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	<title>Comments on: Thanksgiving</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/</link>
	<description>Random samplings from a universe of ideas.</description>
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		<title>By: Thanksgiving &#124; Cosmic Variance &#124; Discover Magazine</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-49651</link>
		<dc:creator>Thanksgiving &#124; Cosmic Variance &#124; Discover Magazine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Nov 2008 16:55:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-49651</guid>
		<description>[...] This year we give thanks for the spin-statistics theorem. (Previously we gave thanks for the Lagrangian of the Standard Model of particle physics, and for Hubble&#8217;s Law.) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This year we give thanks for the spin-statistics theorem. (Previously we gave thanks for the Lagrangian of the Standard Model of particle physics, and for Hubble&#8217;s Law.) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Does Space Expand? &#124; Cosmic Variance</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34121</link>
		<dc:creator>Does Space Expand? &#124; Cosmic Variance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 17:35:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34121</guid>
		<description>[...] seems to be something in the air these days that is making people speak out against the idea that space is expanding. For evidence, check out these two recent papers: The kinematic origin of the cosmological redshift [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] seems to be something in the air these days that is making people speak out against the idea that space is expanding. For evidence, check out these two recent papers: The kinematic origin of the cosmological redshift [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Sam Cox</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34120</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam Cox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 06:52:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34120</guid>
		<description>Errata: See: &quot;A Dark, Misleading Force&quot; thread....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Errata: See: &#8220;A Dark, Misleading Force&#8221; thread&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Sam Cox</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34119</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam Cox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 06:45:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34119</guid>
		<description>ABSTRACT: Don N. Page; December 13, 2007...last sentence...

&quot;SQM also suggests the possibility that past steps along our evolutionary ancestry may be so rare, that they have occurred no where else in the past history of the universe that we can observe&quot;.

It is almost certain that life in the universe is a common phenomenon. It is also almost impossible that beings identical to ourselves exist anywhere else. One does not have to be a quantum theorist to fathom that! However it is interesting that certain quantum theories point to such an obvious conclusion about our uniqueness in the universe.

For similar reasons, related to genetic inheritance and environmental upbringing, each human individual who has ever lived is also unique. Cloning people doesn&#039;t produce robots, just individuals with identical genetic inheritance- as identical twins. However, no pair of identical twins live exactly identical lives.

This comment in Don&#039;s abstract has profound implications...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ABSTRACT: Don N. Page; December 13, 2007&#8230;last sentence&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8220;SQM also suggests the possibility that past steps along our evolutionary ancestry may be so rare, that they have occurred no where else in the past history of the universe that we can observe&#8221;.</p>
<p>It is almost certain that life in the universe is a common phenomenon. It is also almost impossible that beings identical to ourselves exist anywhere else. One does not have to be a quantum theorist to fathom that! However it is interesting that certain quantum theories point to such an obvious conclusion about our uniqueness in the universe.</p>
<p>For similar reasons, related to genetic inheritance and environmental upbringing, each human individual who has ever lived is also unique. Cloning people doesn&#8217;t produce robots, just individuals with identical genetic inheritance- as identical twins. However, no pair of identical twins live exactly identical lives.</p>
<p>This comment in Don&#8217;s abstract has profound implications&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Sam Cox</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34097</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam Cox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Dec 2007 01:47:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34097</guid>
		<description>I first saw that famous picture of Einstein at the telescope with Hubble looking on in high school, more years ago than I would care to discuss. Suffice it to say I saw that picture for the first time while Albert Einstein was still very much alive!

If anybody is into non-verbals, look at the expressions on Albert and Edwins faces!

A picture is truly worth 1,000 words!

I realize the picture was posed...for all we know it was taken in the daytime.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I first saw that famous picture of Einstein at the telescope with Hubble looking on in high school, more years ago than I would care to discuss. Suffice it to say I saw that picture for the first time while Albert Einstein was still very much alive!</p>
<p>If anybody is into non-verbals, look at the expressions on Albert and Edwins faces!</p>
<p>A picture is truly worth 1,000 words!</p>
<p>I realize the picture was posed&#8230;for all we know it was taken in the daytime.</p>
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		<title>By: Neil B.</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34118</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil B.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Nov 2007 23:39:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34118</guid>
		<description>Hey folks, what about that &quot;axis of evil&quot; stuff etc? You can google for it ... It looks like something preferred, but too early to tell what&#039;s up.

