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	<title>Comments on: The blood of kings</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/10/the-blood-of-kings/</link>
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		<title>By: Links: 10.18.10 &#171; The Ancestral Archaeologist</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/10/the-blood-of-kings/#comment-26862</link>
		<dc:creator>Links: 10.18.10 &#171; The Ancestral Archaeologist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Oct 2010 13:35:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=7108#comment-26862</guid>
		<description>[...] many presidents you&#8217;re related to. But the Discover magazine blog took an interesting tack on what elite DNA can tell us , since it often involves subtypes that are rare or previously [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] many presidents you&#8217;re related to. But the Discover magazine blog took an interesting tack on what elite DNA can tell us , since it often involves subtypes that are rare or previously [...] </p>
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		<title>By: Linkage is Good for You: Return to Normalcy Edition</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/10/the-blood-of-kings/#comment-26861</link>
		<dc:creator>Linkage is Good for You: Return to Normalcy Edition</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Oct 2010 20:37:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=7108#comment-26861</guid>
		<description>[...] Khan &#8211; &#8220;The Blood of Kings&#8220;, &#8220;The Rise and Crash of Civilizations&#8220;, &#8220;Female Race Consciousness as [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Khan &#8211; &#8220;The Blood of Kings&#8220;, &#8220;The Rise and Crash of Civilizations&#8220;, &#8220;Female Race Consciousness as [...] </p>
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		<title>By: carpetanuiq</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/10/the-blood-of-kings/#comment-26860</link>
		<dc:creator>carpetanuiq</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Oct 2010 17:56:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=7108#comment-26860</guid>
		<description>1.
&quot;The farthest ancestor I can find on Louis XVI’s matriline is Louise de Mareuil de Villebois &quot;.

Pls check Dienekes´s thread on the same issue ( http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2010/10/y-chromosome-and-mtdna-of-louis-xvi-of.html ). I´ve found and show there convincing evidence of 3 more back steps in his maternal ancestry tree to a Claire de Brisehoule.
From Louise de Mareuil to Claire most matrilineal ancestry is from Normandy.

2.&quot;Because of social (primogeniture) and economic (Malthusian era growth rates) pressures many of these offsprings of elites would descend down the ladder of status&quot;.

I do not think that was the case. Hochadel, High Nobility in general was almost a caste. Until recent times (XX century) every offspring, even bastards, were kept under control: first sons got all the property and married within the &quot;caste&quot;, second sons and others if lucky could marry a rich bride and stay within the &quot;caste&quot;, if not they were deviated to war (where they died young or if succesfull earned enough money or prestige so as to stay within the &quot;caste&quot;), or high church positions. You can study any of the High Nobility lineages and you will find the same pattern everywhere.

On the other hand i agree totaly with your suggestion:

