<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Broken Symmetries, Mixing Flavors</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/</link>
	<description>Random samplings from a universe of ideas.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 20:52:01 -0600</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Mary</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-64534</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 16:41:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-64534</guid>
		<description>Agree with Manny above.  PH and EB solved half of the problem – namely massifying the gauge particle. GHK solved an entire problem – massifying and also showing how the deadening hand of the Goldstone theorem is avoided.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agree with Manny above.  PH and EB solved half of the problem – namely massifying the gauge particle. GHK solved an entire problem – massifying and also showing how the deadening hand of the Goldstone theorem is avoided.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Manny</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-50591</link>
		<dc:creator>Manny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 17:55:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-50591</guid>
		<description>If the award goes to Higgs and leaves out any of the other five (Brout, Englert, Hagen, Guralnik, Kibble) this year&#039;s controversy will seem minor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the award goes to Higgs and leaves out any of the other five (Brout, Englert, Hagen, Guralnik, Kibble) this year&#8217;s controversy will seem minor.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Manny</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-50588</link>
		<dc:creator>Manny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 17:53:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-50588</guid>
		<description>This is why the Higgs, Brout, and Englerts of the world are tying to ignore the GHK team that was first on the mass boson discovery and had the most complete solution.  Pretending this GHK team does not exist is the best way to make the Nobel math of 3 work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is why the Higgs, Brout, and Englerts of the world are tying to ignore the GHK team that was first on the mass boson discovery and had the most complete solution.  Pretending this GHK team does not exist is the best way to make the Nobel math of 3 work.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Peter Coles</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-44163</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Coles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Oct 2008 07:44:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-44163</guid>
		<description>The rule about numbers of winners being limited to three seems to me to be a red herring. At least in the case of the Peace Prize, the &quot;Panel for Climate Change&quot; was awarded a share, and that&#039;s a lot more than 3 people.

In any case I think they could have given Nambu &amp; Goldstone the prize one year, and Cabibbo Kobayashi and Maskawa another. I don&#039;t see the rush, and it would have avoided them having to split hairs about precisely what the prize was for when all these ideas are so closely connected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The rule about numbers of winners being limited to three seems to me to be a red herring. At least in the case of the Peace Prize, the &#8220;Panel for Climate Change&#8221; was awarded a share, and that&#8217;s a lot more than 3 people.</p>
<p>In any case I think they could have given Nambu &amp; Goldstone the prize one year, and Cabibbo Kobayashi and Maskawa another. I don&#8217;t see the rush, and it would have avoided them having to split hairs about precisely what the prize was for when all these ideas are so closely connected.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nick</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-44162</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 19:11:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-44162</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t necessarily think that they&#039;re &quot;&lt;em&gt;...judging twenty-first century science with a nineteenth century eye.&lt;/em&gt;&quot; The Nobel committee probably looks at it like this: any significant increase in the amount of nobel winners is a &quot;cheapening&quot; of their brand. Nobel winners are considered impressive &lt;em&gt;because&lt;/em&gt; they&#039;re rare. There&#039;s something to be said about the kind of cult-like following that the prizes have and it&#039;s natural for them to want to maintain that.

I can&#039;t speak about their choice of splits this year since I&#039;m not on the committee but I do think it&#039;s strange to break up a group of people who made a discovery if they want to fit two accomplishments into one nobel. It sure does &lt;em&gt;sound&lt;/em&gt; like they have more people than nobels recently. Maybe their standards for prizes have lessened over the years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t necessarily think that they&#8217;re &#8220;<em>&#8230;judging twenty-first century science with a nineteenth century eye.</em>&#8221; The Nobel committee probably looks at it like this: any significant increase in the amount of nobel winners is a &#8220;cheapening&#8221; of their brand. Nobel winners are considered impressive <em>because</em> they&#8217;re rare. There&#8217;s something to be said about the kind of cult-like following that the prizes have and it&#8217;s natural for them to want to maintain that.</p>
<p>I can&#8217;t speak about their choice of splits this year since I&#8217;m not on the committee but I do think it&#8217;s strange to break up a group of people who made a discovery if they want to fit two accomplishments into one nobel. It sure does <em>sound</em> like they have more people than nobels recently. Maybe their standards for prizes have lessened over the years.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: viggen</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-44161</link>
		<dc:creator>viggen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 15:30:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-44161</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;the Nobel charter places a strict limit...&lt;/blockquote&gt;

