<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: The Sound and the Fury</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/</link>
	<description>Random samplings from a universe of ideas.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 14 Feb 2012 13:27:37 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Lab Lemming</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25002</link>
		<dc:creator>Lab Lemming</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 10:09:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25002</guid>
		<description>Julianne says:
&quot;Dulcanton.&quot;

No offense, but it might clear things up a bit if you fixed the sidebar on this website.  Under the &quot;Contributors&quot; heading.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Julianne says:<br />
&#8220;Dulcanton.&#8221;</p>
<p>No offense, but it might clear things up a bit if you fixed the sidebar on this website.  Under the &#8220;Contributors&#8221; heading.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: adam</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25000</link>
		<dc:creator>adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:32:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25000</guid>
		<description>Kevin #31, when Julianne Dilcantrone starts spouting racist filth, how can you expect it to be ignored?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kevin #31, when Julianne Dilcantrone starts spouting racist filth, how can you expect it to be ignored?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Kevin Runnels</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-24999</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Runnels</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:27:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-24999</guid>
		<description>I feel bad that only one picture from Julianne&#039;s post got all of the comment action and there were no comments about Michael Muno&#039;s picture.  Maybe it&#039;s because the picture isn&#039;t very clear.  He actually looks kind of like Morrissey of the now defunct 80&#039;s band &quot;The Smiths&quot;.  Muno is &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~mmuno/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; while Morrissey is &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.morrissey-solo.com/news/2004/images/delilahs20040924.jpg&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt; here.&lt;/a&gt; Spooky.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel bad that only one picture from Julianne&#8217;s post got all of the comment action and there were no comments about Michael Muno&#8217;s picture.  Maybe it&#8217;s because the picture isn&#8217;t very clear.  He actually looks kind of like Morrissey of the now defunct 80&#8242;s band &#8220;The Smiths&#8221;.  Muno is <a href="http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~mmuno/" rel="nofollow">here</a> while Morrissey is <a href="http://www.morrissey-solo.com/news/2004/images/delilahs20040924.jpg" rel="nofollow"> here.</a> Spooky.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Julianne</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25001</link>
		<dc:creator>Julianne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:47:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25001</guid>
		<description>Dulcanton.

My name was mispelled a different way in every single occurance in my high school yearbook.  My name was mispelled in a personalized Speigel Ident bracelet in elementary school, a present from my best pen pal.  My name has been mispelled in newspapers.  I&#039;m used to it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dulcanton.</p>
<p>My name was mispelled a different way in every single occurance in my high school yearbook.  My name was mispelled in a personalized Speigel Ident bracelet in elementary school, a present from my best pen pal.  My name has been mispelled in newspapers.  I&#8217;m used to it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Pretty pictures &#124; Cosmic Variance</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25009</link>
		<dc:creator>Pretty pictures &#124; Cosmic Variance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 07:26:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25009</guid>
		<description>[...] In a follow-up to Julianne&#8217;s previous post on scientific communication, I thought I&#8217;d describe a lecture I attended last week. I&#8217;ll try not to say anything overly controversial (though CV readers can be a tough crowd). The talk was by Felice Frankel, as part of the Santa Fe Institute public lecture series. The title was &#8220;More than Pretty Pictures: The Power of Images in Science&#8221;. Frankel is known for her scientific photographs. She creates beautiful images of a large range of physical systems (from water droplets to nanocrystals). She&#8217;s been responsible for quite a number of cover images for journals such as Science and Nature. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] In a follow-up to Julianne&#8217;s previous post on scientific communication, I thought I&#8217;d describe a lecture I attended last week. I&#8217;ll try not to say anything overly controversial (though CV readers can be a tough crowd). The talk was by Felice Frankel, as part of the Santa Fe Institute public lecture series. The title was &#8220;More than Pretty Pictures: The Power of Images in Science&#8221;. Frankel is known for her scientific photographs. She creates beautiful images of a large range of physical systems (from water droplets to nanocrystals). She&#8217;s been responsible for quite a number of cover images for journals such as Science and Nature. [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Lab Lemming</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25010</link>
		<dc:creator>Lab Lemming</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 06:30:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25010</guid>
		<description>Did they misspell Julianne, Dalcanton, or Sister?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did they misspell Julianne, Dalcanton, or Sister?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Moshe</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25011</link>
		<dc:creator>Moshe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 01:21:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25011</guid>
		<description>For what it&#039;s worth, I actively dislike the synchronized view. Sometimes I&#039;d like to look at previous slides while listening, or to see where this is leading etc. It is easy enough to synchronize yourself if you so choose, I see no advantage in forcing this on the listener.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For what it&#8217;s worth, I actively dislike the synchronized view. Sometimes I&#8217;d like to look at previous slides while listening, or to see where this is leading etc. It is easy enough to synchronize yourself if you so choose, I see no advantage in forcing this on the listener.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Maynard Handley</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25012</link>
		<dc:creator>Maynard Handley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 00:26:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25012</guid>
		<description>But, Sean, the Fermilab scheme suffers from the HUGE problems of
(1) not portable --- can&#039;t listen it on iPod while exercising, driving or whatever
(2) forces real-time playback --- can&#039;t listen to it at 1.3x or whatever speed your brain can cope with. I frequently playback science content at 1.5x and history/politics content at 1.7x.
(3) is highly likely to not work in five years. The web is littered with various supposedly fancy schemes that try to present multiple pieces of content using some proprietary software c 1997 and that now, in 2007, simply don&#039;t work. Believe me, I&#039;ve hit enough of them in my time.

