I understand that you take offense at my use of generalizations. Please note that, despite what you said in your post, I did not say that “every” Christian attends or partakes of a hierarchical organization, and never said that all Christians “do what a congregation leader tells them to do.”

I’d never suggest that believers “believe exactly the same as every other one.” In the first place, it’s clear that Catholics, Lutherans, Anabaptists and Mormons believe in very different things, although they all call themselves Christian. More importantly, I don’t think that anyone has a complete monopoly on independent thinking.

My point was much simpler and much less exciting than you make it out to be. Obviously a lot of Christians belong to groups that generally have leaders. If the leader encourages those in the group to go to or not go to a film, many of the people in the group will do as he or she advises. Why wouldn’t they? They’re all members of a group that share values about the issues that are raised in the film!

If you don’t agree about what I’ve actually said, tell me why my facts are wrong, or why my logic is faulty. I’m always interested in fact-based debate. But just writing something angry, reactive and dishonest is (gasp!) offensive and (swoon!) makes you look like you either don’t understand what I wrote, or that you understand but deliberately choose to be dishonest.

My mind remains unblown.

I understand that you take offense at my use of generalizations. Please note that, despite what you said in your post, I did not say that “every” Christian attends or partakes of a hierarchical organization, and never said that all Christians “do what a congregation leader tells them to do.”

It’s pretty obvious that believers “don’t believe exactly the same as every other one.” In the first place, it’s clear that Catholics, Lutherans, Anabaptists and Mormons believe in very different things, although they all call themselves Christian. More importantly, I don’t think that anyone has a complete monopoly on independent thinking.

My point was much simpler and much less exciting than you make it out to be. Obviously a lot of Christians belong to groups that generally have leaders. If the leader encourages those in the group to go to or not go to a film, many of the people in the group will do as he or she advises. Why wouldn’t they? They’re all members of a group that share values about the issues that are raised in the film!

If you don’t agree about what I’ve actually said, tell me why my facts are wrong, or why my logic is faulty. I’m always interested in fact-based debate. But just writing something angry, reactive and dishonest is (gasp!) offensive and (swoon!) makes you look like you either don’t understand what I wrote, or that you understand but deliberately choose to be dishonest.

My mind remains unblown.

They communicate to a broad audience what could be percieved as “normality”, and while at first some movies are regarded as shocking, insulting or whatever… the fact that such movies are done, widely distributed and inspired upon, change culture, politics and the future.

In my opinion, such entertainement has a much much higher impact on people mindset, than politics or even science.

And as an atheist, I’m very happy to see that sort of mindset having a chance at becoming a part of popular culture.
Though to be frank, I don’t think this movie is a big jump in that regard, many other movies/series( ex. Dr.House) seem to have already started down that road, though maybe in a more subtle manner.

But it does make me very curious and interested!

I guess it’s simply a question of whether or not it’s a good movie.

Atheists Rally Behind New Movie Thriller

Who cares what atheists or theists do in response to a movie? The only thing this article seems to have done is spur another theological debate between the usual opposing sides, each preaching (no pun intended) the same bland “he exists” “it doesn’t exist” argument while pretending they’re saying something profound. Why didn’t you just write an article entitled “The Ledge: One Man’s Film Review” and skip all the stirring the pot shit?

The movie is probably fine – but it’s probably not about atheists vs. theists just because that’s the spin you’ve put on it … I doubt anyone will be rallying behind this film, or finalizing their religious beliefs on it.

I don’t know anything about the general individualistic character of Christians. I do know that Christians tend to belong to hierarchical religious organizations, and to take seriously the recommendations of the leaders of these organizations. In addition, religious believers generally try to promote their religion. I think it’s fair from this to argue that Christians would tend to follow their ministers and peers to see and promote Gibson’s “The Passion”. More to the point, it’s what actually happened.

Atheists tend not to belong to hierarchical atheist groups. Their willingness, even eagerness, to call themselves atheists in a society where atheism is considered immoral and even evil is proof of this sort of independence. Atheists are highly unlikely to belong to a hierarchical group promoting atheism. There aren’t atheist leaders in the sense that there are Christian leaders. There are atheists who write and speak about atheism and against religion, but pleas by these individuals to go see a film are unlikely to have much effect. And so, all other things being equal, a film like “The Passion” has what might be called a grass-roots marketing phenomena that “The Ledge” lacks.

The idea that atheists are more likely to be independent-minded about their lives in general is Chris’ opinion, and one I happen to agree with, but agreement isn’t required to see the logic of what I wrote above.

By the way, I’m not surprised that the atheist hero in the ledge is hipper and more attractive than his adversaries. People like their film heros to be more attractive than those who oppose them.

For the most part, I think that fiction movies designed to promote an agenda tend to be bad movies. If you want proof, sit through the 1949 film, “The Fountainhead”. I might see “The Ledge”, but I’ll probably wait until it’s on Netflix.