This seems like an anachronism that should be changed; in this day and age, the number of people involved in individual innovations and lines of research, like the LHC, has become extremely large. Correct me if I&#039;m wrong, but if the Higgs Boson is found, won&#039;t it be by a good-sized team of people? That discovery will be a Nobel, just like the Bose-Einstein condensate. As such, if the prize only goes to the supervisor and the one or two people who just happened to be processing the right dataset, it is a jip for everyone else on the project who absorbed all the inevitable not-right datasets. At that point, the reward isn&#039;t about skill and innovation; it&#039;s just a lottery.

I think the Nobel committee is dangerously close to judging twenty-first century science with a nineteenth century eye.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>the Nobel charter places a strict limit&#8230;</p></blockquote>
<p>This seems like an anachronism that should be changed; in this day and age, the number of people involved in individual innovations and lines of research, like the LHC, has become extremely large. Correct me if I&#8217;m wrong, but if the Higgs Boson is found, won&#8217;t it be by a good-sized team of people? That discovery will be a Nobel, just like the Bose-Einstein condensate. As such, if the prize only goes to the supervisor and the one or two people who just happened to be processing the right dataset, it is a jip for everyone else on the project who absorbed all the inevitable not-right datasets. At that point, the reward isn&#8217;t about skill and innovation; it&#8217;s just a lottery.</p>
<p>I think the Nobel committee is dangerously close to judging twenty-first century science with a nineteenth century eye.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: ST</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-44156</link>
		<dc:creator>ST</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 13:52:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-44156</guid>
		<description>&quot;If you read the citations and background material carefully,... &quot;

I think the point being made is that such careful reading should not be necessary when picking the Nobel winners vs. the ones left out. But this is obviously hard (impossible?) in the modern age when lots of people come up with bits and pieces of an idea simultaneously.

&quot;What is most amazing is that all this was done in the context of dynamical spontaneous symmetry breaking [ie. the effective quasiparticles are dynamically generated composites, not toy scalar fields inserted by hand, as in all the other contemporary work].&quot;

Wow, that is indeed quite remarkable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If you read the citations and background material carefully,&#8230; &#8221;</p>
<p>I think the point being made is that such careful reading should not be necessary when picking the Nobel winners vs. the ones left out. But this is obviously hard (impossible?) in the modern age when lots of people come up with bits and pieces of an idea simultaneously.</p>
<p>&#8220;What is most amazing is that all this was done in the context of dynamical spontaneous symmetry breaking [ie. the effective quasiparticles are dynamically generated composites, not toy scalar fields inserted by hand, as in all the other contemporary work].&#8221;</p>
<p>Wow, that is indeed quite remarkable.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Thor</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-44155</link>
		<dc:creator>Thor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 13:51:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-44155</guid>
		<description>Awwww, not again. There&#039;s a similar controversy with the prize for Medicine this year.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/10/07/healthscience/07nobel.php

They should start awarding the prize to a larger group of people: why not 20 or even 50? Its not like the general public is going to remember the names of these scientists after a few years, but it would be extremely encouraging for the scientists concerned.

There are plenty of scientists doing really good work. And they should start awarding the prize to the &#039;Team(s) led by Dr. ... &#039;. Seems really unfair to be categorized in the also-ran group. Team members may not get a big share of the prize money, but maybe a medal or a note - they could always say that they were a member of &#039;The team led by ... that was awarded the Prize&#039;.

