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	<title>Comments on: Sunset on an alien world</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/</link>
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	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 21 Nov 2012 15:12:45 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Watching Alien Sunsets on Exoplanets &#124; Ekum News Blog</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319465</link>
		<dc:creator>Watching Alien Sunsets on Exoplanets &#124; Ekum News Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 15:40:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319465</guid>
		<description>[...] As Osiris orbits &#115;&#111; close to &#105;&#116;&#115; star, atmospheric temperatures are high (around 1,000 degrees Celsius &#111;&#114; 1,800 degrees Fahrenheit). &#116;&#104;&#105;&#115; means &#105;&#116;&#115; outer atmospheric layers become &#8220;puffed up.&#8220; [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] As Osiris orbits &#115;&#111; close to &#105;&#116;&#115; star, atmospheric temperatures are high (around 1,000 degrees Celsius &#111;&#114; 1,800 degrees Fahrenheit). &#116;&#104;&#105;&#115; means &#105;&#116;&#115; outer atmospheric layers become &#8220;puffed up.&#8220; [...] </p>
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		<title>By: andy</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319464</link>
		<dc:creator>andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jan 2012 18:06:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319464</guid>
		<description>The &quot;Exo&quot; part of the CoRoT planet designations is sooo last decade... they removed it in March 2009. It&#039;s just plain CoRoT-7b now...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &#8220;Exo&#8221; part of the CoRoT planet designations is sooo last decade&#8230; they removed it in March 2009. It&#8217;s just plain CoRoT-7b now&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: The Lovely Sunset On Exoplanet HD 209458 b &#124; TodayHeads</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319463</link>
		<dc:creator>The Lovely Sunset On Exoplanet HD 209458 b &#124; TodayHeads</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jan 2012 19:54:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319463</guid>
		<description>[...] we can’t imagine it with great accuracy. Equipped with careful observations, it’s possible to visualize the sunset as it would look from a distant exoplanet. This is what it looks [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] we can’t imagine it with great accuracy. Equipped with careful observations, it’s possible to visualize the sunset as it would look from a distant exoplanet. This is what it looks [...] </p>
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		<title>By: Joseph G</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319462</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jan 2012 09:08:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319462</guid>
		<description>The odd letters and numbers are indeed a mouthful, but we&#039;re definitely going to run out of mythological names sooner rather then later.  How about we name planets based on certain characteristics (e.g., that Tatooine planet) and then a simple number (Tatooine 1, 2, 3, etc)?  These wouldn&#039;t be the scientific designations, of course, just easier handles such as Osiris.  That way astronomers won&#039;t have to spend all their time going through old anthropology textbooks ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The odd letters and numbers are indeed a mouthful, but we&#8217;re definitely going to run out of mythological names sooner rather then later.  How about we name planets based on certain characteristics (e.g., that Tatooine planet) and then a simple number (Tatooine 1, 2, 3, etc)?  These wouldn&#8217;t be the scientific designations, of course, just easier handles such as Osiris.  That way astronomers won&#8217;t have to spend all their time going through old anthropology textbooks <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Messier Tidy Upper</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319461</link>
		<dc:creator>Messier Tidy Upper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jan 2012 08:11:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319461</guid>
		<description>@7.   andy :

&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;i&gt;Yeah “Osiris” is an easier handle than HD 209458b, but the usage of these nicknames seems to be dying out somewhat. The only other one that still seems to get occasional usage is “Bellerophon” for 51 Peg b, and the less said about the usage of “Goldilocks” for 70 Vir b the better!&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Well, the &quot;Goldilocks Planet&quot; tag as I&#039;ve heard it  applies aptly to Gliese 581 g &amp; suits that pretty well - if that one actually exists. ;-)

I much prefer names to catalogue designations as more memorable, appropriate and evocative. I know there&#039;s a lot of exoplanets but I wish at least some nicknames would be made official and used more frequently.

