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	<title>Comments on: What Good is a Theory?</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/</link>
	<description>Random samplings from a universe of ideas.</description>
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		<title>By: Barry</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41123</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 18:07:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41123</guid>
		<description>Proteus:  &quot;Without resorting to &quot;Global Warming is a Hoax&quot; accusations, I will say that I am surprised to hear so many scientists commit the very sin of &quot;correlation is adequate&quot; when it comes to that matter.&quot;

Which is not what they&#039;re saying.  Please read
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amazon.com/Discovery-Warming-Histories-Technology-Medicine/dp/0674016378/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&amp;s=books&amp;qid=1215626709&amp;sr=1-1&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The Discovery of Global Warming&lt;/a&gt; for an excellent introduction, which points out the phsysics.  It does tend to stint on the biological confirmations of the models, though.  Also, please read realclimate.org.

&quot;Crucial to that matter, it seems, is an ability to separate the scientific method from politics.&quot;

The whole strategy of denialists is precisely to use politics to do what they failed to do in science.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Proteus:  &#8220;Without resorting to &#8220;Global Warming is a Hoax&#8221; accusations, I will say that I am surprised to hear so many scientists commit the very sin of &#8220;correlation is adequate&#8221; when it comes to that matter.&#8221;</p>
<p>Which is not what they&#8217;re saying.  Please read<br />
<a href="http://www.amazon.com/Discovery-Warming-Histories-Technology-Medicine/dp/0674016378/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&amp;s=books&amp;qid=1215626709&amp;sr=1-1" rel="nofollow">The Discovery of Global Warming</a> for an excellent introduction, which points out the phsysics.  It does tend to stint on the biological confirmations of the models, though.  Also, please read realclimate.org.</p>
<p>&#8220;Crucial to that matter, it seems, is an ability to separate the scientific method from politics.&#8221;</p>
<p>The whole strategy of denialists is precisely to use politics to do what they failed to do in science.</p>
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		<title>By: John Merryman</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41113</link>
		<dc:creator>John Merryman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jul 2008 17:17:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41113</guid>
		<description>Neil,

 That would be &quot;The model is that there is no model. &quot; model?

Consider it from the basic dichotomy of bottom up process vs. top down structure;
Any organizational unit, be it an organism, corporation, theory, etc. must have some unifying focus in order to exist, but that definition sets limits and therefore it cannot also be infinite in its application.
 What would happen if two realities which operated under different physical laws were to meet. In a sense, the same thing that happens when there is any conflict, be it between two bio-systems or two galaxies. There would be a mash-up and what emerged would be a new system forming out of the innumerable interactions. It wouldn&#039;t have the same features as either of the originals, though there would be complexities that managed to carry over in diverse forms, whether organic or mineral. Say the Big Bang was caused by such a collision of two such realities. The set of physical laws which emerged wouldn&#039;t be completely reducible back to some basic theory without knowing the laws of both preceding realities.
 It is that intermingling that is a function of the bottom up process and any specific unit within it cannot be completely understand in isolation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neil,</p>
<p> That would be &#8220;The model is that there is no model. &#8221; model?</p>
<p>Consider it from the basic dichotomy of bottom up process vs. top down structure;<br />
Any organizational unit, be it an organism, corporation, theory, etc. must have some unifying focus in order to exist, but that definition sets limits and therefore it cannot also be infinite in its application.<br />
 What would happen if two realities which operated under different physical laws were to meet. In a sense, the same thing that happens when there is any conflict, be it between two bio-systems or two galaxies. There would be a mash-up and what emerged would be a new system forming out of the innumerable interactions. It wouldn&#8217;t have the same features as either of the originals, though there would be complexities that managed to carry over in diverse forms, whether organic or mineral. Say the Big Bang was caused by such a collision of two such realities. The set of physical laws which emerged wouldn&#8217;t be completely reducible back to some basic theory without knowing the laws of both preceding realities.<br />
 It is that intermingling that is a function of the bottom up process and any specific unit within it cannot be completely understand in isolation.</p>
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		<title>By: Neil B.</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41122</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil B.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 22:10:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41122</guid>
		<description>As I just commented at Backreaction: Curiously, there really can&#039;t be any &quot;theory&quot; to show us a way if modal-realist type ideas (like Tegmark&#039;s) are really &quot;true&quot; - all descriptions exist, and we are just in the one that acts like this. There&#039;d be no &quot;reason why&quot;, no underlying &quot;conceptual scheme&quot; etc, there would only appear to be.
 (- sorry about being so belated.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As I just commented at Backreaction: Curiously, there really can&#8217;t be any &#8220;theory&#8221; to show us a way if modal-realist type ideas (like Tegmark&#8217;s) are really &#8220;true&#8221; &#8211; all descriptions exist, and we are just in the one that acts like this. There&#8217;d be no &#8220;reason why&#8221;, no underlying &#8220;conceptual scheme&#8221; etc, there would only appear to be.<br />
 (- sorry about being so belated.)</p>
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		<title>By: Scientific Method Obsolete? - Page 2 - Bad Astronomy and Universe Today Forum</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41121</link>
		<dc:creator>Scientific Method Obsolete? - Page 2 - Bad Astronomy and Universe Today Forum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 22:33:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41121</guid>
		<description>[...] with the idea that we don&#039;t know why our system works well.    Edit: and from Sean Carroll, we have this blog post    __________________ Chris Hillman       Last edited by Chris Hillman : Today at 05:32 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] with the idea that we don&#8217;t know why our system works well.    Edit: and from Sean Carroll, we have this blog post    __________________ Chris Hillman       Last edited by Chris Hillman : Today at 05:32 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Aiya-Oba</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41098</link>
		<dc:creator>Aiya-Oba</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 18:34:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41098</guid>
		<description>Equator of principle and particle (gluon of self-contradiction), is the Absolute Logic of self-creation of Spacetime-Continuum.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Equator of principle and particle (gluon of self-contradiction), is the Absolute Logic of self-creation of Spacetime-Continuum.</p>
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		<title>By: John Merryman</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41118</link>
		<dc:creator>John Merryman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 15:49:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41118</guid>
		<description>Mike,