Just a thought. In the age of cloud computing, swarm robotics, particle-wave dualities - at least when these concepts are becoming common knowledge, a system that awards prizes to individuals seems archaic - then again, these brilliant minds ARE reaaaallly old :) .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Awwww, not again. There&#8217;s a similar controversy with the prize for Medicine this year.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/10/07/healthscience/07nobel.php" rel="nofollow">http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/10/07/healthscience/07nobel.php</a></p>
<p>They should start awarding the prize to a larger group of people: why not 20 or even 50? Its not like the general public is going to remember the names of these scientists after a few years, but it would be extremely encouraging for the scientists concerned.</p>
<p>There are plenty of scientists doing really good work. And they should start awarding the prize to the &#8216;Team(s) led by Dr. &#8230; &#8216;. Seems really unfair to be categorized in the also-ran group. Team members may not get a big share of the prize money, but maybe a medal or a note &#8211; they could always say that they were a member of &#8216;The team led by &#8230; that was awarded the Prize&#8217;.</p>
<p>Just a thought. In the age of cloud computing, swarm robotics, particle-wave dualities &#8211; at least when these concepts are becoming common knowledge, a system that awards prizes to individuals seems archaic &#8211; then again, these brilliant minds ARE reaaaallly old <img src='http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  .</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: none of the above</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-44160</link>
		<dc:creator>none of the above</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 13:42:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-44160</guid>
		<description>&quot;Nambu’s Prize could easily have been shared with Jeffrey Goldstone, another pioneer of spontaneous symmetry breaking.&quot;

If you read the citations and background material carefully, you will note that Nambu is being awarded the Nobel prize for &quot;spontaneous symmetry breaking&quot; in both the ungauged case [&quot;Nambu-Goldstone symmetry realization&quot;],  and the gauged case [the &quot;Higgs&quot; mechanism], both of which he worked out and published in 1960-61 [actually he did them in reversed order; first he wrote BCS superconductivity as a non-relativistic field theory and worked out the gauge invariance of the Meissner effect  = &quot;Higgs Mechanism&quot; [work redone in the relativistic case by Anderson, Higgs, Brout-Englert, and Guralnick-Hagen-Kibble]. Then he wrote relativistic effective theories [with Jona-Lasinio] and worked out the effects of spontaneous symmetry breaking in the ungauged case, with the resulting massless quasi-particles [Nambu-Goldstone bosons], and in particular with Lurie worked out the low-energy theorems for soft N-G Boson emission, which were the first examples of the &quot;soft pion emission&quot; theorems which are the content of chiral dynamics. What is most amazing is that all this was done in the context of dynamical spontaneous symmetry breaking [ie. the effective quasiparticles are dynamically generated composites, not toy scalar fields inserted by hand, as in all the other contemporary work].  I&#039;m amazed the he could understand the underlying symmetry arguments in such a full dynamical context; his depth of physical insight is  truly extraordinary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Nambu’s Prize could easily have been shared with Jeffrey Goldstone, another pioneer of spontaneous symmetry breaking.&#8221;</p>
<p>If you read the citations and background material carefully, you will note that Nambu is being awarded the Nobel prize for &#8220;spontaneous symmetry breaking&#8221; in both the ungauged case ["Nambu-Goldstone symmetry realization"],  and the gauged case [the "Higgs" mechanism], both of which he worked out and published in 1960-61 [actually he did them in reversed order; first he wrote BCS superconductivity as a non-relativistic field theory and worked out the gauge invariance of the Meissner effect  = "Higgs Mechanism" [work redone in the relativistic case by Anderson, Higgs, Brout-Englert, and Guralnick-Hagen-Kibble]. Then he wrote relativistic effective theories [with Jona-Lasinio] and worked out the effects of spontaneous symmetry breaking in the ungauged case, with the resulting massless quasi-particles [Nambu-Goldstone bosons], and in particular with Lurie worked out the low-energy theorems for soft N-G Boson emission, which were the first examples of the &#8220;soft pion emission&#8221; theorems which are the content of chiral dynamics. What is most amazing is that all this was done in the context of dynamical spontaneous symmetry breaking [ie. the effective quasiparticles are dynamically generated composites, not toy scalar fields inserted by hand, as in all the other contemporary work].  I&#8217;m amazed the he could understand the underlying symmetry arguments in such a full dynamical context; his depth of physical insight is  truly extraordinary.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andy Wood</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/comment-page-1/#comment-44154</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Wood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 09:07:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2008/10/07/broken-symmetries-mixing-flavors/#comment-44154</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;...the Nobel charter places a strict limit of three Laureates per Prize...&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Is this why Freeman Dyson missed out on a share of the prize that was awarded for QED?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>&#8230;the Nobel charter places a strict limit of three Laureates per Prize&#8230;</p></blockquote>
<p>Is this why Freeman Dyson missed out on a share of the prize that was awarded for QED?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
