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	<title>Comments on: Why are there so few female chess grandmasters?</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/</link>
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		<title>By: Vodalus</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1853</link>
		<dc:creator>Vodalus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Jan 2011 21:20:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1853</guid>
		<description>sigh... I&#039;d like to see the statistical study confirming my hypothesis that most Internet comments are written by people who completely fail to comprehend the article that they are commenting on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sigh&#8230; I&#8217;d like to see the statistical study confirming my hypothesis that most Internet comments are written by people who completely fail to comprehend the article that they are commenting on.</p>
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		<title>By: Quora</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1852</link>
		<dc:creator>Quora</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jan 2011 18:15:12 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Do men have a wider variance of intelligence than women?...&lt;/strong&gt;

In many cases, this trend could be the result of a simple sampling error. A recent study on chess grandmasters illustrated this point quite nicely. Only 1% of chess grandmasters, and you could argue that this is because there are more men who are extre...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Do men have a wider variance of intelligence than women?&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>In many cases, this trend could be the result of a simple sampling error. A recent study on chess grandmasters illustrated this point quite nicely. Only 1% of chess grandmasters, and you could argue that this is because there are more men who are extre&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Yvonne</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1851</link>
		<dc:creator>Yvonne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Dec 2010 19:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I am a  Caribbean-American female chess player discovering chess as an adult, accidentally found this blog while searching the internet of a specific chess book and thought I would add my two cents to the discussion:

Women have been dying because people are too afraid to see that men and women are REALLY different. Medications meant to be used by women were often tested on men; this is beginning to change but not quickly enough. The very real differences between men and women such as the fact that heart attack symptoms in a female are different than those in a male are very difficult for most people to investigate and discuss without feeling that to do so is being bigoted ... it is almost as difficult as the equally real differences between races such that certain illness manifest differently and certain treatment have different results. Until we really let go of all our prejudices, it is not a neutral discussion. I remember looking for a patient I had not yet met and asking a co-worker what he looked like and he described  him simply as being &quot;a pleasing color&quot; rather than tall, lanky with very dark skin, large dark eyes and black straight hair ... he could not get past &quot;very dark skin&quot; and so, in effect, said the equivalent of nothing.

