know. 

Noted this on the BAUT too - see :

 http://www.bautforum.com/space-exploration/90153-lcross-lunar-crater-orbiting-sensing-satellite-mission-4.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ 65. Sully: Good one &#8211; I like it! <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>@ 25 (me)</p>
<p><i> &#8230; not only does this letter writer have no idea about LCROSS, not only hasn’t he (?) heard of – d’uh! – craters; s/he  thinks the Moon controls our *weather* and *atmospheric pressure* for pity’s sake! Plus he (?) seems to imply that scientists aren’t even human or, as AE sexist~ally (not a word? It is now!) put it, “man”. Depressing really. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':-(' class='wp-smiley' />  I’m writing a response to hopefully go in the paper too but we’ll have to wait &#038; see if that gets published.</i></p>
<p><b>Update :</b> </p>
<p>It did! Took a while but finally my letter in reply to that anti-science whackjobs ravings was indeed published :</p>
<p>I&#8217;d written :</p>
<p>***<br />
[QUOTE] In a letter texted to the[I] ‘Sunday Mail’  [/I](2009 Oct. 18th) A.E. Swain of Semaphore spouted  &#038; I quote verbatim:</p>
<p><i>”Are NASA insane? Bombing our moon that controls our weather, tidal changes and atmospheric pressure? It won&#8217;t be man that causes his own destruction it will be those silly scientists.” </i></p>
<p>Well A.E. Swain, haven’t you ever heard of craters? Our Moon is naturally covered in them. Hundreds can be observed with a decent telescope and many are visible even through your garden variety binoculars. All these naturally occurring craters are considerably larger than that made by the LCROSS impact &#8211; which, by the way, was not a “bomb” but a spaceprobe. There was absolutely never any danger to Earth or of causing any real harm to the lifeless rock  which is our Moon. Incidentally, A.E., I think you need to do a lot more research and thinking before you write your next letter because our Moon has nothing whatsoever to do with our planets atmospheric pressure or weather and where you got such silly notions is beyond me. Finally, A.E. Swain, I can assure you that scientists and &#8220;man&#8221; are not mutually exclusive but the same thing &#8211; scientists are men and women too! In fact they are intelligent, compassionate and curious women and men who merely seek to understand and learn from our wonderful cosmos in ways that very often benefit humanity &#8211; for instance being responsible for the computers and mobile phones we use to convey these messages! [/QUOTE]</p>
<p>***</p>
<p>This was published albeit in slightly edited &#038; toned down form in last Sunday&#8217;s <i>&#8216;Sunday Mail&#8217; </i>(2009- Nov -8th) &#8220;letters&#8221;, page 72, second letter down under the header : <i>&#8220;Its not rocket science</i>.&#8221; (I&#8217;d have preferred <i>&#8216;Hasn&#8217;t AE heard of craters?&#8217;</i> &#038; there were a couple of typos of their making too but still quite buzz. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>Just thought I&#8217;d let y&#8217;all know. </p>
<p>Noted this on the BAUT too &#8211; see :</p>
<p> <a href="http://www.bautforum.com/space-exploration/90153-lcross-lunar-crater-orbiting-sensing-satellite-mission-4.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.bautforum.com/space-exploration/90153-lcross-lunar-crater-orbiting-sensing-satellite-mission-4.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Nigel Depledge</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/10/20/lcross-didnt-destroy-the-moon-whaddya-know/comment-page-2/#comment-221579</link>
		<dc:creator>Nigel Depledge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 14:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=6265#comment-221579</guid>
		<description>Deep Field (49) said:
&lt;blockquote&gt;I have never really believed there will be water, or at least that the crashes will be able to find it, because I think that at all temperatures the water evaporates (or sublimates), and given enough time all ice will eventually disappear.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Not necessarily.

