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	<title>Comments on: Taking the Plunge</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/</link>
	<description>A blog about life, past and future. Written by DISCOVER contributing editor and columnist Carl Zimmer.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 13 Feb 2012 19:00:24 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Chuck the Lucky</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1264</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck the Lucky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Aug 2006 02:52:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1264</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;&quot;Humans, Aquatic Apes ? Any considered comments ?&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

I have heard the idea that pre-humans lost (some) body hair to become faster swimmers, giving them better ability to exploit shores, rivers, lakes etc. And I think that there are some other arguments offered to support the idea that swimming ability has shaped some aspects of our development.

The only problem is that there are potential other explanations for these traits and even if aquatic resource use did provide a selective pressure on certain traits, it is hard to know how strong that pressure was compared to other traits.

Sloths in the surf, eh? Sounds like a nice lifestyle. I think I saw someone at the YMCA pool that would qualify on the body hair criteria alone. I wonder if these things kept their fur like otters or lost it like other marine mammals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8220;Humans, Aquatic Apes ? Any considered comments ?&#8221;</i></p>
<p>I have heard the idea that pre-humans lost (some) body hair to become faster swimmers, giving them better ability to exploit shores, rivers, lakes etc. And I think that there are some other arguments offered to support the idea that swimming ability has shaped some aspects of our development.</p>
<p>The only problem is that there are potential other explanations for these traits and even if aquatic resource use did provide a selective pressure on certain traits, it is hard to know how strong that pressure was compared to other traits.</p>
<p>Sloths in the surf, eh? Sounds like a nice lifestyle. I think I saw someone at the YMCA pool that would qualify on the body hair criteria alone. I wonder if these things kept their fur like otters or lost it like other marine mammals.</p>
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		<title>By: Ed Snack</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1263</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Snack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Aug 2004 04:45:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1263</guid>
		<description>Humans, Aquatic Apes ? Any considered comments ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Humans, Aquatic Apes ? Any considered comments ?</p>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1262</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2004 17:02:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1262</guid>
		<description>Thanks Carl.  And then some snakes moved back into the ocean (except for laying eggs, I guess).  A triple reversal?  Nature never fails to astound.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Carl.  And then some snakes moved back into the ocean (except for laying eggs, I guess).  A triple reversal?  Nature never fails to astound.</p>
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		<title>By: ~DS~</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1261</link>
		<dc:creator>~DS~</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2004 16:53:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1261</guid>
		<description>heh, Wilkins maybe you should stick to chocolate commentary ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>heh, Wilkins maybe you should stick to chocolate commentary &#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Charith Pelpola</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1260</link>
		<dc:creator>Charith Pelpola</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2004 09:03:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1260</guid>
		<description>An eye-opening article. Would be interesting to hypothesise on the species&#039; abrupt extinction. To add to Mr. Zimmer&#039;s comments about snakes adapting from an aquatic environment to terrestrial; there is a genus of aquatic/semi-aquatic snakes, Homalopsines, in S. E. Asia that have made the transition back to an aquatic existence. The theory again is that they found more favourable food sources in water, and used their aquatic adaption to &#039;island-hop&#039; in the fragmented archipelagos of the region.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An eye-opening article. Would be interesting to hypothesise on the species&#8217; abrupt extinction. To add to Mr. Zimmer&#8217;s comments about snakes adapting from an aquatic environment to terrestrial; there is a genus of aquatic/semi-aquatic snakes, Homalopsines, in S. E. Asia that have made the transition back to an aquatic existence. The theory again is that they found more favourable food sources in water, and used their aquatic adaption to &#8216;island-hop&#8217; in the fragmented archipelagos of the region.</p>
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		<title>By: John Wilkins</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1259</link>
		<dc:creator>John Wilkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2004 01:31:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1259</guid>
		<description>Dutch evolutionism must be where both parties have to pay the costs of adaptation...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dutch evolutionism must be where both parties have to pay the costs of adaptation&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Carl Zimmer</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1258</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl Zimmer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jun 2004 20:03:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1258</guid>
		<description>In response to Brian&#039;s question--the one example I can think of is snakes (maybe)--they descend from fish that came on land, which evolved into reptiles that some paleontologists believe readapted to the water. There they lost their legs and came back on land legless. This is a controversial hypothesis, but some fossils seem to back it up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to Brian&#8217;s question&#8211;the one example I can think of is snakes (maybe)&#8211;they descend from fish that came on land, which evolved into reptiles that some paleontologists believe readapted to the water. There they lost their legs and came back on land legless. This is a controversial hypothesis, but some fossils seem to back it up.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1257</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jun 2004 19:52:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1257</guid>
		<description>Aquatic mammals are an interesting example of evolution reversing a previous &quot;decision&quot; - fish evolved to live on land, and aquatic mammals reversed that ecological &quot;choice&quot;.  Does anyone know of a double-reversal, where an animal (or plant) went aquatic-terrestria-aqautic-terrestrial?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aquatic mammals are an interesting example of evolution reversing a previous &#8220;decision&#8221; &#8211; fish evolved to live on land, and aquatic mammals reversed that ecological &#8220;choice&#8221;.  Does anyone know of a double-reversal, where an animal (or plant) went aquatic-terrestria-aqautic-terrestrial?</p>
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		<title>By: ~DS~</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1256</link>
		<dc:creator>~DS~</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jun 2004 19:33:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1256</guid>
		<description>Ok ... I&#039;ll bite. What is Dutch Evolutionism?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok &#8230; I&#8217;ll bite. What is Dutch Evolutionism?</p>
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		<title>By: tjeerd plantinga</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1255</link>
		<dc:creator>tjeerd plantinga</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jun 2004 09:27:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1255</guid>
		<description>Dear Mr. Zimmer,

