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	<title>Comments on: Of Arsenic and Aliens</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/</link>
	<description>A blog about life, past and future. Written by DISCOVER contributing editor and columnist Carl Zimmer.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 26 May 2012 01:25:59 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: #ArsenicLife Compendium &#171; biologicalhominin</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-66299</link>
		<dc:creator>#ArsenicLife Compendium &#171; biologicalhominin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Nov 2011 22:51:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-66299</guid>
		<description>[...] Carl Zimmer. Dec 2 2010. Of arsenic and aliens. The Loom (Discover). http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Carl Zimmer. Dec 2 2010. Of arsenic and aliens. The Loom (Discover). http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/ [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Start 2011 off with some evolution, the Carnival of Evolution! &#171; The Dispersal of Darwin</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-52063</link>
		<dc:creator>Start 2011 off with some evolution, the Carnival of Evolution! &#171; The Dispersal of Darwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Jan 2011 05:00:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-52063</guid>
		<description>[...] When life gives you arsenic, make arsenate-backboned DNA, non-alien Halomonadaceae!; The Loom: Of Arsenic and Aliens &amp; What the critics said; Sandwalk: Arsenic and Bacteria; Byte Size Biology: A new life form? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] When life gives you arsenic, make arsenate-backboned DNA, non-alien Halomonadaceae!; The Loom: Of Arsenic and Aliens &amp; What the critics said; Sandwalk: Arsenic and Bacteria; Byte Size Biology: A new life form? [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Kurt</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50778</link>
		<dc:creator>Kurt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Dec 2010 13:27:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50778</guid>
		<description>Intelligent Bacteria: Cells are Incredibly Smart
　
For years I just sort of assumed that cells were self-reproducing blobs of protein. Maybe you did too. Turns out they’re way smarter than that. You will be amazed at this video. Dr. Bonnie Bassler from Princeton University presents a beautiful TED talk on how bacteria communicate with each other by forming words out of simple molecules.
She also explains…

How bacteria strategize together on how to ‘take down’ their host 
Elegant systems of bioluminescence 
Symbiotic relationships between organisms 
Cells speak multiple languages
Enjoy this remarkable presentation. And a sincere thanks to Patrik Beno for sharing it with me.
Perry Marshall
　
http://www.cosmicfingerprints.com/blog/intelligent-bacteria/