If we assume that any water on the moon is delivered there by comet impacts, then all we need is for the rate of accumulation of water to exceed the rate of water loss through sublimation.  And the rate of sublimation at any point will depend on the local vapour pressure of the ice, which will depend on temperature.  So in a permanently-shadowed crater, the ice will be very very cold and hence will only sublime very very slowly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Deep Field (49) said:</p>
<blockquote><p>I have never really believed there will be water, or at least that the crashes will be able to find it, because I think that at all temperatures the water evaporates (or sublimates), and given enough time all ice will eventually disappear.</p></blockquote>
<p>Not necessarily.</p>
<p>If we assume that any water on the moon is delivered there by comet impacts, then all we need is for the rate of accumulation of water to exceed the rate of water loss through sublimation.  And the rate of sublimation at any point will depend on the local vapour pressure of the ice, which will depend on temperature.  So in a permanently-shadowed crater, the ice will be very very cold and hence will only sublime very very slowly.</p>
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		<title>By: Diego</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/10/20/lcross-didnt-destroy-the-moon-whaddya-know/comment-page-2/#comment-221558</link>
		<dc:creator>Diego</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 12:31:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=6265#comment-221558</guid>
		<description>The insanity on both ends of the political spectrum drove me nuts.  There were far lefters who worried about affecting the Moon goddess or at least that we would knock the moon out of orbit a la Space:1999.  I ignored them because they seemed completely insane.  But I did have to deal with a friend&#039;s husband who was on Obama&#039;s case for wasting tax dollars &quot;bombing&quot; the moon.  They both asked the question of whether anyone actually thought this mission was a good idea.  Of course they were being rhetorical because they didn&#039;t want to be confronted with any other opinions, but  I went ahead and asked him how far in advance he thought these missions were planned (oh yeah, we launched this probe in a week at Obama&#039;s request, yeah right) because blaming or crediting Obama for NASA&#039;s  long-term mission plans was so ludicrous.  I told him about practical boons that could derive from the mission and asked him if he had no interest in just learning about the universe even if there were no obvious benefits (that would be a no).  All I got back was parroted jokes about drinking bottled water from the Moon and some snide comments followed by him incredulously asking if I REALLY thought we would ever live on the Moon.  He thought it was obvious that if I thought that then I was the complete nut job.  Then he and his wife ended with a hypocritical comment about how liberals always have to criticize their views and opinions and they never say anything to all the things that daily piss them off.  Uh-huh.  Anyway, the whole exchange was highly vexing and an exercise in futility for me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The insanity on both ends of the political spectrum drove me nuts.  There were far lefters who worried about affecting the Moon goddess or at least that we would knock the moon out of orbit a la Space:1999.  I ignored them because they seemed completely insane.  But I did have to deal with a friend&#8217;s husband who was on Obama&#8217;s case for wasting tax dollars &#8220;bombing&#8221; the moon.  They both asked the question of whether anyone actually thought this mission was a good idea.  Of course they were being rhetorical because they didn&#8217;t want to be confronted with any other opinions, but  I went ahead and asked him how far in advance he thought these missions were planned (oh yeah, we launched this probe in a week at Obama&#8217;s request, yeah right) because blaming or crediting Obama for NASA&#8217;s  long-term mission plans was so ludicrous.  I told him about practical boons that could derive from the mission and asked him if he had no interest in just learning about the universe even if there were no obvious benefits (that would be a no).  All I got back was parroted jokes about drinking bottled water from the Moon and some snide comments followed by him incredulously asking if I REALLY thought we would ever live on the Moon.  He thought it was obvious that if I thought that then I was the complete nut job.  Then he and his wife ended with a hypocritical comment about how liberals always have to criticize their views and opinions and they never say anything to all the things that daily piss them off.  Uh-huh.  Anyway, the whole exchange was highly vexing and an exercise in futility for me.</p>
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		<title>By: gopher65</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/10/20/lcross-didnt-destroy-the-moon-whaddya-know/comment-page-2/#comment-221510</link>
		<dc:creator>gopher65</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 05:19:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=6265#comment-221510</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;@ #24 Aerimus:&lt;/b&gt;

I don&#039;t expect that you&#039;re still reading this post, but that isn&#039;t the way baking works. You can&#039;t simply double or halve batch recipes and expect it work exactly the same way. There are an *enormous* number of variables involved in baking that can change the outcome (air pressure, humidity, bacterial concentrations in the food (and types), type of oven (thermal, convection, induction, microwave, infrared - the size and power output change things drastically as well, as does the exact design used), and even the types of fungus that are common in your area... California sourdough rye bread tastes different than everywhere else because of a type of spore that is common in the air there but isn&#039;t common elsewhere. The fungus changes the taste enough to be noticeable).

