Yes, the darkness of the clouds can be used to estimate their temperature and altitude. It also signifies that the IR from the surface is blocked, because if it were not blocked, then we would be able to see it through the clouds. As a result, the clouds would appear at least as bright as the surface, even if they were themselves cooler than the surface.

That is all this image is meant to illustrate.

How could clouds over 40,000 feet in altitude, with a temperature around -40 C, have the same IR signature as the ground.

The blackbody radiation from the clouds is not important here, except in the fact that there is less of it than there is from the surface. The radiation from the surface is what is important. Where the clouds are, the IR from the surface is reduced. Why? Because the clouds are blocking the IR from the surface and preventing it from being radiated out into space. In other words, they’re trapping heat.

Look at it another way. Imagine for a moment that the entire planet were covered in these high, dark clouds. This would reduce the brightness of the planet as a whole, and therefore also the capacity for radiative cooling, would it not?

Please review the topic about “black body radiation” and how Astronomers can measure the temperature of remote objects (like Stars) by studying their IR temperature signatures.

You first. You’re the one neglecting absorption.

I find it rather curious that nobody else realized that something was different with this image and had not commented about it.

That’s right, we’re all in on the conspiracy. Can’t wait for my check to arrive.

Now why had NASA shown a standard GOES image with an invented grey scale?

That’s explained in the link Phil gave:

This image, acquired by the GOES satellite on May 30, 2010, shows thermal energy in the Western Hemisphere. The areas that are warmest and therefore emitting the most thermal energy are white and pale gray. The desert lining the Pacific coast of South America is a bright white strip in the lower center of the globe. The coldest regions emitting the least amount of thermal energy are dark gray and black. These dark spots on the globe are high clouds.

Clouds emit energy in proportion to their temperature. Low, warm clouds emit more thermal energy than high, cold clouds. This image illustrates that low clouds emit about the same amount of thermal energy as Earth’s surface does. This is most clearly seen over the Pacific Ocean. The water is nearly white, while the low marine clouds are pale gray, only slightly cooler. This means that a world without low clouds loses about the same amount of energy to space as a world with low clouds.

In other words, the color coding was chosen to inform.

If go here you’ll see NASA color-coding the same data (IR channel 4) 7 different ways. Are they trying to deceive and manipulate you 7 different ways, one for each of the deadly sins? No. Each color coding has a specific meteorlogical use, highlighting the features important to that use.

I’m confused. IR is IR. The cloud tops would appear to be the same temperature as the ground if the clouds didn’t act on them…right?

Higher altitude clouds are cooler (up to the tropopause) because there is less heat trapping atmosphere above them. Water vapor which rises to a given altitude rapidly cools to match the ambient temperature at that altitude. Thus, cloud top temperatures are a good proxy for cloud top altitudes.

“I’m confused. IR is IR. The cloud tops would appear to be the same temperature as the ground if the clouds didn’t act on them…right?”

Think about this for a moment…

How could clouds over 40,000 feet in altitude, with a temperature around -40 C, have the same IR signature as the ground.

No wonder I get so darn frustrated. Astronomers should know better.

Please review the topic about “black body radiation” and how Astronomers can measure the temperature of remote objects (like Stars) by studying their IR temperature signatures.

I’m confused. IR is IR. The cloud tops would appear to be the same temperature as the ground if the clouds didn’t act on them…right?

That was the deception that I was warning about, and “The Other Ian Says:” fell for it.

Can anyone else explain to us why that concept was absolutly false?

“The Other Ian Says:” looked at that image and assumed that the high clouds were blocking the IR temperature being radiated from the ground. And from this NASA website, that concept was being implied with the image they used.

In reality, what the GOES IR image was measuring was the cloud surface temperate at it’s altitude. Most meteorologists us the GOES IR temperatures to identify the altitude of the cloud tops.

As “Steve in Dublin” has noted, I do and will challenge Phil when his posts are rather shaky. Honest and accurate science is the only thing that I request. The last time that I protested, was when a satellite was able to “measure” a 20 cubic mile change of mass on a contenent larger than the United States. Nobody else questioned this?

I have been working with satellite images of the Earth since 1972 and have studied millions of images since then.

What bothered me about this images was rather simple:

It was so unusual from how GOES images are normally presented, that I could not recognize the spectral band until I studied it a little longer. That is when I realized that the temperature grey scale had been inverted.

Now why had NASA shown a standard GOES image with an invented grey scale?

TITLE: “Clouds and Global Warming”

I find it rather curious that nobody else realized that something was different with this image and had not commented about it.

Despite the insults, I will continue to ask why, when something looks strange or unusual.

Why would Phil feel insulted by my efforts to keep his postings simple, so that anyone can understand?

“Satire (like medicine) should be left to the experts,,,”

Another alarmist attempt to keep satire in the ivory towered realms of those so called experts, I see!

It is quite obvious to all who aren’t fettered to their alarmist ideology that you can be qualified in the classics and yet put forward Nobel prize winning peer reviewed satire without being an expert!