This is really incredible. Where did the proposed bacterial molecular codes come from?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Intelligent Bacteria: Cells are Incredibly Smart<br />
　<br />
For years I just sort of assumed that cells were self-reproducing blobs of protein. Maybe you did too. Turns out they’re way smarter than that. You will be amazed at this video. Dr. Bonnie Bassler from Princeton University presents a beautiful TED talk on how bacteria communicate with each other by forming words out of simple molecules.<br />
She also explains…</p>
<p>How bacteria strategize together on how to ‘take down’ their host<br />
Elegant systems of bioluminescence<br />
Symbiotic relationships between organisms<br />
Cells speak multiple languages<br />
Enjoy this remarkable presentation. And a sincere thanks to Patrik Beno for sharing it with me.<br />
Perry Marshall<br />
　<br />
<a href="http://www.cosmicfingerprints.com/blog/intelligent-bacteria/" rel="nofollow">http://www.cosmicfingerprints.com/blog/intelligent-bacteria/</a></p>
<p>This is really incredible. Where did the proposed bacterial molecular codes come from?</p>
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		<title>By: Arsen oder nicht Arsen, das ist hier die Frage &#171; Aus dem Hollerbusch</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50659</link>
		<dc:creator>Arsen oder nicht Arsen, das ist hier die Frage &#171; Aus dem Hollerbusch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Dec 2010 22:26:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50659</guid>
		<description>[...] versteckt, damit es nicht mehr Schaden anrichtet? Außerdem seien Arsen-basierte Verbindungen in Wasser nicht sehr stabil, wie etwa Steven Benner anführt. Das Team um Wolfe-Simon nimmt daher folgendes an, wie Ars [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] versteckt, damit es nicht mehr Schaden anrichtet? Außerdem seien Arsen-basierte Verbindungen in Wasser nicht sehr stabil, wie etwa Steven Benner anführt. Das Team um Wolfe-Simon nimmt daher folgendes an, wie Ars [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Carlson</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50622</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Carlson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Dec 2010 16:42:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50622</guid>
		<description>for a great read, i recommend &quot;Origins of Life&quot; by Freeman Dyson, 1985 with a 2nd edition in 1999. then there&#039;s James Lovelock&#039;s great treatment in &quot;Ages of Gaia&quot; of the Oklo algal mat in Gabon that evolved its own nuclear reactor. life is OPPORTUNISTIC, and just because it&#039;s harder to use As than P doesn&#039;t make it impossible...call me an As-hole if you want to. i just hope there are bacteria out there that can use selenium instead of sulfur, to clean up all the Bureau of Reclamation&#039;s water projects that have caused so many bird and amphibian deaths and deformities in the Pacific Flyway (yeah, also read &quot;Death in the Marsh&quot; by Tom Harris.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>for a great read, i recommend &#8220;Origins of Life&#8221; by Freeman Dyson, 1985 with a 2nd edition in 1999. then there&#8217;s James Lovelock&#8217;s great treatment in &#8220;Ages of Gaia&#8221; of the Oklo algal mat in Gabon that evolved its own nuclear reactor. life is OPPORTUNISTIC, and just because it&#8217;s harder to use As than P doesn&#8217;t make it impossible&#8230;call me an As-hole if you want to. i just hope there are bacteria out there that can use selenium instead of sulfur, to clean up all the Bureau of Reclamation&#8217;s water projects that have caused so many bird and amphibian deaths and deformities in the Pacific Flyway (yeah, also read &#8220;Death in the Marsh&#8221; by Tom Harris.)</p>
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		<title>By: ET found? - Page 5 - The Liverpool Way</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50541</link>
		<dc:creator>ET found? - Page 5 - The Liverpool Way</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Dec 2010 16:05:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50541</guid>
		<description>[...] by light years. While newspapers ran away with the story, it was left to bloggers like Ed Yong, Carl Zimmer, Lewis Dartnell and Phil Plait to put the story in its proper perspective.  But more importantly it [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] by light years. While newspapers ran away with the story, it was left to bloggers like Ed Yong, Carl Zimmer, Lewis Dartnell and Phil Plait to put the story in its proper perspective.  But more importantly it [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Scientist Smackdown: Experts Challenge Story of Arsenic-Loving Bacteria &#124; JetLib News</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50482</link>
		<dc:creator>Scientist Smackdown: Experts Challenge Story of Arsenic-Loving Bacteria &#124; JetLib News</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Dec 2010 10:04:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50482</guid>
		<description>[...] previous coverage of the Great Arsenic Announcement: The Loom: Of Arsenic And Aliens Bad Astronomy: NASA&#8217;s Real News: Bacteria on Earth That Lives Off Arsenic Bad Astronomy: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] previous coverage of the Great Arsenic Announcement: The Loom: Of Arsenic And Aliens Bad Astronomy: NASA&rsquo;s Real News: Bacteria on Earth That Lives Off Arsenic Bad Astronomy: [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Marfice</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50463</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Marfice</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Dec 2010 05:37:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50463</guid>
		<description>Two editorial notes:

&quot;Benner suggests tiny pores in rocks that would be too big for bacteria.&quot; Don&#039;t you mean, &quot;...too small for bacteria&quot;?

