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	<title>Comments on: A spiral that can beat you with two arms tied behind its back</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/</link>
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		<title>By: Matt B.</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330227</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt B.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 May 2012 22:45:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330227</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ll try to cover the basics, Charles, using the IPA in the pronunciations.

1) Vowels are pronounced as in English for the most part (hard to tell whether they will be long, though; compare &quot;dāta&quot; and &quot;dăta&quot;), but since &quot;-es&quot; involves a silent &lt;i&gt;e&lt;/i&gt; in English, the pronunciation in anglicized Latin is /iz/.

2) Consonant sounds are &quot;modernized&quot; to match Modern English, meaning &lt;i&gt;c&lt;/i&gt; sounds like /s/ before an &lt;i&gt;e&lt;/i&gt;, &lt;i&gt;i&lt;/i&gt; or &lt;i&gt;y&lt;/i&gt;, &lt;i&gt;g&lt;/i&gt; sounds like /dʒ/ before the same vowels, &lt;i&gt;j&lt;/i&gt; and &lt;i&gt;v&lt;/i&gt; are consonants, instead of semivowels. Some palatization occurs, such as in &quot;ratio&quot;, and &quot;fasces&quot;.

3) Vowel length is ignored, but the placement of stress is retained from Latin, so for instance, &quot;Eridanus&quot; is e-RI-da-nus, not e-ri-DA-nus.

4) The diphthongs &lt;i&gt;ae&lt;/i&gt; and &lt;i&gt;oe&lt;/i&gt; are pronounced the same as an &lt;i&gt;e&lt;/i&gt; in the same place would be, and even affect &lt;i&gt;c&lt;/i&gt; and &lt;i&gt;g&lt;/i&gt; in the same way (e.g. &quot;Caesar&quot; and &quot;algae&quot;).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll try to cover the basics, Charles, using the IPA in the pronunciations.</p>
<p>1) Vowels are pronounced as in English for the most part (hard to tell whether they will be long, though; compare &#8220;dāta&#8221; and &#8220;dăta&#8221;), but since &#8220;-es&#8221; involves a silent <i>e</i> in English, the pronunciation in anglicized Latin is /iz/.</p>
<p>2) Consonant sounds are &#8220;modernized&#8221; to match Modern English, meaning <i>c</i> sounds like /s/ before an <i>e</i>, <i>i</i> or <i>y</i>, <i>g</i> sounds like /dʒ/ before the same vowels, <i>j</i> and <i>v</i> are consonants, instead of semivowels. Some palatization occurs, such as in &#8220;ratio&#8221;, and &#8220;fasces&#8221;.</p>
<p>3) Vowel length is ignored, but the placement of stress is retained from Latin, so for instance, &#8220;Eridanus&#8221; is e-RI-da-nus, not e-ri-DA-nus.</p>
<p>4) The diphthongs <i>ae</i> and <i>oe</i> are pronounced the same as an <i>e</i> in the same place would be, and even affect <i>c</i> and <i>g</i> in the same way (e.g. &#8220;Caesar&#8221; and &#8220;algae&#8221;).</p>
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		<title>By: Messier Tidy Upper</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330226</link>
		<dc:creator>Messier Tidy Upper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 May 2012 17:35:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330226</guid>
		<description>@ ^  Jon Hanford  : Cheers for that - much appreciated.  :-)

@13.   eric : Yep. I think I&#039;ve heard /read that GHZ idea mentioned a few times. Ideally a star isn&#039;t in the dangerous galactic bulge region  too close to an occssionally active and crowded nucleus and not too far away and hence likely to be too &quot;metal&quot; poor to enable life and technology to develop. Mind you its just an educated extrapolation and we&#039;ve gathered far too little data at this stage to tell whether it has much validity or not. :-)

@12.   Jess Tauber : &lt;i&gt;&quot;Charles- try saying it in Old Entish, but, as per usual, take your time…&quot; &lt;/i&gt;

LOL. Have you finished saying it yet then? &lt;i&gt;(I won&#039;t ask you to repeat it! Come to think of it, I shouldn&#039;t interupt you should I?)&lt;/i&gt;  ;-)




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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ ^  Jon Hanford  : Cheers for that &#8211; much appreciated.  <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>@13.   eric : Yep. I think I&#8217;ve heard /read that GHZ idea mentioned a few times. Ideally a star isn&#8217;t in the dangerous galactic bulge region  too close to an occssionally active and crowded nucleus and not too far away and hence likely to be too &#8220;metal&#8221; poor to enable life and technology to develop. Mind you its just an educated extrapolation and we&#8217;ve gathered far too little data at this stage to tell whether it has much validity or not. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>@12.   Jess Tauber : <i>&#8220;Charles- try saying it in Old Entish, but, as per usual, take your time…&#8221; </i></p>
<p>LOL. Have you finished saying it yet then? <i>(I won&#8217;t ask you to repeat it! Come to think of it, I shouldn&#8217;t interupt you should I?)</i>  <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Jon Hanford</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330225</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Hanford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 May 2012 15:52:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330225</guid>
		<description>@MTU,

That system you&#039;re looking at near M106 is the small companion galaxy NGC 4248. NED(NASA/IPAC Extragalactic Database) pegs its&#039; distance at 7.3 Mpc (the distance to M 106 is given as 7.4 Mpc).