Plenty of Real based systems seem to suffer from ever-weakening servers, thus delivering a really pleasant gap and jerk filled experience. Places like MIT or Princeton, which you&#039;d figure could afford decent servers, still nonetheless have their older streams play back terribly, presumably the result of general infrastructure neglect.

The Kavli style download of a standard format file avoids all these issues.
There is a reason why hoi polloi mostly love podcasting, once they have learned about it, while you&#039;d be hard-pressed to find someone who is not a whore who has anything good to say about streaming, whether via Real, Windows Media, QT or Flash.

I mean, honestly, are we now so dim-witted that we are incapable of downloading a separate PDF and stepping through that as we listen to a talk, or incapable of hitting the Next button on a sequence of pages ala the way Kavli does it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But, Sean, the Fermilab scheme suffers from the HUGE problems of<br />
(1) not portable &#8212; can&#8217;t listen it on iPod while exercising, driving or whatever<br />
(2) forces real-time playback &#8212; can&#8217;t listen to it at 1.3x or whatever speed your brain can cope with. I frequently playback science content at 1.5x and history/politics content at 1.7x.<br />
(3) is highly likely to not work in five years. The web is littered with various supposedly fancy schemes that try to present multiple pieces of content using some proprietary software c 1997 and that now, in 2007, simply don&#8217;t work. Believe me, I&#8217;ve hit enough of them in my time.</p>
<p>Plenty of Real based systems seem to suffer from ever-weakening servers, thus delivering a really pleasant gap and jerk filled experience. Places like MIT or Princeton, which you&#8217;d figure could afford decent servers, still nonetheless have their older streams play back terribly, presumably the result of general infrastructure neglect.</p>
<p>The Kavli style download of a standard format file avoids all these issues.<br />
There is a reason why hoi polloi mostly love podcasting, once they have learned about it, while you&#8217;d be hard-pressed to find someone who is not a whore who has anything good to say about streaming, whether via Real, Windows Media, QT or Flash.</p>
<p>I mean, honestly, are we now so dim-witted that we are incapable of downloading a separate PDF and stepping through that as we listen to a talk, or incapable of hitting the Next button on a sequence of pages ala the way Kavli does it?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Sean</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25008</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 22:50:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25008</guid>
		<description>Actually I prefer how &lt;a href=&quot;http://vmsfmp2.fnal.gov/FMPro?-db=StreamSources.fp5&amp;-Error=v2/search/video/streamingoffline.html&amp;-lay=WWWBrowse&amp;-format=v2/search/video/streamingvideoForm.html&amp;-find&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Fermilab&lt;/a&gt; does it.  It&#039;s true that they use RealPlayer, but they provide separate (synched) views of the speaker and the slides, which is really what you need.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually I prefer how <a href="http://vmsfmp2.fnal.gov/FMPro?-db=StreamSources.fp5&amp;-Error=v2/search/video/streamingoffline.html&amp;-lay=WWWBrowse&amp;-format=v2/search/video/streamingvideoForm.html&amp;-find" rel="nofollow">Fermilab</a> does it.  It&#8217;s true that they use RealPlayer, but they provide separate (synched) views of the speaker and the slides, which is really what you need.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Julianne</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25013</link>
		<dc:creator>Julianne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 20:36:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25013</guid>
		<description>Maynard -- Thanks for the insight from someone who actually uses the format regularly.  I&#039;d known that Kavli did this, but had never tried it.  Maybe the next big investment from Kavli would be for spreading the technology to more institutions and conferences.  UW is starting to offer it to instructors when teaching large lecture classes, and so far the reaction is mixed.  I think it&#039;s a potentially powerful study aid, but the temptation to skip class becomes immense.