&quot;A better map of the genes of the European nobility, their patterns of relationship, as well as extractions from tombs and mausoleums, would give us a very fine-grained understanding of the demographic parameters of this population. Though I’m not sure that some of the European nobility would be totally open to finding out the facts, as opposed to the myths&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>1.<br />
&#8220;The farthest ancestor I can find on Louis XVI’s matriline is Louise de Mareuil de Villebois &#8220;.</p>
<p>Pls check Dienekes´s thread on the same issue ( <a href="http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2010/10/y-chromosome-and-mtdna-of-louis-xvi-of.html" rel="nofollow">http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2010/10/y-chromosome-and-mtdna-of-louis-xvi-of.html</a> ). I´ve found and show there convincing evidence of 3 more back steps in his maternal ancestry tree to a Claire de Brisehoule.<br />
From Louise de Mareuil to Claire most matrilineal ancestry is from Normandy.</p>
<p>2.&#8221;Because of social (primogeniture) and economic (Malthusian era growth rates) pressures many of these offsprings of elites would descend down the ladder of status&#8221;.</p>
<p>I do not think that was the case. Hochadel, High Nobility in general was almost a caste. Until recent times (XX century) every offspring, even bastards, were kept under control: first sons got all the property and married within the &#8220;caste&#8221;, second sons and others if lucky could marry a rich bride and stay within the &#8220;caste&#8221;, if not they were deviated to war (where they died young or if succesfull earned enough money or prestige so as to stay within the &#8220;caste&#8221;), or high church positions. You can study any of the High Nobility lineages and you will find the same pattern everywhere.</p>
<p>On the other hand i agree totaly with your suggestion:</p>
<p>&#8220;A better map of the genes of the European nobility, their patterns of relationship, as well as extractions from tombs and mausoleums, would give us a very fine-grained understanding of the demographic parameters of this population. Though I’m not sure that some of the European nobility would be totally open to finding out the facts, as opposed to the myths&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Pohranicni Straze</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/10/the-blood-of-kings/#comment-26859</link>
		<dc:creator>Pohranicni Straze</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Oct 2010 23:34:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=7108#comment-26859</guid>
		<description>The farthest ancestor I can find on Louis XVI&#039;s matriline is Louise de Mareuil de Villebois (late 15th century). A descendancy chart can be found at:
http://genealogics.org/descend.php?personID=I00165007&amp;tree=LEO&amp;displayoption=female&amp;generations=6
It looks like there should be any number of minor European nobles with the same matriline, so testing whether this is Louis XVI&#039;s blood should be easy (if, of course, any are willing to consent to solve the mystery).

Assuming it is Louis&#039;s blood, the maternal haplogroup shouldn&#039;t be that much of a surprise- there are known cases of Central Eurasian admixture into the noble houses of Europe. Probably the most notable would be through Elizabeth the Cuman, a Turkic chief&#039;s daughter who married Stephen V of Hungary. Her daughters married into the ruling elite of Serbia, Byzantium, and Naples, and her maternal granddaughters married into the French, Spanish, and Italian elite.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The farthest ancestor I can find on Louis XVI&#8217;s matriline is Louise de Mareuil de Villebois (late 15th century). A descendancy chart can be found at:<br />
<a href="http://genealogics.org/descend.php?personID=I00165007&#038;tree=LEO&#038;displayoption=female&#038;generations=6" rel="nofollow">http://genealogics.org/descend.php?personID=I00165007&#038;tree=LEO&#038;displayoption=female&#038;generations=6</a><br />
It looks like there should be any number of minor European nobles with the same matriline, so testing whether this is Louis XVI&#8217;s blood should be easy (if, of course, any are willing to consent to solve the mystery).</p>
<p>Assuming it is Louis&#8217;s blood, the maternal haplogroup shouldn&#8217;t be that much of a surprise- there are known cases of Central Eurasian admixture into the noble houses of Europe. Probably the most notable would be through Elizabeth the Cuman, a Turkic chief&#8217;s daughter who married Stephen V of Hungary. Her daughters married into the ruling elite of Serbia, Byzantium, and Naples, and her maternal granddaughters married into the French, Spanish, and Italian elite.</p>
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		<title>By: Tweets that mention The blood of kings &#124; Gene Expression &#124; Discover Magazine -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2010/10/the-blood-of-kings/#comment-26858</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention The blood of kings &#124; Gene Expression &#124; Discover Magazine -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Oct 2010 22:11:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/?p=7108#comment-26858</guid>
		<description>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Razib Khan and Ron Simon, Jorge San Miguel L.. Jorge San Miguel L. said: RT @razibkhan: The blood of kings http://bit.ly/ajNDE2 Linajes aristocráticos, distinción y fidelidad. [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Razib Khan and Ron Simon, Jorge San Miguel L.. Jorge San Miguel L. said: RT @razibkhan: The blood of kings <a href="http://bit.ly/ajNDE2" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/ajNDE2</a> Linajes aristocráticos, distinción y fidelidad. [...] </p>
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