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	<title>Comments on: Admixture between humans and the Others</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/</link>
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		<title>By: Science in the News! 018 &#8211; Naughty with Neanderthals</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21314</link>
		<dc:creator>Science in the News! 018 &#8211; Naughty with Neanderthals</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Apr 2010 20:17:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21314</guid>
		<description>[...] like. For now, I&#8217;m only going to agree with Razib Khan when he says that it indicates that human ancestry is a lot more complicated than we thought not too long ago. That is, if this business [biznass?] with Neanderthals is [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] like. For now, I&#8217;m only going to agree with Razib Khan when he says that it indicates that human ancestry is a lot more complicated than we thought not too long ago. That is, if this business [biznass?] with Neanderthals is [...] </p>
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		<title>By: Neandertal genomics paper coming? &#124; Gene Expression &#124; Discover Magazine</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21313</link>
		<dc:creator>Neandertal genomics paper coming? &#124; Gene Expression &#124; Discover Magazine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Apr 2010 08:23:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21313</guid>
		<description>[...] week I was emphasizing the fact that from Max Planck seemed to really be positive about the University of New Mexico research which indicates that there [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] week I was emphasizing the fact that from Max Planck seemed to really be positive about the University of New Mexico research which indicates that there [...] </p>
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		<title>By: Eric Johnson</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21312</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Apr 2010 16:19:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21312</guid>
		<description>&gt; nicking it from the Neandertal by a bit of cross breeding would have been the easy way to get it – yet they got it the hard way instead, by independent mutation

The hard way might not have been so hard, though. I think at least some of the MCR1 alleles involved in this are total loss of function alleles. In general for any gene, there are a vast number of different possible mutations that will yield total loss of function, therefore such mutations are pretty abundant. There are countless different changes you can make in any machine that will completely stop the machine from working.

If you want something more precise, like you want MCR1 to change so that it functions precisely 34-38% as intensely, or has its expression go up exactly 2.1 to 2.2-fold after exposure to X amount of radiation in Y wavelength band, there will be only a few possible mutations that can do this. And you would probably have to wait around for quite a while, many generations, if you wanted them to crop up in your own (euro-sapiens) population. That&#039;s the kind of allele that&#039;d be more likely to be nicked from neanderthals (or from erectus if you are an early sapiens in Asia, etc).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt; nicking it from the Neandertal by a bit of cross breeding would have been the easy way to get it – yet they got it the hard way instead, by independent mutation</p>
<p>The hard way might not have been so hard, though. I think at least some of the MCR1 alleles involved in this are total loss of function alleles. In general for any gene, there are a vast number of different possible mutations that will yield total loss of function, therefore such mutations are pretty abundant. There are countless different changes you can make in any machine that will completely stop the machine from working.</p>
<p>If you want something more precise, like you want MCR1 to change so that it functions precisely 34-38% as intensely, or has its expression go up exactly 2.1 to 2.2-fold after exposure to X amount of radiation in Y wavelength band, there will be only a few possible mutations that can do this. And you would probably have to wait around for quite a while, many generations, if you wanted them to crop up in your own (euro-sapiens) population. That&#8217;s the kind of allele that&#8217;d be more likely to be nicked from neanderthals (or from erectus if you are an early sapiens in Asia, etc).</p>
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		<title>By: coryy</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21311</link>
		<dc:creator>coryy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Apr 2010 10:35:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21311</guid>
		<description>Great link, Meng. Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great link, Meng. Thanks!</p>
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		<title>By: MW</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21310</link>
		<dc:creator>MW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Apr 2010 06:02:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21310</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve been looking papers about at whether H. sapiens and H. neanderthalensis interbred recently, just out of interest.

There&#039;s a pop-sci article about Neandertal genetic sequencing in Science vol 323 pg 866 (13 Feb 2009.)
A review showing no evidence of introgression: Hodgson &amp; Disotell, Genome Biology, 9, 206 (2008) http://genomebiology.com/2008/9/2/206

(This covers the &#039;Ron Weasley&#039; question: a Neandertal gene for skin/hair colour has been sequenced and translated into protein, and shown to have similar effect to a modern European light skin/blond-red hair gene. Therefore we have evidence Neandertal were pale and blond/red haired. But interestingly, the mutation from the ancestoral form to achieve this in Neandertal is different from the mutation in Europeans. When the (presumably dark) H. sapiens migrated to Europe, they needed such a gene, and nicking it from the Neandertal by a bit of cross breeding would have been the easy way to get it - yet they got it the hard way instead, by independent mutation.)

One of the &#039;3 years ago&#039; papers mentioned above, showing evidence of introgression in the microcephalin gene:
Evans et al, PNAS 103 18178 (2006).