You might want to correct spelling in this sentence: &quot;One possibile alternative is that...&quot;

&lt;strong&gt;[CZ: Thanks, thanks--fixed, fixed]&lt;/strong&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Two editorial notes:</p>
<p>&#8220;Benner suggests tiny pores in rocks that would be too big for bacteria.&#8221; Don&#8217;t you mean, &#8220;&#8230;too small for bacteria&#8221;?</p>
<p>You might want to correct spelling in this sentence: &#8220;One possibile alternative is that&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p><strong>[CZ: Thanks, thanks--fixed, fixed]</strong></p>
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		<title>By: Arsenic Bacteria link-dump &#124; A Blog Around The Clock</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50425</link>
		<dc:creator>Arsenic Bacteria link-dump &#124; A Blog Around The Clock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Dec 2010 19:35:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50425</guid>
		<description>[...] Are there viruses of arsenic-utilizing bacteria? and The &#8216;Give Me a Job&#8217; Microbe and Of Arsenic and Aliens and NASA’s real news: bacterium on Earth that lives off arsenic! and Close Encounters of the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Are there viruses of arsenic-utilizing bacteria? and The &#8216;Give Me a Job&#8217; Microbe and Of Arsenic and Aliens and NASA’s real news: bacterium on Earth that lives off arsenic! and Close Encounters of the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Arsenic life: My take on the backlash at Slate &#124; The Loom &#124; From Shack To Mansion</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50413</link>
		<dc:creator>Arsenic life: My take on the backlash at Slate &#124; The Loom &#124; From Shack To Mansion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Dec 2010 17:34:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50413</guid>
		<description>[...] asked me to take a look at the scientific reactions emerging to last week’s big news about arsenic-based life. I got in touch with a dozen experts, and let’s just say, the results weren’t pretty. Check it [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] asked me to take a look at the scientific reactions emerging to last week’s big news about arsenic-based life. I got in touch with a dozen experts, and let’s just say, the results weren’t pretty. Check it [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Zephyr L.C.</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50331</link>
		<dc:creator>Zephyr L.C.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Dec 2010 05:51:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50331</guid>
		<description>&quot;The Mono Lake bacteria probably don’t actually exist in an arsenic-based form in nature, since they grow much faster on phosophorus.&quot;
I can&#039;t agree with this statement at all, to rebate it with an analogy, many facultative anaerobic microorganisms can grow faster with enough oxygen or other external electron acceptors but this doesn&#039;t mean they don&#039;t actually exist in anaerobic fermentative form in nature.
Likewise, GFAJ-1 could be adapted to thrive with either phosphorous or arsenic depending on the specific surrounding availability of both. An evolutionary adaptation to incorporate arsenic when phosphorous is scarce could better explain why these bacteria are capable to grow under phosphorous deprivation replacing it with arsenic.
Alternatively, perhaps it is energetically more advantageous to directly incorporate arsenic into biomolecules than spend energy trying to get rid of it under conditions in which the combined effect of arsenic concentration and arsenic-phosphorous ratio is above certain threshold level.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The Mono Lake bacteria probably don’t actually exist in an arsenic-based form in nature, since they grow much faster on phosophorus.&#8221;<br />
I can&#8217;t agree with this statement at all, to rebate it with an analogy, many facultative anaerobic microorganisms can grow faster with enough oxygen or other external electron acceptors but this doesn&#8217;t mean they don&#8217;t actually exist in anaerobic fermentative form in nature.<br />
Likewise, GFAJ-1 could be adapted to thrive with either phosphorous or arsenic depending on the specific surrounding availability of both. An evolutionary adaptation to incorporate arsenic when phosphorous is scarce could better explain why these bacteria are capable to grow under phosphorous deprivation replacing it with arsenic.<br />
Alternatively, perhaps it is energetically more advantageous to directly incorporate arsenic into biomolecules than spend energy trying to get rid of it under conditions in which the combined effect of arsenic concentration and arsenic-phosphorous ratio is above certain threshold level.</p>
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		<title>By: This paper is wrong</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50313</link>
		<dc:creator>This paper is wrong</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Dec 2010 21:23:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50313</guid>
		<description>&quot;Before long, as they report today in Science, the bacteria were growing nicely on an all-arsenate diet, without a speck of phosphate.&quot;

This is wrong.  The bacteria were always grown in phosphate -- the &quot;non-phosphate&quot; media had 3 uM phosphate contamination, as the authors acknowledge in the text.   This phosphate contamination is one reason why many scientists do not believe this paper at all.  