 Since an objective perspective is an oxymoron, any inquiry is inherently subjective to begin with. Added to that, the process of inducing a general theory from a collection of data is inherently reductionistic. So it would seem problematic to assume that one might draw particularly objective conclusions from a particular study. This is mitigated by multiplying the fields of inquiry and finding which patterns are most prevalent.
 From my limited experience and knowledge, it would seem one of the most basic patterns is of opposing forces in motion relative to one another, be it electricity or football, politics or geophysics. So is nature some dualistic construct, or is there a fundamental physicality and if we just keep smacking particles into one another, we will eventually find it. Or are we missing some larger point?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike,</p>
<p> Since an objective perspective is an oxymoron, any inquiry is inherently subjective to begin with. Added to that, the process of inducing a general theory from a collection of data is inherently reductionistic. So it would seem problematic to assume that one might draw particularly objective conclusions from a particular study. This is mitigated by multiplying the fields of inquiry and finding which patterns are most prevalent.<br />
 From my limited experience and knowledge, it would seem one of the most basic patterns is of opposing forces in motion relative to one another, be it electricity or football, politics or geophysics. So is nature some dualistic construct, or is there a fundamental physicality and if we just keep smacking particles into one another, we will eventually find it. Or are we missing some larger point?</p>
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		<title>By: Mike M</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41112</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 09:04:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41112</guid>
		<description>Not sure I am saying anything so radical, John.  I would imagine that psychologists would argue that their theories of human behaviour are objective (though some would argue!).  The fact that the theory is driven utlimately by quantum field theory if you were able to tunnel down far enough is true, but essentially uninteresting as it provides no insight into the subject.  Similarly, a football game is ultimately driven by fundamental physics, but quantum theory rarely features in the post-game analysis. Since these levels of description are surely somehow related to the complexity of the system under consideration, all I am speculating is that if you have a complex enough experiment then it may no longer be appropriate to analyze it in terms of physics even if it was designed as a physics experiment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure I am saying anything so radical, John.  I would imagine that psychologists would argue that their theories of human behaviour are objective (though some would argue!).  The fact that the theory is driven utlimately by quantum field theory if you were able to tunnel down far enough is true, but essentially uninteresting as it provides no insight into the subject.  Similarly, a football game is ultimately driven by fundamental physics, but quantum theory rarely features in the post-game analysis. Since these levels of description are surely somehow related to the complexity of the system under consideration, all I am speculating is that if you have a complex enough experiment then it may no longer be appropriate to analyze it in terms of physics even if it was designed as a physics experiment.</p>
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		<title>By: John Merryman</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41120</link>
		<dc:creator>John Merryman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 23:23:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41120</guid>
		<description>Mike,