At the professional level, one of the things I love about the possibility of podcasting is that it offers a way to reduce the penalties on people who don&#039;t/can&#039;t travel.  I&#039;ve got small kids, and have cut way back on my conference attendance (i.e. don&#039;t expect any big CV travelogues from me).  Seattle is also a bit out of the way, so other scientists are less likely to just drop in, like they are at Caltech, Harvard, etc.  Podcasting is a good opportunity to stay in the loop.  Lots of conferences are posting PDFs of the speakers slides, and these are tremendously helpful as well.  In my ideal world, I could flip through the PDF while listening to the podcast (with little &quot;beeps&quot; like they had with filmstrips back in the day).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maynard &#8212; Thanks for the insight from someone who actually uses the format regularly.  I&#8217;d known that Kavli did this, but had never tried it.  Maybe the next big investment from Kavli would be for spreading the technology to more institutions and conferences.  UW is starting to offer it to instructors when teaching large lecture classes, and so far the reaction is mixed.  I think it&#8217;s a potentially powerful study aid, but the temptation to skip class becomes immense.</p>
<p>At the professional level, one of the things I love about the possibility of podcasting is that it offers a way to reduce the penalties on people who don&#8217;t/can&#8217;t travel.  I&#8217;ve got small kids, and have cut way back on my conference attendance (i.e. don&#8217;t expect any big CV travelogues from me).  Seattle is also a bit out of the way, so other scientists are less likely to just drop in, like they are at Caltech, Harvard, etc.  Podcasting is a good opportunity to stay in the loop.  Lots of conferences are posting PDFs of the speakers slides, and these are tremendously helpful as well.  In my ideal world, I could flip through the PDF while listening to the podcast (with little &#8220;beeps&#8221; like they had with filmstrips back in the day).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Maynard Handley</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25014</link>
		<dc:creator>Maynard Handley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 20:18:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25014</guid>
		<description>&quot;For scientific talks, the visuals are key&quot;.

(1)
For SOME scientific talks. I listen to a large number of talks on my iPod and there have been very few where I have felt missing visuals to be a problem. Someone like Sean for example (suckup, suckup) going on about missing mass and dark energy is very easy to understand without the visuals.
I&#039;d go so far as to say that the visuals are very important to colleagues, who care about the precise new details in this talk, but of minor importance to interested outsiders.

And remember science is much bigger than just astronomy. Math is basically hopeless via podcast; though visuals migh help a little, it&#039;s much more useful (IMHO) to go through a paper or book at one&#039;s own pace. Similarly for some types of theoretical physics. On the other hand discussions of new experiments can work very well (I thoroughly enjoyed a talk on the ICE_CUBE neutrino observatory). A lot of biology works very well with just sound, though some systems biology needs the pictures. Cognitive science works well, likewise a lot of archeology, as long as it is conceptual rather than detailed reports of a specific dig.

(2) Of all the people in world podcasting science, by FAR the most clueful are the Kavli institute. Anyone not following their examples is being a fool. Among other things they
- have good, searchable, browsable web pages
- good podcast feeds
- use standard (non-proprietary) formats (H264, AAC)
- have a very sensible way to handle video.
Specifically they catch a video frame every 10 seconds (I think) without any expensive human processing, and dump that into the AAC stream. This gives a file that is not significantly larger, that is playable on audio-only devices, but that will display an updated frame every so often on devices that have any (even limited) video capability, like say an iPod nano. The every ten seconds capture gets you the slides/blackboard/whatever, and the lack of motion is not something you&#039;re going to miss except in some very specialized cases like playback of an animation (in which case the animation will generally be available on the web page for that specific talk along with the slides, the audio/video in various formats and so on).
Really very very impressive.