&lt;b&gt;Exoplanets with nicknames include : &lt;/b&gt;

1. Bellerophon for 51 Pegasi b.

2. Osiris for HD 209458 b.

3.  Polydeuces for Pollux b the planet around the brightest exoplanet-hosting star so far.

4.  The Genesis / Methuselah Planet for PSR B1620-26 b -the oldest known planet located in M4.

5. Tatooine for HD 188753 b  the planet discovered in a triple star system.

6. Hoth  or OGLE-05-390 L b the furthest exoplanet ever found - via micolensing 21,000 ly off.

7.  The Balsawood Planet or TrES-4 which has the largest diameter and least density; 70 % larger than Jupiter’s radius but a density equivalent to balsawood.

8.  The Hot Ice Planet or Gliese 436, the first of its planetary class to be discovered. Too small to be a gas giant, it is almost certainly made from high pressure and temperature exotic ices.

9. The &lt;i&gt;(ex?-)&lt;/i&gt;Goldilocks Planet or 70 Virginis b which could also be a brown dwarf companion and is in an elliptical orbit coming as near its star as Mercury gets to our star.

&amp;

10. The &lt;i&gt;(maybe?)&lt;/i&gt; Goldilocks Planet or Gliese 581 g which is a &quot;SuperEarth&quot; in the Habitable Zone of its star. If it exists at all which unfortunately may well &lt;b&gt;not&lt;/b&gt; be the case.

Plus recently Kepler 22b has been variously dubbed &quot;Earth 2.0 &quot; and &quot;SuperEarth&quot; by some of the media which are probably once again being a little inaccurate and premature in their judgement. Sadly, the hype over this world &lt;i&gt;(like that over Gliese 581 c before it)&lt;/i&gt; probably isn&#039;t justified and it is most likely another gas dwarf / Hot Neptune type world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@7.   andy :</p>
<blockquote><p><i>Yeah “Osiris” is an easier handle than HD 209458b, but the usage of these nicknames seems to be dying out somewhat. The only other one that still seems to get occasional usage is “Bellerophon” for 51 Peg b, and the less said about the usage of “Goldilocks” for 70 Vir b the better!</i></p></blockquote>
<p>Well, the &#8220;Goldilocks Planet&#8221; tag as I&#8217;ve heard it  applies aptly to Gliese 581 g &amp; suits that pretty well &#8211; if that one actually exists. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>I much prefer names to catalogue designations as more memorable, appropriate and evocative. I know there&#8217;s a lot of exoplanets but I wish at least some nicknames would be made official and used more frequently.</p>
<p><b>Exoplanets with nicknames include : </b></p>
<p>1. Bellerophon for 51 Pegasi b.</p>
<p>2. Osiris for HD 209458 b.</p>
<p>3.  Polydeuces for Pollux b the planet around the brightest exoplanet-hosting star so far.</p>
<p>4.  The Genesis / Methuselah Planet for PSR B1620-26 b -the oldest known planet located in M4.</p>
<p>5. Tatooine for HD 188753 b  the planet discovered in a triple star system.</p>
<p>6. Hoth  or OGLE-05-390 L b the furthest exoplanet ever found &#8211; via micolensing 21,000 ly off.</p>
<p>7.  The Balsawood Planet or TrES-4 which has the largest diameter and least density; 70 % larger than Jupiter’s radius but a density equivalent to balsawood.</p>
<p>8.  The Hot Ice Planet or Gliese 436, the first of its planetary class to be discovered. Too small to be a gas giant, it is almost certainly made from high pressure and temperature exotic ices.</p>
<p>9. The <i>(ex?-)</i>Goldilocks Planet or 70 Virginis b which could also be a brown dwarf companion and is in an elliptical orbit coming as near its star as Mercury gets to our star.</p>
<p>&amp;</p>
<p>10. The <i>(maybe?)</i> Goldilocks Planet or Gliese 581 g which is a &#8220;SuperEarth&#8221; in the Habitable Zone of its star. If it exists at all which unfortunately may well <b>not</b> be the case.</p>
<p>Plus recently Kepler 22b has been variously dubbed &#8220;Earth 2.0 &#8221; and &#8220;SuperEarth&#8221; by some of the media which are probably once again being a little inaccurate and premature in their judgement. Sadly, the hype over this world <i>(like that over Gliese 581 c before it)</i> probably isn&#8217;t justified and it is most likely another gas dwarf / Hot Neptune type world.</p>
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		<title>By: Messier Tidy Upper</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319460</link>
		<dc:creator>Messier Tidy Upper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jan 2012 06:58:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319460</guid>
		<description>@11.   James Pailly : &lt;i&gt;&quot;Sometimes I think science should be considered an art form, especially when scientists can produce such beautiful images.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