Intriguingly, despite the info noted in the wiki entry(and SIMBAD), NGC 4217 appears NOT to be a companion to M 106. NED gives its&#039; distance as 19.6 Mpc, over 10 Mpc more distant than M 106. Also, a 2010 study of the satellite galaxies of M 106 found over a dozen companions, including NGC 4248 but, alas, not NGC 4217(an interesting read, btw): http://arxiv.org/pdf/1011.2830v1.pdf</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@MTU,</p>
<p>That system you&#8217;re looking at near M106 is the small companion galaxy NGC 4248. NED(NASA/IPAC Extragalactic Database) pegs its&#8217; distance at 7.3 Mpc (the distance to M 106 is given as 7.4 Mpc).</p>
<p>Intriguingly, despite the info noted in the wiki entry(and SIMBAD), NGC 4217 appears NOT to be a companion to M 106. NED gives its&#8217; distance as 19.6 Mpc, over 10 Mpc more distant than M 106. Also, a 2010 study of the satellite galaxies of M 106 found over a dozen companions, including NGC 4248 but, alas, not NGC 4217(an interesting read, btw): <a href="http://arxiv.org/pdf/1011.2830v1.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://arxiv.org/pdf/1011.2830v1.pdf</a></p>
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		<title>By: eric</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330224</link>
		<dc:creator>eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 May 2012 04:02:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330224</guid>
		<description>So if solar systems have a goldilocks zone, is there a similar &quot;galactic goldilock zone&quot; where stars a certain distance from the center of a galaxy are more likely to be favorable for solar systems such as our own?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So if solar systems have a goldilocks zone, is there a similar &#8220;galactic goldilock zone&#8221; where stars a certain distance from the center of a galaxy are more likely to be favorable for solar systems such as our own?</p>
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		<title>By: Jess Tauber</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330223</link>
		<dc:creator>Jess Tauber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 May 2012 20:07:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330223</guid>
		<description>Charles- try saying it in Old Entish, but, as per usual, take your time...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Charles- try saying it in Old Entish, but, as per usual, take your time&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Messier Tidy Upper</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330222</link>
		<dc:creator>Messier Tidy Upper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 May 2012 09:15:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330222</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;i&gt;(Also directly linked to my name here – taken by Wilson – can’t find first /last name there.)&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

D&#039;oh! Sometimes the things right in front of your eyes that you miss. Aaaaarrrgh! :-(

Make that HunterWilson who took the photo. Not sure if that&#039;s one hyphenated surname or a first and last name combo.  My apologies to the individual in question and thanks for posting that astrophotograph on wiki for us all. :-)

Apologies too for the typographical errors that I could  swear my computer adds in after I&#039;ve clicked the submit button. Honestly! ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p><i>(Also directly linked to my name here – taken by Wilson – can’t find first /last name there.)</i></p></blockquote>
<p>D&#8217;oh! Sometimes the things right in front of your eyes that you miss. Aaaaarrrgh! <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':-(' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Make that HunterWilson who took the photo. Not sure if that&#8217;s one hyphenated surname or a first and last name combo.  My apologies to the individual in question and thanks for posting that astrophotograph on wiki for us all. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Apologies too for the typographical errors that I could  swear my computer adds in after I&#8217;ve clicked the submit button. Honestly! <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Messier Tidy Upper</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330221</link>
		<dc:creator>Messier Tidy Upper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 May 2012 07:01:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330221</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s wikipedia page &lt;i&gt;(linked to my above comment )&lt;/i&gt; notes that Messier 106 is a Seyfert galaxy and has a water vapour maser as well as  a possible companion galaxy NGC 4217  an edge on spiral with another fainter one visible in the amateur astronomer&#039;s image there. &lt;i&gt;(Also directly linked to my name here - taken by Wilson - can&#039;t find first /last name there.)&lt;/i&gt;

That second smaller and fainter one almost reminds me of the Large Magellanic Cloud in relation to our Galaxy - wonder if there&#039;s any connection with M106&#039;s shape and AGN dynamism? No idea though whether that second smaller companion - NOT NGC 4217 - is physically associated  with M106 or just a backdrop line-of-sight galaxy. Anyone here able and willing to shed any light on that or know what that apparent companion&#039;s designation is by any chance, please?