Compare to the extremely crappy jobs done by, for example, Perimeter or CalTech or MIT (lousy search, lousy browsing, streaming only Real format) and you have to wonder WTF is going on in these supposed hotbeds of smart technophiles.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;For scientific talks, the visuals are key&#8221;.</p>
<p>(1)<br />
For SOME scientific talks. I listen to a large number of talks on my iPod and there have been very few where I have felt missing visuals to be a problem. Someone like Sean for example (suckup, suckup) going on about missing mass and dark energy is very easy to understand without the visuals.<br />
I&#8217;d go so far as to say that the visuals are very important to colleagues, who care about the precise new details in this talk, but of minor importance to interested outsiders.</p>
<p>And remember science is much bigger than just astronomy. Math is basically hopeless via podcast; though visuals migh help a little, it&#8217;s much more useful (IMHO) to go through a paper or book at one&#8217;s own pace. Similarly for some types of theoretical physics. On the other hand discussions of new experiments can work very well (I thoroughly enjoyed a talk on the ICE_CUBE neutrino observatory). A lot of biology works very well with just sound, though some systems biology needs the pictures. Cognitive science works well, likewise a lot of archeology, as long as it is conceptual rather than detailed reports of a specific dig.</p>
<p>(2) Of all the people in world podcasting science, by FAR the most clueful are the Kavli institute. Anyone not following their examples is being a fool. Among other things they<br />
- have good, searchable, browsable web pages<br />
- good podcast feeds<br />
- use standard (non-proprietary) formats (H264, AAC)<br />
- have a very sensible way to handle video.<br />
Specifically they catch a video frame every 10 seconds (I think) without any expensive human processing, and dump that into the AAC stream. This gives a file that is not significantly larger, that is playable on audio-only devices, but that will display an updated frame every so often on devices that have any (even limited) video capability, like say an iPod nano. The every ten seconds capture gets you the slides/blackboard/whatever, and the lack of motion is not something you&#8217;re going to miss except in some very specialized cases like playback of an animation (in which case the animation will generally be available on the web page for that specific talk along with the slides, the audio/video in various formats and so on).<br />
Really very very impressive.</p>
<p>Compare to the extremely crappy jobs done by, for example, Perimeter or CalTech or MIT (lousy search, lousy browsing, streaming only Real format) and you have to wonder WTF is going on in these supposed hotbeds of smart technophiles.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Julianne</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25015</link>
		<dc:creator>Julianne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 19:33:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25015</guid>
		<description>Hmmmm -- you were right initially, but I&#039;ve got to call you out on trying to shame Clifton.  Not everyone sees these issues the same way, and no one is required to see them from your point of view.  He&#039;s out there walking the walk and making it in a field that has atrociously low numbers of non-anglos.  He&#039;s serving your goals just by showing up.  Can you give him kudos for that, rather than scolding him for not reacting in the identical way as you?

One of the big issues in determining whether someone &quot;makes it&quot; in a field or not is their resiliancy, particularly if you&#039;re an outsider.  The thick skinned have an easier time brushing off the various struggles one faces in navigating through a sub-culture that is not completely your own.  What this allows one to do is to keep on doing excellent work without getting too demoralized or pissed off to move forward.  This is not the same as not speaking up when the situation demands, but means sometimes conserving one&#039;s energies for the big fights.  I&#039;m not saying that you&#039;re &quot;too outraged&quot; or that Clifton is not outraged enough -- it&#039;s just that temperments vary and not getting worked up about small stuff has little bearing on whether someone would fight the larger fights that matter.  To essentially equate his finding the original post funny with a failure to appreciate the civil rights struggle of the 60&#039;s and 70&#039;s seems ungenerous and counterproductive.

Look, for lots of women &quot;cunt&quot; is an incredibly loaded word.  For me, I could care less, and I&#039;m just going to get irritated if someone tries to scold me into feeling a level of outrage that I just don&#039;t have (though I won&#039;t let it be said at work if it&#039;s bugging people, the same way I took down the pictures in response to your comments).  My ability to say &quot;cunt cunt cunt cunt&quot; without a flicker in my heart rate says squat about my appreciation for the fact that my path has been vastly easier than women of my parents&#039; generation. I may be post-feminist in a lot of ways, but the way I live my life and the fights I take on embody feminism, without my having to mimic a particular form of it.