Seconded by me. There&#039;s a science to art and an art to science I think! Combining them like this is a wonderful thing and wish there was more of it. :-)

12.   Tara Li  :  &lt;i&gt;&quot;What would a similar image from a similar location in the atmosphere of Jupiter, or Saturn, look at?&quot;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

A much smaller sun! From Jupiter or Saturn the Sun would be close to star-like I think witha very small diameter and, I presume perhaps incorrectly that it would white or yellow in colour in colour until it quickly blinked out. Some of our spaceprobes have almost been close enough to witness a Jovian / Saturnean sunset firsthand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@11.   James Pailly : <i>&#8220;Sometimes I think science should be considered an art form, especially when scientists can produce such beautiful images.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>Seconded by me. There&#8217;s a science to art and an art to science I think! Combining them like this is a wonderful thing and wish there was more of it. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>12.   Tara Li  :  <i>&#8220;What would a similar image from a similar location in the atmosphere of Jupiter, or Saturn, look at?&#8221;</p>
<p>A much smaller sun! From Jupiter or Saturn the Sun would be close to star-like I think witha very small diameter and, I presume perhaps incorrectly that it would white or yellow in colour in colour until it quickly blinked out. Some of our spaceprobes have almost been close enough to witness a Jovian / Saturnean sunset firsthand.</i></p>
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		<title>By: Messier Tidy Upper</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319459</link>
		<dc:creator>Messier Tidy Upper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jan 2012 06:55:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319459</guid>
		<description>See :

http://www.space.com/4705-destroy-giant-planet.html

for an article on that study by  by Aylward, Koskinen &amp; Miller on how close a roaster Hot Jove can get.

See :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COROT-Exo-7b

for  the planetary facts sheet on Corot-exo-7b.

Plus see :

http://www.csmonitor.com/Science/2010/1013/Gliese-581g-Goldilocks-planet-might-not-exist-after-all

For the person here who mentioned the Goldilocks planet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>See :</p>
<p><a href="http://www.space.com/4705-destroy-giant-planet.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.space.com/4705-destroy-giant-planet.html</a></p>
<p>for an article on that study by  by Aylward, Koskinen &amp; Miller on how close a roaster Hot Jove can get.</p>
<p>See :</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COROT-Exo-7b" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COROT-Exo-7b</a></p>
<p>for  the planetary facts sheet on Corot-exo-7b.</p>
<p>Plus see :</p>
<p><a href="http://www.csmonitor.com/Science/2010/1013/Gliese-581g-Goldilocks-planet-might-not-exist-after-all" rel="nofollow">http://www.csmonitor.com/Science/2010/1013/Gliese-581g-Goldilocks-planet-might-not-exist-after-all</a></p>
<p>For the person here who mentioned the Goldilocks planet.</p>
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		<title>By: Messier Tidy Upper</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319458</link>
		<dc:creator>Messier Tidy Upper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jan 2012 06:35:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319458</guid>
		<description>@ ^ Wzrd1 :  January 9th, 2012 at 10:43 pm : Yep. We still know so little really about what
the cores of our own systems gas giants are like let alone other alien planets. What lies at the centre of Jupiter remains largely a mystery as I understand it.