 So what you&#039;re saying is that theory is necessarily based on objectives, than objectivity?
 I suppose then that those who do base their studies on pure objectivity are taking a long walk off a short board.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike,</p>
<p> So what you&#8217;re saying is that theory is necessarily based on objectives, than objectivity?<br />
 I suppose then that those who do base their studies on pure objectivity are taking a long walk off a short board.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike M</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41096</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 19:29:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41096</guid>
		<description>But even if you optimistically believe that all the links in the chain can be made (for which there is no guarantee), it still wouldn&#039;t make sense to discuss a complex system like human psychology in terms of quantum field theory, as it would yield zero insight.  Similarly, I could well imagine that there will come a point where it no longer makes sense to discuss a huge data set from a complex physical system, like the GAIA observations of the Milky Way for example, in terms of fundamental physics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But even if you optimistically believe that all the links in the chain can be made (for which there is no guarantee), it still wouldn&#8217;t make sense to discuss a complex system like human psychology in terms of quantum field theory, as it would yield zero insight.  Similarly, I could well imagine that there will come a point where it no longer makes sense to discuss a huge data set from a complex physical system, like the GAIA observations of the Milky Way for example, in terms of fundamental physics.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Dick</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41119</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Dick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 16:54:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41119</guid>
		<description>Mike M,

That&#039;s not the point.  You don&#039;t have to explain things in terms of the most fundamental laws we know to at least have &lt;i&gt;some&lt;/i&gt; explanation.  For example, eventually we may hope to understand the operation of the human brain in terms of the activity of its basic components: neurons.  There are many neuroscientists today working on this very problem, and it&#039;s a good goal to have.

We can then understand the operation of individual neurons based on the chemistry of their components.  We can understand the chemistry of their components in terms of non-relativistic quantum mechanics.  We can understand non-relativistic quantum mechanics in terms of quantum field theory.  And, some day, we may understand quantum field theory in terms of some more fundamental theory.

Either way, you don&#039;t have to describe &lt;i&gt;everything&lt;/i&gt; by breaking it down to its most fundamental components.  There are ways of simplifying the problem by breaking it up into pieces.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike M,</p>
<p>That&#8217;s not the point.  You don&#8217;t have to explain things in terms of the most fundamental laws we know to at least have <i>some</i> explanation.  For example, eventually we may hope to understand the operation of the human brain in terms of the activity of its basic components: neurons.  There are many neuroscientists today working on this very problem, and it&#8217;s a good goal to have.</p>
<p>We can then understand the operation of individual neurons based on the chemistry of their components.  We can understand the chemistry of their components in terms of non-relativistic quantum mechanics.  We can understand non-relativistic quantum mechanics in terms of quantum field theory.  And, some day, we may understand quantum field theory in terms of some more fundamental theory.</p>
<p>Either way, you don&#8217;t have to describe <i>everything</i> by breaking it down to its most fundamental components.  There are ways of simplifying the problem by breaking it up into pieces.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike M</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41111</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 11:15:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41111</guid>
		<description>I do have to express a certain sympathy for one of the points that lies somewhere behind this argument.  Although theories are a vital component of science, the level at which those theories are expressed depends on the complexity of the data.  For example, presumably human psychology could ultimately be explained in terms of quantum mechanics, but it doesn&#039;t strike me as a particularly worthwhile or meaningful exercise to attempt, as it would teach you essentially nothing about the nature of human psychology.  It seems at least a priori plausible that some big experiments have now reached a scale and complexity where explanations in terms of fundamental theories of physics no longer provide the most insightul explanations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do have to express a certain sympathy for one of the points that lies somewhere behind this argument.  Although theories are a vital component of science, the level at which those theories are expressed depends on the complexity of the data.  For example, presumably human psychology could ultimately be explained in terms of quantum mechanics, but it doesn&#8217;t strike me as a particularly worthwhile or meaningful exercise to attempt, as it would teach you essentially nothing about the nature of human psychology.  It seems at least a priori plausible that some big experiments have now reached a scale and complexity where explanations in terms of fundamental theories of physics no longer provide the most insightul explanations.</p>
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		<title>By: Lawrence B. Crowell</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41124</link>
		<dc:creator>Lawrence B. Crowell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 03:24:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41124</guid>
		<description>This criticism can be levied against other sciences as well.  Molecular biology uncovers very complex enzymatic pathways and webs of pathways through a set of experiments which require massive data analysis.  The genetic map of an organism is a daunting task.