The microbiologist Rosie Redfield has published a devastating critique of this paper:

http://rrresearch.blogspot.com/2010/12/arsenic-associated-bacteria-nasas.html

&lt;strong&gt;[CZ: Thanks--I will rein in the figurative language. And I highly recommend Redfield&#039;s post.]&lt;/strong&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Before long, as they report today in Science, the bacteria were growing nicely on an all-arsenate diet, without a speck of phosphate.&#8221;</p>
<p>This is wrong.  The bacteria were always grown in phosphate &#8212; the &#8220;non-phosphate&#8221; media had 3 uM phosphate contamination, as the authors acknowledge in the text.   This phosphate contamination is one reason why many scientists do not believe this paper at all.  </p>
<p>The microbiologist Rosie Redfield has published a devastating critique of this paper:</p>
<p><a href="http://rrresearch.blogspot.com/2010/12/arsenic-associated-bacteria-nasas.html" rel="nofollow">http://rrresearch.blogspot.com/2010/12/arsenic-associated-bacteria-nasas.html</a></p>
<p><strong>[CZ: Thanks--I will rein in the figurative language. And I highly recommend Redfield's post.]</strong></p>
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		<title>By: Quick Links &#124; A Blog Around The Clock</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50312</link>
		<dc:creator>Quick Links &#124; A Blog Around The Clock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Dec 2010 21:12:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50312</guid>
		<description>[...] Are there viruses of arsenic-utilizing bacteria? and The &#8216;Give Me a Job&#8217; Microbe and Of Arsenic and Aliens and NASA’s real news: bacterium on Earth that lives off arsenic! and Close Encounters of the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Are there viruses of arsenic-utilizing bacteria? and The &#8216;Give Me a Job&#8217; Microbe and Of Arsenic and Aliens and NASA’s real news: bacterium on Earth that lives off arsenic! and Close Encounters of the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Charon</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50306</link>
		<dc:creator>Charon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Dec 2010 19:15:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50306</guid>
		<description>&quot;SiO2 being solid pretty much torpedoes the idea among scientists AFAIU&quot;

How does this rule out silicon-based life? (I say this as a complete non-biologist.) We had life on Earth long before any significant amount of atmospheric oxygen, so I would assume such life didn&#039;t need much CO2 transport.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;SiO2 being solid pretty much torpedoes the idea among scientists AFAIU&#8221;</p>
<p>How does this rule out silicon-based life? (I say this as a complete non-biologist.) We had life on Earth long before any significant amount of atmospheric oxygen, so I would assume such life didn&#8217;t need much CO2 transport.</p>
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		<title>By: Gaythia</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50303</link>
		<dc:creator>Gaythia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Dec 2010 17:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50303</guid>
		<description>Barshe Miller is correct in pointing out that this story is not about Mono Lake.  However, I think others besides myself reading this post would find this resource from the Mono Lake Committee to be of interest:

http://www.monobasinresearch.org/index.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barshe Miller is correct in pointing out that this story is not about Mono Lake.  However, I think others besides myself reading this post would find this resource from the Mono Lake Committee to be of interest:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.monobasinresearch.org/index.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.monobasinresearch.org/index.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Georg</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50299</link>
		<dc:creator>Georg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Dec 2010 12:01:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50299</guid>
		<description>Tz ,tz,...
Wie bei Hempels unterm Sofa....
Georg</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tz ,tz,&#8230;<br />
Wie bei Hempels unterm Sofa&#8230;.<br />
Georg</p>
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		<title>By: Torbjörn Larsson, OM</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50284</link>
		<dc:creator>Torbjörn Larsson, OM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Dec 2010 03:30:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50284</guid>
		<description>Yeah; I have to pitch in with Benner, having read the paper but not the supplement: the element fractions depends on the extraction procedure, and it doesn&#039;t seem to be checked but &quot;standard&quot;. For example, the DNA gel wash is supposed to remove small RNA (mostly) fragments, but what about proteins. (Which can be used for sequestering.)