As for hard spheres in the contracting universe: the point is, not how they affect the forces, but they are an obstruction - I don&#039;t think they could be just pulverized as if nothing there.  There are contradiction problems if you try to imagine what happens to all the bodies in expanding/contracting universes if some things are impeded by material barriers/obstructions and other things just move like dust in free fall.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey folks, what about that &#8220;axis of evil&#8221; stuff etc? You can google for it &#8230; It looks like something preferred, but too early to tell what&#8217;s up.</p>
<p>As for hard spheres in the contracting universe: the point is, not how they affect the forces, but they are an obstruction &#8211; I don&#8217;t think they could be just pulverized as if nothing there.  There are contradiction problems if you try to imagine what happens to all the bodies in expanding/contracting universes if some things are impeded by material barriers/obstructions and other things just move like dust in free fall.</p>
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		<title>By: Garth Barber</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34117</link>
		<dc:creator>Garth Barber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Nov 2007 18:47:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34117</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Garth: H_o*t_o is not equal to 1 with an accuracy of 0.6%.
t_o is known (but model dependent) to 1% and H_o (also
model dependent) to 4%. So while the product is very close to 1, the propagated uncertainy is 4%.&lt;/blockquote&gt; Yes Ned, although my post #22 was submitted before it was properly prepared (I have you Preview button on this Forum), I was simply using your Cosmology Calculator http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/CosmoCalc.html,.

The present best accepted values of cosmological parameters
(using the table in WMAP Cosmological Parameters http://lambda.gsfc.nasa.gov/product/map/dr2/params/lcdm_all.cfm)
Ho = 70.4 km/sec/Mpsc
Omega_Lambda = 0.732
Omega_matter = 0.268

Feeding these values into your calculator I obtain:
The age of the universe is = 13.81 Gyrs.
But with h_100 = 0.704,
Hubble Time = 13.89 Gyrs. i.e. 0.6% difference!

In other words the calculated age turns out to be equal to Hubble Time to within the limits of the observational error of 4%.

Is this just a coincidence or is the universe trying to tell us something?

Garth</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Garth: H_o*t_o is not equal to 1 with an accuracy of 0.6%.<br />
t_o is known (but model dependent) to 1% and H_o (also<br />
model dependent) to 4%. So while the product is very close to 1, the propagated uncertainy is 4%.</p></blockquote>
<p> Yes Ned, although my post #22 was submitted before it was properly prepared (I have you Preview button on this Forum), I was simply using your Cosmology Calculator <a href="http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/CosmoCalc.html," rel="nofollow">http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/CosmoCalc.html,</a>.</p>
<p>The present best accepted values of cosmological parameters<br />
(using the table in WMAP Cosmological Parameters <a href="http://lambda.gsfc.nasa.gov/product/map/dr2/params/lcdm_all.cfm)" rel="nofollow">http://lambda.gsfc.nasa.gov/product/map/dr2/params/lcdm_all.cfm)</a><br />
Ho = 70.4 km/sec/Mpsc<br />
Omega_Lambda = 0.732<br />
Omega_matter = 0.268</p>
<p>Feeding these values into your calculator I obtain:<br />
The age of the universe is = 13.81 Gyrs.<br />
But with h_100 = 0.704,<br />
Hubble Time = 13.89 Gyrs. i.e. 0.6% difference!</p>
<p>In other words the calculated age turns out to be equal to Hubble Time to within the limits of the observational error of 4%.</p>
<p>Is this just a coincidence or is the universe trying to tell us something?</p>
<p>Garth</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Stankus</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34115</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Stankus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Nov 2007 18:11:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34115</guid>
		<description>Hi Sean --

The discovery of the Hubble expansion was indeed a profound advance.  But there&#039;s even more to it than that, as you well know, so let me point out for your readers:

 1. The pattern of Hubble&#039;s law, that the recessional velocity of distant galaxies is proportional to their distance away, directly implies that contemporary observers on any galaxy will see the same pattern, and with the same proportionality.  Thus the Hubble law contains the idea that the expansion has no preferred center.

 2. If we extrapolate the Hubble-law motions of the galaxies backward, assuming no acceleration (a not entirely unreasonable thing to do), we discover that there was a singular moment at a finite time into the past when they were all on top of each other.  So Hubble&#039;s law also raises directly the idea of a Universe with finite age.