Anderson appears unaware that data analysis has emerged as a sub-science of its own with lines of research in applied mathematics.  A large set of data will betray signals with digital filters and statistical methods.  If a signal is there it can be found in principle by some method.  Hmmm... maybe letting the SETI people sift NRAO data and work up new methods has wider applications than an improbable search for little green men.

Since Berlinsky wrote his languid missives and councils of despair with the whole ID flapdoodle I have little time for these defeatist types.

Lawrence B. Crowell</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This criticism can be levied against other sciences as well.  Molecular biology uncovers very complex enzymatic pathways and webs of pathways through a set of experiments which require massive data analysis.  The genetic map of an organism is a daunting task.</p>
<p>Anderson appears unaware that data analysis has emerged as a sub-science of its own with lines of research in applied mathematics.  A large set of data will betray signals with digital filters and statistical methods.  If a signal is there it can be found in principle by some method.  Hmmm&#8230; maybe letting the SETI people sift NRAO data and work up new methods has wider applications than an improbable search for little green men.</p>
<p>Since Berlinsky wrote his languid missives and councils of despair with the whole ID flapdoodle I have little time for these defeatist types.</p>
<p>Lawrence B. Crowell</p>
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		<title>By: Chris W.</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41097</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris W.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 02:22:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41097</guid>
		<description>You need theory to decide what data to collect, and why. A parallel exists in medicine, where the uncritical worship of voluminous data and cool data visualization &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/29/business/29scan.html?_r=1&amp;oref=slogin&amp;ref=health&amp;pagewanted=all&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;makes a lot of money&lt;/a&gt; for manufacturers of CT, MRI, and PET machines. With CT, the tradeoffs involve radiation exposure risk as well as money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You need theory to decide what data to collect, and why. A parallel exists in medicine, where the uncritical worship of voluminous data and cool data visualization <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/29/business/29scan.html?_r=1&amp;oref=slogin&amp;ref=health&amp;pagewanted=all" rel="nofollow">makes a lot of money</a> for manufacturers of CT, MRI, and PET machines. With CT, the tradeoffs involve radiation exposure risk as well as money.</p>
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		<title>By: John Merryman</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41103</link>
		<dc:creator>John Merryman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 01:46:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41103</guid>
		<description>Data is bottom up. Theory is top down. They do have to meet somewhere. If the theory can expand to accommodate the data, it&#039;s good. If it can&#039;t, it needs replacing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Data is bottom up. Theory is top down. They do have to meet somewhere. If the theory can expand to accommodate the data, it&#8217;s good. If it can&#8217;t, it needs replacing.</p>
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		<title>By: Sandy</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41102</link>
		<dc:creator>Sandy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 01:46:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41102</guid>
		<description>If you are data-mining you should remove the narrative (for reasons stated above) so he has that exactly right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you are data-mining you should remove the narrative (for reasons stated above) so he has that exactly right.</p>
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		<title>By: Sandy</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41104</link>
		<dc:creator>Sandy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 01:19:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41104</guid>
		<description>Is he saying the narrative should be removed? But that is exactly what the scientific method tries to do. By creating theory first and then collecting data you are removing the narrative that humans are so good at creating when they collect data first and then fit a theory. We can make up a story to explain any data set or correlation after the fact. I do find the idea of looking at data for patterns without preconceived ideas interesting, but I&#039;m sure that along with some potentially meaningful correlations you will also find...wait, is that a face?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is he saying the narrative should be removed? But that is exactly what the scientific method tries to do. By creating theory first and then collecting data you are removing the narrative that humans are so good at creating when they collect data first and then fit a theory. We can make up a story to explain any data set or correlation after the fact. I do find the idea of looking at data for patterns without preconceived ideas interesting, but I&#8217;m sure that along with some potentially meaningful correlations you will also find&#8230;wait, is that a face?</p>
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		<title>By: Jim_Harrison</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41109</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim_Harrison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 00:18:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41109</guid>
		<description>I get the distinct impression, which could certainly be wrong, that the biologists are getting a bit disillusioned with brute force methods. It&#039;s not that they think that reading entire genomes is valueless, but they had expected some brighter light to dawn as a result of all the mountains of data.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I get the distinct impression, which could certainly be wrong, that the biologists are getting a bit disillusioned with brute force methods. It&#8217;s not that they think that reading entire genomes is valueless, but they had expected some brighter light to dawn as a result of all the mountains of data.</p>
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		<title>By: Ugly Pretentious Mind</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41110</link>
		<dc:creator>Ugly Pretentious Mind</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 23:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41110</guid>
		<description>The real danger of too much data is that people have more information about the limits of a person&#039;s ability to think rationally</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The real danger of too much data is that people have more information about the limits of a person&#8217;s ability to think rationally</p>
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		<title>By: Clark</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41117</link>
		<dc:creator>Clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 21:11:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41117</guid>
		<description>I sometimes wonder if data overload won&#039;t be a benefit.  Most of the data isn&#039;t that crucial.

