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	<title>Comments on: Why Don&#8217;t We Know When the LHC Will Restart?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/</link>
	<description>Random samplings from a universe of ideas.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 13 Feb 2012 22:54:56 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: steeleweed</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-93506</link>
		<dc:creator>steeleweed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Sep 2009 16:42:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-93506</guid>
		<description>Actually The Internet is not all that complicated.   It has comparatively few types of components - it just has a lot of each type.   A gallon of water isn&#039;t complicated just because it has a lot of molecules.   
 
  A linotype (for those of us old enough to remember) was complicated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually The Internet is not all that complicated.   It has comparatively few types of components &#8211; it just has a lot of each type.   A gallon of water isn&#8217;t complicated just because it has a lot of molecules.   </p>
<p>  A linotype (for those of us old enough to remember) was complicated.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-92973</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 00:57:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-92973</guid>
		<description>If you have two cooling towers, they both need to be cleaned. That was just an example to put in a press release, obviously they have already thought of it, and the schedule reflects it. But it is meant to show how hard it is to include every possible contingency, and have a perfect schedule.

As for the question of why build it now, why not wait... there is another issue, people. If there are no new accelerators or particle experiments for too long, there will be no new grad students, no new postdocs, no new professors, and the knowledge and abilities will evaporate. The US space program, and nuclear weapons programs, are facing the same problem, unless they keep active development going, the talent and abilities get lost.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you have two cooling towers, they both need to be cleaned. That was just an example to put in a press release, obviously they have already thought of it, and the schedule reflects it. But it is meant to show how hard it is to include every possible contingency, and have a perfect schedule.</p>
<p>As for the question of why build it now, why not wait&#8230; there is another issue, people. If there are no new accelerators or particle experiments for too long, there will be no new grad students, no new postdocs, no new professors, and the knowledge and abilities will evaporate. The US space program, and nuclear weapons programs, are facing the same problem, unless they keep active development going, the talent and abilities get lost.</p>
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		<title>By: Sili</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-92716</link>
		<dc:creator>Sili</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Aug 2009 13:28:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-92716</guid>
		<description>How expensive can a cooling tower be?! Why not have a spare so that they can swap back and forth?

Sheeesh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How expensive can a cooling tower be?! Why not have a spare so that they can swap back and forth?</p>
<p>Sheeesh.</p>
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		<title>By: AdamDodson.org &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Link Digest for August 27th</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-92235</link>
		<dc:creator>AdamDodson.org &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Link Digest for August 27th</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 04:08:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-92235</guid>
		<description>[...] Shared Why Don’t We Know When the LHC Will Restart? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Shared Why Don’t We Know When the LHC Will Restart? [...]</p>
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		<title>By: AdamDodson.org &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Link Digest for August 26th</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-92079</link>
		<dc:creator>AdamDodson.org &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Link Digest for August 26th</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Aug 2009 04:02:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-92079</guid>
		<description>[...] Shared Why Don’t We Know When the LHC Will Restart? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Shared Why Don’t We Know When the LHC Will Restart? [...]</p>
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		<title>By: greg</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-92065</link>
		<dc:creator>greg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Aug 2009 00:57:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-92065</guid>
		<description>I would rate the LHC and the space shuttle as fantastic, complicated machines.  As such, instant gratification should not be expected. It takes some effort to get all those ducks in order. Not so sure how &quot;complicated&quot; a machine the internet is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would rate the LHC and the space shuttle as fantastic, complicated machines.  As such, instant gratification should not be expected. It takes some effort to get all those ducks in order. Not so sure how &#8220;complicated&#8221; a machine the internet is.</p>
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		<title>By: Eugene</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-92018</link>
		<dc:creator>Eugene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:41:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-92018</guid>
		<description>I think they should have build the water tanks on the French side of the border.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think they should have build the water tanks on the French side of the border.</p>
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		<title>By: Michel</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-92007</link>
		<dc:creator>Michel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 18:24:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-92007</guid>
		<description>How can a REGULAR thing disrupt a schedule ?? But looking fwd to the work of these fantastic scientists</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How can a REGULAR thing disrupt a schedule ?? But looking fwd to the work of these fantastic scientists</p>
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		<title>By: Brian137</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-91995</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian137</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:50:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-91995</guid>
		<description>I am very excited anticipating various possible discoveries and the exploration of terra incognita.  I feel as if I have been invited to an excellent restaurant, and someone else is paying.  Waiting a few minutes for a table is OK.  I appreciate the LHC team&#039;s deliberate pace, emphasizing caution and thoroughness.  The LHC will be the World&#039;s only circular collider for a long time, so I am planning to savor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am very excited anticipating various possible discoveries and the exploration of terra incognita.  I feel as if I have been invited to an excellent restaurant, and someone else is paying.  Waiting a few minutes for a table is OK.  I appreciate the LHC team&#8217;s deliberate pace, emphasizing caution and thoroughness.  The LHC will be the World&#8217;s only circular collider for a long time, so I am planning to savor.</p>
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		<title>By: mandeep gill</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-91981</link>
		<dc:creator>mandeep gill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 14:26:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-91981</guid>
		<description>Ah -- cold comfort, i get it -- hah!!!!  hoooowheeeee!!!