@13.   Dragonchild :

&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;i&gt;@9. Robin Byron : Not a kick to the noggin, really. Osiris is probably losing mass at a very high rate (and may eventually become a scorched naked ball like Mercury) for precisely the reason you’re envisioning. However, its mass is comparable to Jupiter, so what you’re really doing is drastically underestimating Jupiter’s mass. Here’s some perspective: Unlike other planets, the center of mass between the Sun and Jupiter lies outside the Sun’s surface. Jupiter doesn’t orbit the Sun so much as the two orbit a common point in space. The Sun is much more massive, no doubt, but Jupiter is MASSIVE. It’s so big its gravity tortures its inner moons and has moons orbiting as far as 30 million km from it.
So, the biggest problem in your basic analogy is the puffball. This is more like a 40-foot-high mountain of snow thawing in sunlight; the last one I saw like that took until summer. The star can’t lose, but there’s just too much stuff to get rid of all at once. More stuff also means a slower start. Like how the outer layers of the snow pile insulate the inside until it’s dissolved away, a higher starting mass means a bigger gravity well for the star to blast material out of. It’ll happen, but it’s gonna take a while.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Nice analogy and explanation there.  :-)

From my understanding - possibly mistaken - some very near-to-their-suns  &quot;superEarths&quot; &lt;i&gt;(Misleading term if ever there wa sone given how &lt;b&gt;un&lt;/b&gt;earthly such worlds would be!)&lt;/i&gt; &lt;/i&gt;such as Corot Exo-7b may just be the remnants of former Hot Jove Pegasids or &quot;Roasters&quot; as they&#039;ve also been termed.

One study &lt;i&gt;&quot;How to Destroy a Giant Planet&quot;&lt;/i&gt; on space-dot-com by Aylward, Koskinen &amp; Miller back in Dec. 2007  suggests that all HotJoves closer than 0.15 AU (24 million km) will eventually be destroyed by this catastrophic evaporation.    (Including  51 Pegasi b, Tau Bootis b, HD 209458 b &amp; more.)

&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;i&gt;@3. Messier Tidy Upper : “If you could make out some pretty clear prominces, flares and spots from this hypothetical space station or high altitude very hot air balloon / zeppelin vantage point?”
AFAIK we could probably see prominences from Earth quite easily, without telescopes even, if not for the Sun itself. This isn’t a function of distance so much as relative brightness, like a candle lit by a forest fire behind it. Don’t we have to look at the Sun in wavelengths it’s relatively weak in, like UV, to see these features?&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Good point. I guess that would be right. Our Sun is magnitude - 27 or so from Earth. From a Hot Jupiter it&#039;s apparent magnitude would be, well astronomical I imagine! ;-)