My, that&#039;s a cute Neandertal in the Nature news story illustration.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been looking papers about at whether H. sapiens and H. neanderthalensis interbred recently, just out of interest.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s a pop-sci article about Neandertal genetic sequencing in Science vol 323 pg 866 (13 Feb 2009.)<br />
A review showing no evidence of introgression: Hodgson &amp; Disotell, Genome Biology, 9, 206 (2008) <a href="http://genomebiology.com/2008/9/2/206" rel="nofollow">http://genomebiology.com/2008/9/2/206</a></p>
<p>(This covers the &#8216;Ron Weasley&#8217; question: a Neandertal gene for skin/hair colour has been sequenced and translated into protein, and shown to have similar effect to a modern European light skin/blond-red hair gene. Therefore we have evidence Neandertal were pale and blond/red haired. But interestingly, the mutation from the ancestoral form to achieve this in Neandertal is different from the mutation in Europeans. When the (presumably dark) H. sapiens migrated to Europe, they needed such a gene, and nicking it from the Neandertal by a bit of cross breeding would have been the easy way to get it &#8211; yet they got it the hard way instead, by independent mutation.)</p>
<p>One of the &#8217;3 years ago&#8217; papers mentioned above, showing evidence of introgression in the microcephalin gene:<br />
Evans et al, PNAS 103 18178 (2006).</p>
<p>My, that&#8217;s a cute Neandertal in the Nature news story illustration.</p>
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		<title>By: Meng Bomin</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21309</link>
		<dc:creator>Meng Bomin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Apr 2010 05:27:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21309</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;But why Ron Weasley?&lt;/i&gt;
Probably the red hair.  It&#039;s a feature that Rupert Grint and I share with Neandertals, though if I remember correctly, the Neandertal mutation that led researchers to believe that some had red hair was different than the one that gives modern humans like Rupert and I red hair.

EDIT: &lt;a href=&quot;http://johnhawks.net/weblog/reviews/neandertals/neandertal_dna/neandertal_mc1r_lalueza-fox_2007.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Here&lt;/a&gt; is the relevant John Hawks post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>But why Ron Weasley?</i><br />
Probably the red hair.  It&#8217;s a feature that Rupert Grint and I share with Neandertals, though if I remember correctly, the Neandertal mutation that led researchers to believe that some had red hair was different than the one that gives modern humans like Rupert and I red hair.</p>
<p>EDIT: <a href="http://johnhawks.net/weblog/reviews/neandertals/neandertal_dna/neandertal_mc1r_lalueza-fox_2007.html" rel="nofollow">Here</a> is the relevant John Hawks post.</p>
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		<title>By: Billare</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21308</link>
		<dc:creator>Billare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Apr 2010 00:39:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21308</guid>
		<description>That Neanderthal has some distinctly feline facial features...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That Neanderthal has some distinctly feline facial features&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Katharine</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21307</link>
		<dc:creator>Katharine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 21:09:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21307</guid>
		<description>Well, Neanderthals are a different subspecies .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, Neanderthals are a different subspecies .</p>
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		<title>By: bioIgnoramus</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21306</link>
		<dc:creator>bioIgnoramus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 14:52:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21306</guid>
		<description>Pinkyphobe!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pinkyphobe!</p>
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		<title>By: dave chamberlin</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21305</link>
		<dc:creator>dave chamberlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 14:12:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21305</guid>
		<description>I wish and I hope that the pristine and undisturbed limestone caves from around the world have hundreds more pinky bones and molars of ancient peoples, and that the genetic analysis of these tiny fragments continues on it&#039;s expotential growth curve. As of now southest asia is one big blank spot, stay tuned folks because I don&#039;t believe it is going to stay that way. At last count 202 of 206 indentified neanderthal fragments have been discovered in limestone caves. Fact of the matter is except in rare circumstances bones turn to dust and stone tools suck. The experts in human evolution have always overstated their case in response to creationists and simply because they have to in order to make a living at what they love.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wish and I hope that the pristine and undisturbed limestone caves from around the world have hundreds more pinky bones and molars of ancient peoples, and that the genetic analysis of these tiny fragments continues on it&#8217;s expotential growth curve. As of now southest asia is one big blank spot, stay tuned folks because I don&#8217;t believe it is going to stay that way. At last count 202 of 206 indentified neanderthal fragments have been discovered in limestone caves. Fact of the matter is except in rare circumstances bones turn to dust and stone tools suck. The experts in human evolution have always overstated their case in response to creationists and simply because they have to in order to make a living at what they love.</p>
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		<title>By: J.J.E.</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21304</link>
		<dc:creator>J.J.E.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 11:50:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21304</guid>
		<description>Is the timing and/or location of the MRCA between humans and neanderthals preceding any putative admixture known?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is the timing and/or location of the MRCA between humans and neanderthals preceding any putative admixture known?</p>
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		<title>By: coryy</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21303</link>
		<dc:creator>coryy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 10:47:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21303</guid>
		<description>Okay. Very interesting. But why Ron Weasley?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay. Very interesting. But why Ron Weasley?</p>
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		<title>By: dearieme</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/04/admixture-between-humans-and-the-others/#comment-21302</link>
		<dc:creator>dearieme</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 09:39:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=3742#comment-21302</guid>
		<description>If I&#039;m part Neanderthal, can I claim my ancestral bit of Germany, please?  Or Spain.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If I&#8217;m part Neanderthal, can I claim my ancestral bit of Germany, please?  Or Spain.</p>
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