@ Mehkong Kurt:

&lt;blockquote&gt;
there as been speculation for decades about silicon-based life
&lt;/blockquote&gt; 

Perhaps in scifi; SiO2 being solid pretty much torpedoes the idea among scientists AFAIU.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah; I have to pitch in with Benner, having read the paper but not the supplement: the element fractions depends on the extraction procedure, and it doesn&#8217;t seem to be checked but &#8220;standard&#8221;. For example, the DNA gel wash is supposed to remove small RNA (mostly) fragments, but what about proteins. (Which can be used for sequestering.)</p>
<p>@ Mehkong Kurt:</p>
<blockquote><p>
there as been speculation for decades about silicon-based life
</p></blockquote>
<p>Perhaps in scifi; SiO2 being solid pretty much torpedoes the idea among scientists AFAIU.</p>
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		<title>By: My thoughts on the bacteria of Lake Mono &#124; Meng Bomin</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50283</link>
		<dc:creator>My thoughts on the bacteria of Lake Mono &#124; Meng Bomin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Dec 2010 03:25:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50283</guid>
		<description>[...] the nature of the bacteria found and the implications.  There are a few good posts from Ed Yong, Carl Zimmer, and P.Z. Myers detailing exactly what was found and dispelling some of the hype and myths that [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the nature of the bacteria found and the implications.  There are a few good posts from Ed Yong, Carl Zimmer, and P.Z. Myers detailing exactly what was found and dispelling some of the hype and myths that [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Bartshe Miller</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50273</link>
		<dc:creator>Bartshe Miller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Dec 2010 22:37:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50273</guid>
		<description>Thanks for well-written and entertaining post. Your story about a four-year-old son, loose change, and scrambling to buy ice cream was perfect.

I would like to clarify one point you make about Mono Lake:

&quot;One of these expeditions was to Mono Lake, a practically toxic body of water. It’s very salty, very alkaline, and is steeped in arsenic.&quot;

Arsenic exists in many forms, and not all are equally toxic to all life, nor are the type and/or concentrations in the water column such that inhibit an astonishingly productive ecosystem. Mono’s (pronounced Moe’-no) average annual primary productivity is 686 gC/m2-yr, and it often exceeds 1000 gC/m2-yr. The lake supports not only algae but trillions of brine shrimp and a massive population of alkali flies, in turn supporting millions of migratory and resident birds. 

The lake&#039;s microbial life has only recently received attention since about the time NASA first used the lake as a test bed for robotic Mars missions in 1995. The bacterium and viruses in the lake, in its seeps and springs, in its anoxic depths, and around brackish lagoons, present a great frontier of weird and unknown. It&#039;s a micro-wilderness. 

As Dr. Wolfe-Simon pointed out, the story is not about Mono Lake, but I did want to clarify that Mono is far from being a toxic body of water.