Sorry, felt compelled to say that. ;-&gt;

To Paul [NB: a cosmologist, but yet HEP-interested, nice to see]:  good points, but remember Paul that the SSC would have been built by 2000 or sooner if physicists had had their way -- and the LHC too.  so yeah, we&#039;re fully constrained by the politics of the world, alas, however badly we want to know something..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah &#8212; cold comfort, i get it &#8212; hah!!!!  hoooowheeeee!!!</p>
<p>Sorry, felt compelled to say that. ;-></p>
<p>To Paul [NB: a cosmologist, but yet HEP-interested, nice to see]:  good points, but remember Paul that the SSC would have been built by 2000 or sooner if physicists had had their way &#8212; and the LHC too.  so yeah, we&#8217;re fully constrained by the politics of the world, alas, however badly we want to know something..</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Ricker</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-91978</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Ricker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 14:10:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-91978</guid>
		<description>&quot;The particles and interactions are going to be the same next year as they were last year. (Or if they’re not, that would be even more interesting.)&quot;

Interesting point.  Of course, when you are proposing to build a thing like the LHC, you need to argue &quot;now is the time to do this thing I want you to spend money on.&quot;  The argument is usually based on the state of our understanding in the field and how results from &quot;this thing&quot; will interact with data from other things that other people are already spending money on.  But the financial crisis of the moment might well provoke the counterargument, &quot;the particles and interactions will be the same in ten years; why do we have to spend money on it now?&quot;  And of course, in ten years the same counterargument will be made.  So how do you make the case to a society that has other priorities that &quot;this thing should be done now and not later&quot; in a way that doesn&#039;t reduce to &quot;we [physicists] can&#039;t contain our curiosity and would really like this to happen ASAP?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The particles and interactions are going to be the same next year as they were last year. (Or if they’re not, that would be even more interesting.)&#8221;</p>
<p>Interesting point.  Of course, when you are proposing to build a thing like the LHC, you need to argue &#8220;now is the time to do this thing I want you to spend money on.&#8221;  The argument is usually based on the state of our understanding in the field and how results from &#8220;this thing&#8221; will interact with data from other things that other people are already spending money on.  But the financial crisis of the moment might well provoke the counterargument, &#8220;the particles and interactions will be the same in ten years; why do we have to spend money on it now?&#8221;  And of course, in ten years the same counterargument will be made.  So how do you make the case to a society that has other priorities that &#8220;this thing should be done now and not later&#8221; in a way that doesn&#8217;t reduce to &#8220;we [physicists] can&#8217;t contain our curiosity and would really like this to happen ASAP?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Fred</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-91976</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 13:58:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-91976</guid>
		<description>...but, but, but-but routine maintenance of cooling towers becomes critical path?  Does this imply that a rusty fan bearing could be a single point of failure and halt operations or worse?  How about adding a spare?

Maybe they are so enamored with the complexity they ignored the boring parts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;but, but, but-but routine maintenance of cooling towers becomes critical path?  Does this imply that a rusty fan bearing could be a single point of failure and halt operations or worse?  How about adding a spare?</p>
<p>Maybe they are so enamored with the complexity they ignored the boring parts.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Murray</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-91946</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Murray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 05:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-91946</guid>
		<description>Second-most complicated.

The most complicated is the internet, if you view it as a single thing. Biggest, too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Second-most complicated.</p>
<p>The most complicated is the internet, if you view it as a single thing. Biggest, too.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-91942</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 03:29:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-91942</guid>
		<description>Hey, Sean, all the *easy* experiments have been done!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, Sean, all the *easy* experiments have been done!</p>
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		<title>By: graviton383</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/comment-page-1/#comment-91940</link>
		<dc:creator>graviton383</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Aug 2009 02:59:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/08/24/why-dont-we-know-when-the-lhc-will-restart/#comment-91940</guid>
		<description>I wish all the accelerator experts at CERN the best of luck!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wish all the accelerator experts at CERN the best of luck!</p>
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