Having said that I remember back in the 90&#039;s when everyone was worried about losing data on old formats (paper tape, old styled magnetic media etc.)  I believe they tried to update a lot of it onto backed up hard drives but a lot of astronomical data was lost.

That was very sad since we lost the ability to do studies over time by looking at various datasets with time.

However there is a lot of stuff that has been kept.

The benefit of losing data though is that it forces people to adopt a skepticism and reconduct tests.  That&#039;s not necessarily a bad thing.  Often in conducting a test you can find new errors or learn new skills.  It gives grad students something to do too.

But let&#039;s be honest, how much of the data from most studies from say the 1860&#039;s through the 1980&#039;s was kept?  It&#039;s not like this is a new problem.

The problem is that now we conduct tests with so much resolution of data - much of it redundant - and we don&#039;t know what to do with it all.  Surely a lot of the data could be thrown out.

I can&#039;t understand though claiming this would affect the scientific method.  If anything it&#039;d accelerate it since theories are easier to store than tons of raw data.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I sometimes wonder if data overload won&#8217;t be a benefit.  Most of the data isn&#8217;t that crucial.</p>
<p>Having said that I remember back in the 90&#8242;s when everyone was worried about losing data on old formats (paper tape, old styled magnetic media etc.)  I believe they tried to update a lot of it onto backed up hard drives but a lot of astronomical data was lost.</p>
<p>That was very sad since we lost the ability to do studies over time by looking at various datasets with time.</p>
<p>However there is a lot of stuff that has been kept.</p>
<p>The benefit of losing data though is that it forces people to adopt a skepticism and reconduct tests.  That&#8217;s not necessarily a bad thing.  Often in conducting a test you can find new errors or learn new skills.  It gives grad students something to do too.</p>
<p>But let&#8217;s be honest, how much of the data from most studies from say the 1860&#8242;s through the 1980&#8242;s was kept?  It&#8217;s not like this is a new problem.</p>
<p>The problem is that now we conduct tests with so much resolution of data &#8211; much of it redundant &#8211; and we don&#8217;t know what to do with it all.  Surely a lot of the data could be thrown out.</p>
<p>I can&#8217;t understand though claiming this would affect the scientific method.  If anything it&#8217;d accelerate it since theories are easier to store than tons of raw data.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Erwin</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-41116</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Erwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 19:17:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/07/01/what-good-is-a-theory/#comment-41116</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://cscs.umich.edu/~crshalizi/weblog/581.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Cosma Shalizi&lt;/a&gt; and &lt;a href=&quot;http://earningmyturns.blogspot.com/2008/06/end-of-theory-data-deluge-makes.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Fernando Pereira&lt;/a&gt;, both of whom teach courses and do research on this sort of analysis, are not exactly impressed with Anderson&#039;s arguments.

Quoth Pereira:
&lt;blockquote&gt;Where does Anderson think those statistical algorithms come from? Without constraints in the underlying statistical models, those &quot;patterns&quot; would be mere coincidences. Those computational biology methods Anderson gushes over all depend on statistical models of the genome and of evolutionary relationships. ... without well-chosen constraints &#8212; from scientific theories &#8212; all that number crunching will just memorize the experimental data.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://cscs.umich.edu/~crshalizi/weblog/581.html" rel="nofollow">Cosma Shalizi</a> and <a href="http://earningmyturns.blogspot.com/2008/06/end-of-theory-data-deluge-makes.html" rel="nofollow">Fernando Pereira</a>, both of whom teach courses and do research on this sort of analysis, are not exactly impressed with Anderson&#8217;s arguments.</p>
<p>Quoth Pereira:</p>
<blockquote><p>Where does Anderson think those statistical algorithms come from? Without constraints in the underlying statistical models, those &#8220;patterns&#8221; would be mere coincidences. Those computational biology methods Anderson gushes over all depend on statistical models of the genome and of evolutionary relationships. &#8230; without well-chosen constraints &mdash; from scientific theories &mdash; all that number crunching will just memorize the experimental data.</p></blockquote>
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