Maybe because even Phil Plait says that he has mixed feelings about forcing people to get vaccinated?

This may be true, but as I understand it the pharmaceutical companies’ advertising budgets are also huge; I have read that in some cases at least the marketing department has a larger budget than R&D. The lift on the ban on direct-to-consumer marketing has been responsible for much of this, as well as for many medications being pushed on people who actually have little if anything wrong.

I mostly agree with this.

While drug manufacture and testing are subject to intense regulatory scrutiny, the advertising – especially in the USA – is subject to little more regulation that that of many other sectors. Personally, I feel that direct-to-consumer advertising of prescription drugs should be outright prohibited (after all, there’s a reason that doctors and pharmacists need several years of schooling and training to be able to dispense these substances) and that advertising to physicians should be more tightly regulated than it currently is (in the US).

A different situation pertains here in the UK. All treatments provided by the NHS must first be cleared through NICE (the national institute for clinical excellence). This means that many needless variations on the same drug are pretty much excluded (unless the Phase III trial demonstrated better performance than the existing treatment), but it does sometimes mean that a new treatment is not recommended because of its cost, and so will only be available to people with private medical insurance.

The pharmaceuticals industry is the most tightly-regulated industry in the world.
It can cost $250 million to get a product from discovery to market, and further hundreds of millions are spent on drug candidates that never reach the marketplace. Costs will only increase, since all the low-hanging fruit has gone.

This may be true, but as I understand it the pharmaceutical companies’ advertising budgets are also huge; I have read that in some cases at least the marketing department has a larger budget than R&D. The lift on the ban on direct-to-consumer marketing has been responsible for much of this, as well as for many medications being pushed on people who actually have little if anything wrong.

I may well be wrong about these data; if so, please let me know (I admit that my sources may be suspect). However, if there is any truth to these claims, the pharmaceutical industry probably could stand a bit more regulation than they already receive.

Vaccination and modern health science carry with them the symptom of overpopulation. Also, keep in mind that since we’ve only been using vaccines for the past 150 years or so, we lack true perspective on their effects in the long term evolution of the human race.

There are these buildings in many cities and towns that are full of books. They are called libraries. I suggest you find the one closest to you, get a library card and read some actual history/science/social studies books. You might also want to brush up on some basic arithmetic (2011 minus 1798 is greater than 150).

But if that is too much work for you, I suggest you find the videos of Hans Rosling who explains with dynamic graphs the relationship between public health, education and number of children.

Quack hear, quack repeat, quack gets money from big placebo, quack knows better, quack gives chelation therapy anyway, quack lies to parents, quack hurt children’s brains, quack should repent and get real job helping people instead of lying & giving dangerous drugs people don’t need, that NEVER cure, EVER, just placebo effect.

It actually fits really well. You really should do something about that projection, it isn’t healthy.

. . . monkey gets money from big pharma . . .

Whereof you know not, speak not.

The pharmaceuticals industry is the most tightly-regulated industry in the world.

It can cost $250 million to get a product from discovery to market, and further hundreds of millions are spent on drug candidates that never reach the marketplace. Costs will only increase, since all the low-hanging fruit has gone.

And, all those scientists who work for big Pharma companies? They all genuinely believe that they are helping to save lives and to improve the quality of life of people with life-threatening or life-altering conditions. They know a hell of a lot more about the stuff they sell than do their bosses, or the marketing departments. And if they thought there was anything wrong with their vaccines or drug products, they would tell someone.

Full disclosure: for about 14 months, the place I work was owned by a Big Pharma company. It has recently changed hands, now being owned by a company that is not a Big Pharma.

Please explain how it is that smallpox has been eradicated. Please don’t say “better hygiene”, as this doesn’t explain why other diseases like measles and pertussis haven’t also been eradicated.

When children stop dying of preventable diseases, parents have fewer children. Please note the strong correlation between the lack of vaccine-preventable diseases and low birth rates. The parts of the world where over-population is an issue are generally countries where lots of children die from vaccine-preventable diseases.

“Also, keep in mind that since we’ve only been using vaccines for the past 150 years or so, we lack true perspective on their effects in the long term evolution of the human race.”

In evolutionary terms, that lack of perspective applies to everything we’ve done since we invented farming. Are you suggesting we should become nomadic hunter-gatherers?

“Hasn’t anyone seen I Am Legend ? What we may think is a medical miracle today could turn out to change life as we know it.”

Antibiotics changed life as we knew it back in the mid-20th century. Metal working changed life as we knew it 6000 years ago. Farming changed life as we knew it 20,000 years ago. That’s what humans are good at doing – using our brains to change the world.

“For all you know, vaccines could cause one of the myriad syndromes that are collectively called “autism”.”

Perhaps, but extremely unlikely – plenty of medical studies so far indicate otherwise.

“Besides, we really don’t know anything about those ailments-how can you be so sure what does or doesn’t cause them?”

We know some things about autism. We know, for example, there are autistic children who have never been vaccinated.

Vaccination and modern health science carry with them the symptom of overpopulation.

No, they don’t.

Vaccination, modern health science, the Green Revolution and a lack of accurate sex education will have – in combination – the symptom of overpopulation. Perhaps.

Also, keep in mind that since we’ve only been using vaccines for the past 150 years or so, we lack true perspective on their effects in the long term evolution of the human race.

So what?

Even more than vaccines, we lack the perspective on the impact of television on the evolution of the human race. By your “logic”, we should therefore be more wary of television than of vaccines.

In what way is that an argument for or against anything?

Hasn’t anyone seen I Am Legend ?

Yes. It is what we scientists call Fiction. Go and look the word up in a dictionary.

What we may think is a medical miracle today could turn out to change life as we know it. For all you know, vaccines could cause one of the myriad syndromes that are collectively called “autism”.

No. Studies have shown that vaccines do not cause autism.

We do not know what exactly contributes to autism, but there are a great many things that have been ruled out.

Besides, we really don’t know anything about those ailments-how can you be so sure what does or doesn’t cause them?

Duh, because people have tested these ideas to see if Possible Factor X is related to incidence of autism. Where there is no correlation between Possible Factor X and autism incidence, it is quite safe to rule out Factor X as a possible cause.

Have you ever heard of the concept of using logic to reason from facts?

I just got my yearly flu shot today.

Clear skies, Alan

Monkey hear, monkey repeat, monkey gets money from big pharma, monkey knows better, monkey gives shots anyway, monkey lies to parents, monkey hurt children’s brains, monkey should repent and get real job helping people instead of lying & giving dangerous drugs people don’t need, that NEVER cure, EVER, just treat symptom bad food, water and big pharma marketed drugs cause………….

It seems curiously ironic that here in the Twin Cities, the local FOX affiliate has been running excellent, science-based coverage of the measles outbreak and of the anti-vax movement associated with it. They’ve had a strong pro-vaccination message. While KMSP’s morning show isn’t as good as it was back in their UPN days, it’s still pretty good, and despite some of the other FOX news shows being advertised on it, I keep watching it. They even interrupt programming for Shuttle launches.

Star Tribune has also had good coverage of the measles outbreak, including interviews with a local Somali lady who has become something of a crusader for MMR and vaccination. One of her childred developed autism, and then she heard about Wakefield and stopped vaccinating her other children, which lasted until her regular doctor gently pointed her to information about how Wakefield had been discredited. She was furious with Wakefield at that point. Somali women are usually educated, which contradicts certain Muslim and immigrant stereotypes. So they are following the more typical anti-vax demographics — it’s educated people getting suckered in. But those same people tend to be all the more furious when they discover they’ve been had.