Suffice to say that any given recipe only works in a small region. Once you find a recipe that works for you, you stick with it. Changing that recipe *might* work... or it could destroy it. Trial and error is really the only way to go about finding out (at this time), and you rarely hit it exactly right on the first try. Food manufactures spend billions doing T&amp;E research to create perfect recipes. Individual bakers learn the ins and outs of a precious few recipes over the course of a lifetime, and are never more than mediocre at recipes that they haven&#039;t trial and errored to death. I don&#039;t have that kind of time or money;).  Fortunately &quot;mediocre&quot; from a practised baker still tastes pretty darned good.

Note that none of this applies to cooking. Cooking and baking are two entirely different disciplines,. Cooking is all about experimentation, and making it up as you go along. Not so with baking.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>@ #24 Aerimus:</b></p>
<p>I don&#8217;t expect that you&#8217;re still reading this post, but that isn&#8217;t the way baking works. You can&#8217;t simply double or halve batch recipes and expect it work exactly the same way. There are an *enormous* number of variables involved in baking that can change the outcome (air pressure, humidity, bacterial concentrations in the food (and types), type of oven (thermal, convection, induction, microwave, infrared &#8211; the size and power output change things drastically as well, as does the exact design used), and even the types of fungus that are common in your area&#8230; California sourdough rye bread tastes different than everywhere else because of a type of spore that is common in the air there but isn&#8217;t common elsewhere. The fungus changes the taste enough to be noticeable).</p>
<p>Suffice to say that any given recipe only works in a small region. Once you find a recipe that works for you, you stick with it. Changing that recipe *might* work&#8230; or it could destroy it. Trial and error is really the only way to go about finding out (at this time), and you rarely hit it exactly right on the first try. Food manufactures spend billions doing T&#038;E research to create perfect recipes. Individual bakers learn the ins and outs of a precious few recipes over the course of a lifetime, and are never more than mediocre at recipes that they haven&#8217;t trial and errored to death. I don&#8217;t have that kind of time or money;).  Fortunately &#8220;mediocre&#8221; from a practised baker still tastes pretty darned good.</p>
<p>Note that none of this applies to cooking. Cooking and baking are two entirely different disciplines,. Cooking is all about experimentation, and making it up as you go along. Not so with baking.</p>
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		<title>By: On The Limit of Poe&#8217;s Law (of which there isn&#8217;t any) &#171; IBY&#8217;s Island Universe</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/10/20/lcross-didnt-destroy-the-moon-whaddya-know/comment-page-2/#comment-221506</link>
		<dc:creator>On The Limit of Poe&#8217;s Law (of which there isn&#8217;t any) &#171; IBY&#8217;s Island Universe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 04:39:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=6265#comment-221506</guid>
		<description>[...] public, but people at the position of authority. Plus, when you find that there are people who think that a measly 2 ton spacecraft can alter the orbit of a giant ball of rock, I can&#8217;t help it, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] public, but people at the position of authority. Plus, when you find that there are people who think that a measly 2 ton spacecraft can alter the orbit of a giant ball of rock, I can&#8217;t help it, [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Licht</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/10/20/lcross-didnt-destroy-the-moon-whaddya-know/comment-page-2/#comment-221487</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Licht</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 02:27:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=6265#comment-221487</guid>
		<description>Why is NASA really seeking water on the Moon?

see:

http://notionscapital.wordpress.com/2009/10/21/water-on-the-moon/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is NASA really seeking water on the Moon?</p>
<p>see:</p>
<p><a href="http://notionscapital.wordpress.com/2009/10/21/water-on-the-moon/" rel="nofollow">http://notionscapital.wordpress.com/2009/10/21/water-on-the-moon/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Jadehawk</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/10/20/lcross-didnt-destroy-the-moon-whaddya-know/comment-page-2/#comment-221429</link>
		<dc:creator>Jadehawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 19:55:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=6265#comment-221429</guid>
		<description>also, some of the best crazy came from RR. on their thread discussing this, they were alternately wondering whether this would turn the moon red and thus usher in the End of The World, or whether the moon would break apart like in the movies. one of them actually did say something along the lines of &quot;we&#039;ve had so many movies about this, you&#039;d think the scientists would know better&quot;.

because scientists should take science advice from Hollywood, of course *facepalm*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>also, some of the best crazy came from RR. on their thread discussing this, they were alternately wondering whether this would turn the moon red and thus usher in the End of The World, or whether the moon would break apart like in the movies. one of them actually did say something along the lines of &#8220;we&#8217;ve had so many movies about this, you&#8217;d think the scientists would know better&#8221;.</p>
<p>because scientists should take science advice from Hollywood, of course *facepalm*</p>
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