(Sorry Hmmmm --- lots of cross posting so I missed the back and forth with Adam....I&#039;ll leave this for posterity)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmmm &#8212; you were right initially, but I&#8217;ve got to call you out on trying to shame Clifton.  Not everyone sees these issues the same way, and no one is required to see them from your point of view.  He&#8217;s out there walking the walk and making it in a field that has atrociously low numbers of non-anglos.  He&#8217;s serving your goals just by showing up.  Can you give him kudos for that, rather than scolding him for not reacting in the identical way as you?</p>
<p>One of the big issues in determining whether someone &#8220;makes it&#8221; in a field or not is their resiliancy, particularly if you&#8217;re an outsider.  The thick skinned have an easier time brushing off the various struggles one faces in navigating through a sub-culture that is not completely your own.  What this allows one to do is to keep on doing excellent work without getting too demoralized or pissed off to move forward.  This is not the same as not speaking up when the situation demands, but means sometimes conserving one&#8217;s energies for the big fights.  I&#8217;m not saying that you&#8217;re &#8220;too outraged&#8221; or that Clifton is not outraged enough &#8212; it&#8217;s just that temperments vary and not getting worked up about small stuff has little bearing on whether someone would fight the larger fights that matter.  To essentially equate his finding the original post funny with a failure to appreciate the civil rights struggle of the 60&#8242;s and 70&#8242;s seems ungenerous and counterproductive.</p>
<p>Look, for lots of women &#8220;cunt&#8221; is an incredibly loaded word.  For me, I could care less, and I&#8217;m just going to get irritated if someone tries to scold me into feeling a level of outrage that I just don&#8217;t have (though I won&#8217;t let it be said at work if it&#8217;s bugging people, the same way I took down the pictures in response to your comments).  My ability to say &#8220;cunt cunt cunt cunt&#8221; without a flicker in my heart rate says squat about my appreciation for the fact that my path has been vastly easier than women of my parents&#8217; generation. I may be post-feminist in a lot of ways, but the way I live my life and the fights I take on embody feminism, without my having to mimic a particular form of it.</p>
<p>(Sorry Hmmmm &#8212; lots of cross posting so I missed the back and forth with Adam&#8230;.I&#8217;ll leave this for posterity)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: adam</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25017</link>
		<dc:creator>adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 19:10:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25017</guid>
		<description>I would also add that being a white man from the UK doesn&#039;t mean that I am necessarily inexpert on the subject of US race relations. I am a white man from the  UK who also happens to be inexpert on the subject US race relations. Apologies for the clumsy sentence in post #20.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would also add that being a white man from the UK doesn&#8217;t mean that I am necessarily inexpert on the subject of US race relations. I am a white man from the  UK who also happens to be inexpert on the subject US race relations. Apologies for the clumsy sentence in post #20.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: adam</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25016</link>
		<dc:creator>adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 19:03:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25016</guid>
		<description>Hmmm #19: But at what stage does it stop? I would hope that no one here pretends that race relations don&#039;t have a very unhappy history and, indeed, a rather unhappy present, but assigning a factually existent way of talking to a couple of people that don&#039;t talk that way, for comic effect, doesn&#039;t seem to me to cross the line. I mean, it&#039;s not that spiteful drivel that Carlos Mencia churns out so that he can claim to be daring, is it? Sure, it&#039;d be a different thing if it was appearing on Stormfront, but it wasn&#039;t, and surely we can make contextual judgements on this sort of thing?

However, it&#039;s not like I am an expert on US race relations, nor claim to be; I&#039;m a white man from the UK.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm #19: But at what stage does it stop? I would hope that no one here pretends that race relations don&#8217;t have a very unhappy history and, indeed, a rather unhappy present, but assigning a factually existent way of talking to a couple of people that don&#8217;t talk that way, for comic effect, doesn&#8217;t seem to me to cross the line. I mean, it&#8217;s not that spiteful drivel that Carlos Mencia churns out so that he can claim to be daring, is it? Sure, it&#8217;d be a different thing if it was appearing on Stormfront, but it wasn&#8217;t, and surely we can make contextual judgements on this sort of thing?</p>
<p>However, it&#8217;s not like I am an expert on US race relations, nor claim to be; I&#8217;m a white man from the UK.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Hmmmm</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25020</link>
		<dc:creator>Hmmmm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 18:52:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25020</guid>
		<description>Hi Adam,

I&#039;m not scolding Clifton for not being offended. As a matter of fact, I wasn&#039;t offended.

I&#039;m scolding Clifton for forgeting the bigger picture.

And just to put it out there...I&#039;m black, I have a Ph.D in physics, and I consider myself to be very successful. I&#039;d be the last guy to have a chip on my shoulder. That&#039;s not what this is about.

Let me try to explain....

My mother still to this day tells stories about how she wanted to go to college, but was denied access. We, as a nation, have progressed mightly since then because a lot of people sacrificed and fought for that progress. In truth, all of the opportunites that I have had, that were denied to the generation before me, are due those &quot;civil-rights warriors&quot;.....For them I&#039;m thankful.