A sophisticated and good article.
I&quot;ll read more about this topic.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.talkorigins.org/features/whales/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.talkorigins.org/features/whales/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.talkorigins.org/features/whales/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

Thank you for doing this meaningfull work.  Your support helps Dutch evolutionism.  By the way our evolutionism is not different from yours.

Yours sincerely,

Tjeerd Plantinga</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Mr. Zimmer,</p>
<p>A sophisticated and good article.<br />
I&#8221;ll read more about this topic.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.talkorigins.org/features/whales/" rel="nofollow"></a><a href="http://www.talkorigins.org/features/whales/" rel="nofollow">http://www.talkorigins.org/features/whales/</a></p>
<p>Thank you for doing this meaningfull work.  Your support helps Dutch evolutionism.  By the way our evolutionism is not different from yours.</p>
<p>Yours sincerely,</p>
<p>Tjeerd Plantinga</p>
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		<title>By: Rob Feightner</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1254</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Feightner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jun 2004 01:50:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1254</guid>
		<description>Carl,

I have followed the science press on the wolf- or dog-like predecesors of whales and aquatic mammals to the extent that time permits.

I am often amazed, but should not be, of the arguments creationists and so-called intelligent design propogandists use to promote their positions. The more their mythology is eviserated, the more they fractionate their arguments. (I used this argument in a legal case about 15 years ago. The more our arguments defeated those of opposing counsel, the more they split the legal flagella).

So I offer this mostly unrelated anectdote to give a little back to this informative and intellectually invigorating site.

Rob Feightner, JD, LLM, AAMS
Stock Broker</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carl,</p>
<p>I have followed the science press on the wolf- or dog-like predecesors of whales and aquatic mammals to the extent that time permits.</p>
<p>I am often amazed, but should not be, of the arguments creationists and so-called intelligent design propogandists use to promote their positions. The more their mythology is eviserated, the more they fractionate their arguments. (I used this argument in a legal case about 15 years ago. The more our arguments defeated those of opposing counsel, the more they split the legal flagella).</p>
<p>So I offer this mostly unrelated anectdote to give a little back to this informative and intellectually invigorating site.</p>
<p>Rob Feightner, JD, LLM, AAMS<br />
Stock Broker</p>
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		<title>By: John Wilkins</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/comment-page-1/#comment-1253</link>
		<dc:creator>John Wilkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jun 2004 00:37:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2004/06/21/taking-the-plunge/#comment-1253</guid>
		<description>Carl

Modern sloths can and do swim, hurled or not. The Amazon Basin floods each year and sloths have to swim to get from tree to tree. They aren&#039;t fast, but they can do it. Unfortunately for them, so too do jaguars...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carl</p>
<p>Modern sloths can and do swim, hurled or not. The Amazon Basin floods each year and sloths have to swim to get from tree to tree. They aren&#8217;t fast, but they can do it. Unfortunately for them, so too do jaguars&#8230;</p>
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