Hubble could/would have declared an expanding Universe based on any observation of velocity going up monotonically with distance.  It is the special linear result  v=Hd  that also leads to the also profound picture of a uniform expansion with a finite history.  It all came in the same package! as long ago as 1930, for which we can indeed be thankful.

Cheers,

Paul</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Sean &#8211;</p>
<p>The discovery of the Hubble expansion was indeed a profound advance.  But there&#8217;s even more to it than that, as you well know, so let me point out for your readers:</p>
<p> 1. The pattern of Hubble&#8217;s law, that the recessional velocity of distant galaxies is proportional to their distance away, directly implies that contemporary observers on any galaxy will see the same pattern, and with the same proportionality.  Thus the Hubble law contains the idea that the expansion has no preferred center.</p>
<p> 2. If we extrapolate the Hubble-law motions of the galaxies backward, assuming no acceleration (a not entirely unreasonable thing to do), we discover that there was a singular moment at a finite time into the past when they were all on top of each other.  So Hubble&#8217;s law also raises directly the idea of a Universe with finite age.</p>
<p>Hubble could/would have declared an expanding Universe based on any observation of velocity going up monotonically with distance.  It is the special linear result  v=Hd  that also leads to the also profound picture of a uniform expansion with a finite history.  It all came in the same package! as long ago as 1930, for which we can indeed be thankful.</p>
<p>Cheers,</p>
<p>Paul</p>
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		<title>By: Ned Wright</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34116</link>
		<dc:creator>Ned Wright</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Nov 2007 16:55:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34116</guid>
		<description>Neil B: the &quot;hard&quot; spheres would lead to a large positive pressure
which would cause the contraction to go faster.  This seems
paradoxical but recall that objects are accelerated by
pressure gradients, not by a uniform pressure, and that both
pressure and density contribute with negative signs to the
second derivative  of the scale factor.  So to slow down a contraction,
which would be a positive second derivative for the scale factor,
one needs a large negative pressure.

Garth: H_o*t_o is not equal to 1 with an accuracy of 0.6%.
t_o is known (but model dependent) to 1% and H_o (also
model dependent) to 4%.  So while the product is very close to 1, the propagated uncertainy is 4%.

Sean: I read Luminet&#039;s review (pointed out by Daniel Fischer)
and it makes the point that Le Maitre&#039;s little cited 1927 paper
in French to the Belgian Academy actually did the data analysis
and derived the Hubble constant two years before Hubble.  Then
Luminet didn&#039;t list this paper in his reference list!  I wish
this 1927 paper were in the ADS, but last time I checked only
the translation in the 1931 MNRAS was there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neil B: the &#8220;hard&#8221; spheres would lead to a large positive pressure<br />
which would cause the contraction to go faster.  This seems<br />
paradoxical but recall that objects are accelerated by<br />
pressure gradients, not by a uniform pressure, and that both<br />
pressure and density contribute with negative signs to the<br />
second derivative  of the scale factor.  So to slow down a contraction,<br />
which would be a positive second derivative for the scale factor,<br />
one needs a large negative pressure.</p>
<p>Garth: H_o*t_o is not equal to 1 with an accuracy of 0.6%.<br />
t_o is known (but model dependent) to 1% and H_o (also<br />
model dependent) to 4%.  So while the product is very close to 1, the propagated uncertainy is 4%.</p>
<p>Sean: I read Luminet&#8217;s review (pointed out by Daniel Fischer)<br />
and it makes the point that Le Maitre&#8217;s little cited 1927 paper<br />
in French to the Belgian Academy actually did the data analysis<br />
and derived the Hubble constant two years before Hubble.  Then<br />
Luminet didn&#8217;t list this paper in his reference list!  I wish<br />
this 1927 paper were in the ADS, but last time I checked only<br />
the translation in the 1931 MNRAS was there.</p>
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		<title>By: A new hidden symmetry of nature discovered at Freedom of Science</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/comment-page-1/#comment-34114</link>
		<dc:creator>A new hidden symmetry of nature discovered at Freedom of Science</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Nov 2007 02:16:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2007/11/22/thanksgiving-2/#comment-34114</guid>
		<description>[...] new discovery that physics is a physical system of puns is getting truer and truer every day. In this article on Hubble&#8217;s Law Doctor Carroll of Cosmic Variance plays on the old pun between the universe [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] new discovery that physics is a physical system of puns is getting truer and truer every day. In this article on Hubble&#8217;s Law Doctor Carroll of Cosmic Variance plays on the old pun between the universe [...]</p>
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