There are a number of other faint background galaxies in that Wilson picture too - a pair that the smaller galaxy there that the smaller LMC look-alike points too in the top centre of the astrophoto and a small spiral below diagonally left of NGC 4217 and a faint elleptical witha starlike core and faint milky halo below M106 and in line with NGC 4217 plus several others.

&lt;Blockquote&gt;&lt;i&gt;Also, judging from the power in those beams, if they were aimed at us the core of that galaxy would be really bright, and M106 would be a heckuva lot more famous than it already is. I wonder if it would be naked eye visible? It’s possible.&lt;/i&gt; &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Messier 106 - seen from 25 million light years distance -  currently has an apparent magnitude of 9.1 -- so it&#039;d certainly need to increase its apparentluminosity multifold times to reach sixth magnitude. Still I&#039;ve read in one of Tim Ferrises excellent works that a ceryain type of AGN would shine as brightly as our Sun if were located in our Local Group of galaxies so, yeah, maybe -even if it isn&#039;t exactly that sortof AGN! ;-)

-----------------------------

“Quasars are so luminous that if one was in action in a local group galaxy its brilliance would rival that of the Sun.”
- P.284, Ferris, &lt;i&gt;‘Seeing in the Dark’&lt;/i&gt;, Simon &amp; Schuster, 2002.


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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s wikipedia page <i>(linked to my above comment )</i> notes that Messier 106 is a Seyfert galaxy and has a water vapour maser as well as  a possible companion galaxy NGC 4217  an edge on spiral with another fainter one visible in the amateur astronomer&#8217;s image there. <i>(Also directly linked to my name here &#8211; taken by Wilson &#8211; can&#8217;t find first /last name there.)</i></p>
<p>That second smaller and fainter one almost reminds me of the Large Magellanic Cloud in relation to our Galaxy &#8211; wonder if there&#8217;s any connection with M106&#8242;s shape and AGN dynamism? No idea though whether that second smaller companion &#8211; NOT NGC 4217 &#8211; is physically associated  with M106 or just a backdrop line-of-sight galaxy. Anyone here able and willing to shed any light on that or know what that apparent companion&#8217;s designation is by any chance, please?</p>
<p>There are a number of other faint background galaxies in that Wilson picture too &#8211; a pair that the smaller galaxy there that the smaller LMC look-alike points too in the top centre of the astrophoto and a small spiral below diagonally left of NGC 4217 and a faint elleptical witha starlike core and faint milky halo below M106 and in line with NGC 4217 plus several others.</p>
<blockquote><p><i>Also, judging from the power in those beams, if they were aimed at us the core of that galaxy would be really bright, and M106 would be a heckuva lot more famous than it already is. I wonder if it would be naked eye visible? It’s possible.</i> </p></blockquote>
<p>Messier 106 &#8211; seen from 25 million light years distance &#8211;  currently has an apparent magnitude of 9.1 &#8212; so it&#8217;d certainly need to increase its apparentluminosity multifold times to reach sixth magnitude. Still I&#8217;ve read in one of Tim Ferrises excellent works that a ceryain type of AGN would shine as brightly as our Sun if were located in our Local Group of galaxies so, yeah, maybe -even if it isn&#8217;t exactly that sortof AGN! <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;</p>
<p>“Quasars are so luminous that if one was in action in a local group galaxy its brilliance would rival that of the Sun.”<br />
- P.284, Ferris, <i>‘Seeing in the Dark’</i>, Simon &amp; Schuster, 2002.</p>
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		<title>By: Messier Tidy Upper</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330220</link>
		<dc:creator>Messier Tidy Upper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 May 2012 06:34:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330220</guid>
		<description>Whoah! That is one stunning galaxy image - love the aerial perspective there - and then the second extra arms surprise shot - wow! :-D

Marvellous, thankyou BA &amp; Andre vd Hoeven - &amp; Hubble and the others too. :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whoah! That is one stunning galaxy image &#8211; love the aerial perspective there &#8211; and then the second extra arms surprise shot &#8211; wow! <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':-D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Marvellous, thankyou BA &amp; Andre vd Hoeven &#8211; &amp; Hubble and the others too. <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Bob F.</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330219</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob F.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 May 2012 02:05:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330219</guid>
		<description>The large version on Flickr looks amazing on the new iPad, with its high resolution. I can zoom in almost far enough to see some alien ships.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The large version on Flickr looks amazing on the new iPad, with its high resolution. I can zoom in almost far enough to see some alien ships.</p>
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		<title>By: Charles</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/05/04/a-spiral-that-can-beat-you-with-two-arms-tied-behind-its-back/#comment-330218</link>
		<dc:creator>Charles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 May 2012 19:13:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/?p=48088#comment-330218</guid>
		<description>(I wonder the same thing about all the anglicized Spanish place names in California.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(I wonder the same thing about all the anglicized Spanish place names in California.)</p>
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