[CZ: Thanks! I&#039;ll revise that part of the post.]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for well-written and entertaining post. Your story about a four-year-old son, loose change, and scrambling to buy ice cream was perfect.</p>
<p>I would like to clarify one point you make about Mono Lake:</p>
<p>&#8220;One of these expeditions was to Mono Lake, a practically toxic body of water. It’s very salty, very alkaline, and is steeped in arsenic.&#8221;</p>
<p>Arsenic exists in many forms, and not all are equally toxic to all life, nor are the type and/or concentrations in the water column such that inhibit an astonishingly productive ecosystem. Mono’s (pronounced Moe’-no) average annual primary productivity is 686 gC/m2-yr, and it often exceeds 1000 gC/m2-yr. The lake supports not only algae but trillions of brine shrimp and a massive population of alkali flies, in turn supporting millions of migratory and resident birds. </p>
<p>The lake&#8217;s microbial life has only recently received attention since about the time NASA first used the lake as a test bed for robotic Mars missions in 1995. The bacterium and viruses in the lake, in its seeps and springs, in its anoxic depths, and around brackish lagoons, present a great frontier of weird and unknown. It&#8217;s a micro-wilderness. </p>
<p>As Dr. Wolfe-Simon pointed out, the story is not about Mono Lake, but I did want to clarify that Mono is far from being a toxic body of water.</p>
<p>[CZ: Thanks! I'll revise that part of the post.]</p>
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		<title>By: Gaythia</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50259</link>
		<dc:creator>Gaythia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Dec 2010 18:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50259</guid>
		<description>From a non living system perspective, I think that in high As, brine-y solutions that the relevant chemical equibria would be driven to extremes such that normal ideas as to what was or wasn&#039;t stable &quot;in water&quot; would not apply.  So substituting arsenic for phosphorus in chemical molecules under these conditions doesn&#039;t strike me as necessarily all that impressive.  

It seems to me that the amazing thing is that the bacteria stay alive under these conditions. 
 
That was my thought behind my question: &quot;at that point where the normal bacteria were (would be) near death, what was different with the way the Mono Lake bacteria were (would be) incorporating the As?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From a non living system perspective, I think that in high As, brine-y solutions that the relevant chemical equibria would be driven to extremes such that normal ideas as to what was or wasn&#8217;t stable &#8220;in water&#8221; would not apply.  So substituting arsenic for phosphorus in chemical molecules under these conditions doesn&#8217;t strike me as necessarily all that impressive.  </p>
<p>It seems to me that the amazing thing is that the bacteria stay alive under these conditions. </p>
<p>That was my thought behind my question: &#8220;at that point where the normal bacteria were (would be) near death, what was different with the way the Mono Lake bacteria were (would be) incorporating the As?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: The alien embargo and other follies&#160;&#124;&#160;Marketingdunia</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50237</link>
		<dc:creator>The alien embargo and other follies&#160;&#124;&#160;Marketingdunia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Dec 2010 09:15:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50237</guid>
		<description>[...] Ed Yong and Mr. Carl Zimmer have reviewed all the salient points, so I have nothing to add there. I have to say that I agree [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Ed Yong and Mr. Carl Zimmer have reviewed all the salient points, so I have nothing to add there. I have to say that I agree [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Gaythia</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50231</link>
		<dc:creator>Gaythia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Dec 2010 06:26:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50231</guid>
		<description>My naive non-Biologist questions are:

If I were raising something in captivity in my laboratory, I think I would attempt to feed it what I thought it wanted to eat.  Why did the researchers start out with pure phosphate rather than arsenate or an exact match to the Mono Lake brine if these bacteria are supposed to be arsenic based life?

If I wanted to compare how the Mono Lake bacteria handled arsenate differently than normal strains, I think I might start both strains on phosphate and increase the arsenate.  Can the non Mono Lake bacteria adapt?  Or, at that point where the normal bacteria were near death,  what was different with the way the Mono Lake bacteria were incorporating the As?   Do normal bacteria end up with As distributed throughout?  Wouldn&#039;t this help answer the sequestration vs assimilation question raised above?