@19.   Steve :  January 9th, 2012 at 2:59 pm

&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;i&gt;I’d be interested to see what the computer model would render using similar data from our own planet!&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I can&#039;t say for sure - only the author here could - but I would expect they tried exactly that as a control test to make sure the program / simulation systenm as working properly.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ ^ Wzrd1 :  January 9th, 2012 at 10:43 pm : Yep. We still know so little really about what<br />
the cores of our own systems gas giants are like let alone other alien planets. What lies at the centre of Jupiter remains largely a mystery as I understand it.</p>
<p>@13.   Dragonchild :</p>
<blockquote><p><i>@9. Robin Byron : Not a kick to the noggin, really. Osiris is probably losing mass at a very high rate (and may eventually become a scorched naked ball like Mercury) for precisely the reason you’re envisioning. However, its mass is comparable to Jupiter, so what you’re really doing is drastically underestimating Jupiter’s mass. Here’s some perspective: Unlike other planets, the center of mass between the Sun and Jupiter lies outside the Sun’s surface. Jupiter doesn’t orbit the Sun so much as the two orbit a common point in space. The Sun is much more massive, no doubt, but Jupiter is MASSIVE. It’s so big its gravity tortures its inner moons and has moons orbiting as far as 30 million km from it.<br />
So, the biggest problem in your basic analogy is the puffball. This is more like a 40-foot-high mountain of snow thawing in sunlight; the last one I saw like that took until summer. The star can’t lose, but there’s just too much stuff to get rid of all at once. More stuff also means a slower start. Like how the outer layers of the snow pile insulate the inside until it’s dissolved away, a higher starting mass means a bigger gravity well for the star to blast material out of. It’ll happen, but it’s gonna take a while.</i></p></blockquote>
<p>Nice analogy and explanation there.  <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>From my understanding &#8211; possibly mistaken &#8211; some very near-to-their-suns  &#8220;superEarths&#8221; <i>(Misleading term if ever there wa sone given how <b>un</b>earthly such worlds would be!)</i> such as Corot Exo-7b may just be the remnants of former Hot Jove Pegasids or &#8220;Roasters&#8221; as they&#8217;ve also been termed.</p>
<p>One study <i>&#8220;How to Destroy a Giant Planet&#8221;</i> on space-dot-com by Aylward, Koskinen &amp; Miller back in Dec. 2007  suggests that all HotJoves closer than 0.15 AU (24 million km) will eventually be destroyed by this catastrophic evaporation.    (Including  51 Pegasi b, Tau Bootis b, HD 209458 b &amp; more.)</p>
<blockquote><p><i>@3. Messier Tidy Upper : “If you could make out some pretty clear prominces, flares and spots from this hypothetical space station or high altitude very hot air balloon / zeppelin vantage point?”<br />
AFAIK we could probably see prominences from Earth quite easily, without telescopes even, if not for the Sun itself. This isn’t a function of distance so much as relative brightness, like a candle lit by a forest fire behind it. Don’t we have to look at the Sun in wavelengths it’s relatively weak in, like UV, to see these features?</i></p></blockquote>
<p>Good point. I guess that would be right. Our Sun is magnitude &#8211; 27 or so from Earth. From a Hot Jupiter it&#8217;s apparent magnitude would be, well astronomical I imagine! <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>@19.   Steve :  January 9th, 2012 at 2:59 pm</p>
<blockquote><p><i>I’d be interested to see what the computer model would render using similar data from our own planet!</i></p></blockquote>
<p>I can&#8217;t say for sure &#8211; only the author here could &#8211; but I would expect they tried exactly that as a control test to make sure the program / simulation systenm as working properly.</p>
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		<title>By: Wzrd1</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319457</link>
		<dc:creator>Wzrd1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jan 2012 05:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319457</guid>
		<description>Doctor, SOME modes call for a metal core, some not. THEN, *SOME* call for a hydrogen metal core, others carbon. Lacking further information, one cannot decide upon ANY, as you have chosen.
Unless YOU have facts otherwise not in evidence here or the originating article.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doctor, SOME modes call for a metal core, some not. THEN, *SOME* call for a hydrogen metal core, others carbon. Lacking further information, one cannot decide upon ANY, as you have chosen.<br />
Unless YOU have facts otherwise not in evidence here or the originating article.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph G</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/01/09/sunset-on-an-alien-world/#comment-319456</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jan 2012 02:09:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=42906#comment-319456</guid>
		<description>@25 drx1:  IIRC, a coronal mass ejection is almost all hydrogen, which also tends to be the easiest gas for solar wind to strip away, so I can&#039;t really imagine the planet gaining mass from the star faster than it loses it.
That would be very cool if our timing was sensitive enough to register a mass gain or loss.  I&#039;m not sure what kind of numbers we&#039;d be talking about one way or the other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@25 drx1:  IIRC, a coronal mass ejection is almost all hydrogen, which also tends to be the easiest gas for solar wind to strip away, so I can&#8217;t really imagine the planet gaining mass from the star faster than it loses it.<br />
That would be very cool if our timing was sensitive enough to register a mass gain or loss.  I&#8217;m not sure what kind of numbers we&#8217;d be talking about one way or the other.</p>
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