It one looks at the rest of the world or looks at history it&#039;s clear that our modern progressive tolerant society doesn&#039;t have to exist (it may not even be a global minimum). As I alluded to in my last post; the people who lived in that &quot;other&quot; society arent even dead yet. So if I have to be one of those pesky PC police to help keep our modern progressive tolerant society from regressing....than that&#039;s what I&#039;ll do.

Do you understand....it&#039;s in my interest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Adam,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not scolding Clifton for not being offended. As a matter of fact, I wasn&#8217;t offended.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m scolding Clifton for forgeting the bigger picture.</p>
<p>And just to put it out there&#8230;I&#8217;m black, I have a Ph.D in physics, and I consider myself to be very successful. I&#8217;d be the last guy to have a chip on my shoulder. That&#8217;s not what this is about.</p>
<p>Let me try to explain&#8230;.</p>
<p>My mother still to this day tells stories about how she wanted to go to college, but was denied access. We, as a nation, have progressed mightly since then because a lot of people sacrificed and fought for that progress. In truth, all of the opportunites that I have had, that were denied to the generation before me, are due those &#8220;civil-rights warriors&#8221;&#8230;..For them I&#8217;m thankful.</p>
<p>It one looks at the rest of the world or looks at history it&#8217;s clear that our modern progressive tolerant society doesn&#8217;t have to exist (it may not even be a global minimum). As I alluded to in my last post; the people who lived in that &#8220;other&#8221; society arent even dead yet. So if I have to be one of those pesky PC police to help keep our modern progressive tolerant society from regressing&#8230;.than that&#8217;s what I&#8217;ll do.</p>
<p>Do you understand&#8230;.it&#8217;s in my interest.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: adam</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25019</link>
		<dc:creator>adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 18:40:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25019</guid>
		<description>Sean=point-nazi.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sean=point-nazi.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Sean</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25018</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 18:39:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25018</guid>
		<description>Returning to the point, the way the AAS did the podcasts was completely bizarre.  I noticed them linked from Steinn&#039;s blog, and wondered why Julianne hadn&#039;t posted herself about her podcast -- and then I saw that it was just a static picture, with none of the images included, and it all made sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Returning to the point, the way the AAS did the podcasts was completely bizarre.  I noticed them linked from Steinn&#8217;s blog, and wondered why Julianne hadn&#8217;t posted herself about her podcast &#8212; and then I saw that it was just a static picture, with none of the images included, and it all made sense.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: adam</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25007</link>
		<dc:creator>adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 18:22:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25007</guid>
		<description>Hmmmmm 15, are you criticising the African-American guy for not being offended? I mean, seriously? Whatever your own racial origin, that seems a bit weird.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmmmm 15, are you criticising the African-American guy for not being offended? I mean, seriously? Whatever your own racial origin, that seems a bit weird.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Hmmmm</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25006</link>
		<dc:creator>Hmmmm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 18:18:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25006</guid>
		<description>I am sure Julianne meant nothing, and I&#039;m sure certain people WEREN&#039;T offended, but that&#039;s not the point. The point is that certain people WERE offended...Remember, the people who used &quot;coloreds only&quot; bathrooms are still alive. People like Cosmo &quot;50-years-ago-you-would-have-had-a-fork-up-your-ass&quot; Kramer still exist.

There are to many bad things in our recent history.....it&#039;s not really funny.

And shame on you Clifton Moore...don&#039;t forget that your opportunity exists, in part, because people fought against these things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am sure Julianne meant nothing, and I&#8217;m sure certain people WEREN&#8217;T offended, but that&#8217;s not the point. The point is that certain people WERE offended&#8230;Remember, the people who used &#8220;coloreds only&#8221; bathrooms are still alive. People like Cosmo &#8220;50-years-ago-you-would-have-had-a-fork-up-your-ass&#8221; Kramer still exist.</p>
<p>There are to many bad things in our recent history&#8230;..it&#8217;s not really funny.</p>
<p>And shame on you Clifton Moore&#8230;don&#8217;t forget that your opportunity exists, in part, because people fought against these things.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: adam</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/comment-page-1/#comment-25005</link>
		<dc:creator>adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 18:06:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/02/15/the-sound-and-the-fury/#comment-25005</guid>
		<description>It was about incongruity, wasn&#039;t it? A joke against stuffy physicists, it seemed to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was about incongruity, wasn&#8217;t it? A joke against stuffy physicists, it seemed to me.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

<!-- Performance optimized by W3 Total Cache. Learn more: http://www.w3-edge.com/wordpress-plugins/

Minified using disk
Page Caching using disk

Served from: blogs.discovermagazine.com @ 2012-02-14 13:52:40 -->