&lt;strong&gt;[CZ: Here is my non-biologist answer: These bacteria are not, despite some news reports this week, arsenic-based life. On Mono Lake, they are ordinary, phosphate-based life. But, perhaps due to their high tolerance for arsenic, they can swap arsenic for phosphate in an experiment--at least according to the scientists. As for your second question, arsenic is toxic to most organisms, including bacteria, and they have mechanisms to get rid of it from their system. Some have better mechanisms than others. And some bacteria at Mono Lake can even feed on arsenic: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20511421. The bacteria in this paper were not dying off from arsenic poisoning--they were growing on pure arsenic and no phosphate (assuming there was no contamination).]&lt;/strong&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My naive non-Biologist questions are:</p>
<p>If I were raising something in captivity in my laboratory, I think I would attempt to feed it what I thought it wanted to eat.  Why did the researchers start out with pure phosphate rather than arsenate or an exact match to the Mono Lake brine if these bacteria are supposed to be arsenic based life?</p>
<p>If I wanted to compare how the Mono Lake bacteria handled arsenate differently than normal strains, I think I might start both strains on phosphate and increase the arsenate.  Can the non Mono Lake bacteria adapt?  Or, at that point where the normal bacteria were near death,  what was different with the way the Mono Lake bacteria were incorporating the As?   Do normal bacteria end up with As distributed throughout?  Wouldn&#8217;t this help answer the sequestration vs assimilation question raised above?</p>
<p><strong>[CZ: Here is my non-biologist answer: These bacteria are not, despite some news reports this week, arsenic-based life. On Mono Lake, they are ordinary, phosphate-based life. But, perhaps due to their high tolerance for arsenic, they can swap arsenic for phosphate in an experiment--at least according to the scientists. As for your second question, arsenic is toxic to most organisms, including bacteria, and they have mechanisms to get rid of it from their system. Some have better mechanisms than others. And some bacteria at Mono Lake can even feed on arsenic: <a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20511421" rel="nofollow">http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20511421</a>. The bacteria in this paper were not dying off from arsenic poisoning--they were growing on pure arsenic and no phosphate (assuming there was no contamination).]</strong></p>
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		<title>By: Gaythia</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50227</link>
		<dc:creator>Gaythia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Dec 2010 05:20:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50227</guid>
		<description>Salt lakes are a fairly common Western United States phenomena.  Many of these features cycle between being lakes, mushy  brines, or  hard salt flats depending on climate swings. But Mono Lake in particular has been very affected by water diversions by the City of Los Angeles starting abruptly in 1941.  See: http://www.monolake.org/about/story.   

Have non-Mono Lake bacteria been tested?  How would a &quot;normal&quot; bacterial strain cope with increasing As?

At any rate, it seems to me that the fact the chemistry of the lake has not been consistent over time would be relevant.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Salt lakes are a fairly common Western United States phenomena.  Many of these features cycle between being lakes, mushy  brines, or  hard salt flats depending on climate swings. But Mono Lake in particular has been very affected by water diversions by the City of Los Angeles starting abruptly in 1941.  See: <a href="http://www.monolake.org/about/story" rel="nofollow">http://www.monolake.org/about/story</a>.   </p>
<p>Have non-Mono Lake bacteria been tested?  How would a &#8220;normal&#8221; bacterial strain cope with increasing As?</p>
<p>At any rate, it seems to me that the fact the chemistry of the lake has not been consistent over time would be relevant.</p>
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		<title>By: Sven DiMilo</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50212</link>
		<dc:creator>Sven DiMilo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Dec 2010 22:08:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50212</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Sveny does not understand DNA, how cute.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

? Directed at me? What&#039;s it supposed to mean?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Sveny does not understand DNA, how cute.</p></blockquote>
<p>? Directed at me? What&#8217;s it supposed to mean?</p>
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		<title>By: It Was a Bright Cold Day in December, and the Clocks Were Striking Thirteen. #JMStV &#124; between drafts</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/12/02/of-arsenic-and-aliens/comment-page-1/#comment-50209</link>
		<dc:creator>It Was a Bright Cold Day in December, and the Clocks Were Striking Thirteen. #JMStV &#124; between drafts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Dec 2010 20:40:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/?p=3679#comment-50209</guid>
		<description>[...] of all crappy public transport systems on the planet, it occurred to me that I was reading a terrific write-up by one the world’s leading science writers on the enfolding events surrounding a life form [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] of all crappy public transport systems on the planet, it occurred to me that I was reading a terrific write-up by one the world’s leading science writers on the enfolding events surrounding a life form [...]</p>
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