I believe that there are possibly real constitutional differences that may favor men in the playing of chess: It is quite possible that men do better at chess because the male brain may be better at spatial relationships since it was the male who had to come home from the hunt without a map ... remember, no street signs! Perhaps, this is the real reason men are still embarrassed to ask for directions. It may just be about survival and evolution which, as you know, is a very slow process. In chess, you do better to the extent that you can hold  AND MANIPULATE visual patterns in your head. This is not an issue of intelligence.  Women still are better with verbal skills.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a  Caribbean-American female chess player discovering chess as an adult, accidentally found this blog while searching the internet of a specific chess book and thought I would add my two cents to the discussion:</p>
<p>Women have been dying because people are too afraid to see that men and women are REALLY different. Medications meant to be used by women were often tested on men; this is beginning to change but not quickly enough. The very real differences between men and women such as the fact that heart attack symptoms in a female are different than those in a male are very difficult for most people to investigate and discuss without feeling that to do so is being bigoted &#8230; it is almost as difficult as the equally real differences between races such that certain illness manifest differently and certain treatment have different results. Until we really let go of all our prejudices, it is not a neutral discussion. I remember looking for a patient I had not yet met and asking a co-worker what he looked like and he described  him simply as being &#8220;a pleasing color&#8221; rather than tall, lanky with very dark skin, large dark eyes and black straight hair &#8230; he could not get past &#8220;very dark skin&#8221; and so, in effect, said the equivalent of nothing.</p>
<p>I believe that there are possibly real constitutional differences that may favor men in the playing of chess: It is quite possible that men do better at chess because the male brain may be better at spatial relationships since it was the male who had to come home from the hunt without a map &#8230; remember, no street signs! Perhaps, this is the real reason men are still embarrassed to ask for directions. It may just be about survival and evolution which, as you know, is a very slow process. In chess, you do better to the extent that you can hold  AND MANIPULATE visual patterns in your head. This is not an issue of intelligence.  Women still are better with verbal skills.</p>
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		<title>By: Sugar and Spice &#124; The Intersection &#124; Discover Magazine</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1850</link>
		<dc:creator>Sugar and Spice &#124; The Intersection &#124; Discover Magazine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Jun 2010 03:43:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1850</guid>
		<description>[...] but I&#8217;m tired of it. Furthermore there are so many aspects of gender disparity Tierney fails to mention that have a role in academic performance. So I wasn&#8217;t impressed and decided not to re-write [...] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] but I&#8217;m tired of it. Furthermore there are so many aspects of gender disparity Tierney fails to mention that have a role in academic performance. So I wasn&#8217;t impressed and decided not to re-write [...] </p>
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		<title>By: amphiox</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1849</link>
		<dc:creator>amphiox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Mar 2010 19:02:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1849</guid>
		<description>Chess is a complex activity that requires a variety of intellectual aptitudes for success. There is also more than one way to be good at chess.
Even if there were some biological disparity in aptitudes in different areas between genders, such that men might on average be better at A and B and women at C and D, you cannot say that a woman cannot become as effective competively using a strategy emphasizing C and D as a man using a different strategy emphasizing A and B.
I would be as bold as to conjecture that this would hold true for pretty much any area that requires complex higher level cognitive functioning.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chess is a complex activity that requires a variety of intellectual aptitudes for success. There is also more than one way to be good at chess.<br />
Even if there were some biological disparity in aptitudes in different areas between genders, such that men might on average be better at A and B and women at C and D, you cannot say that a woman cannot become as effective competively using a strategy emphasizing C and D as a man using a different strategy emphasizing A and B.<br />
I would be as bold as to conjecture that this would hold true for pretty much any area that requires complex higher level cognitive functioning.</p>
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		<title>By: amphiox</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1848</link>
		<dc:creator>amphiox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Mar 2010 18:51:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1848</guid>
		<description>Luna #70;
Speaking from anecdotal personal experience as a member of a chess playing family (who introduced and taught the game to his younger siblings) with 2 chess playing sisters, your observations are 100% correct.
Even more significant than outright hostility are more subtle factors - the main one that I observed being that most young male chess players simply cannot stand losing to a girl. I have seen many boys actually quit playing rather than risk losing to one of my sisters (who were usually among the better players).
Because chess at the earliest starting levels is as much about socializing (making friends, etc) as it is about competition, many young girls just starting in chess quickly learn that the easiest way to get accepting into the peer group is to play just well enough to earn the respect of her male colleagues, but never well enough to actually beat them (at least not in any competitive situation where the results of that game actually mean something).
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Luna #70;<br />
Speaking from anecdotal personal experience as a member of a chess playing family (who introduced and taught the game to his younger siblings) with 2 chess playing sisters, your observations are 100% correct.<br />
Even more significant than outright hostility are more subtle factors &#8211; the main one that I observed being that most young male chess players simply cannot stand losing to a girl. I have seen many boys actually quit playing rather than risk losing to one of my sisters (who were usually among the better players).<br />
Because chess at the earliest starting levels is as much about socializing (making friends, etc) as it is about competition, many young girls just starting in chess quickly learn that the easiest way to get accepting into the peer group is to play just well enough to earn the respect of her male colleagues, but never well enough to actually beat them (at least not in any competitive situation where the results of that game actually mean something).</p>
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		<title>By: Bias much?</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1847</link>
		<dc:creator>Bias much?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Sep 2009 02:59:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1847</guid>
		<description>&quot;From positions 3 to 73, the men have a small but consistent advantage, wielding a competitive superiority that slightly exceed what statistics would predict.&quot;
Isn&#039;t that proof against the point your trying to make in this article? Shouldn&#039;t the percentage (corrected for the numbers involved) say that they are equal?
So...What exactly are you trying to prove? Because if the very test Bilalic made to prove equality proves the men exceed what the statistics suggest that should be obvious something IS going on...
It doesn&#039;t really matter to me who is better. I would love to see the equality. But the test you cited proves your position wrong.
Let&#039;s leave political correctness out of science, and just go by the numbers ok?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;From positions 3 to 73, the men have a small but consistent advantage, wielding a competitive superiority that slightly exceed what statistics would predict.&#8221;<br />
Isn&#8217;t that proof against the point your trying to make in this article? Shouldn&#8217;t the percentage (corrected for the numbers involved) say that they are equal?<br />
So&#8230;What exactly are you trying to prove? Because if the very test Bilalic made to prove equality proves the men exceed what the statistics suggest that should be obvious something IS going on&#8230;<br />
It doesn&#8217;t really matter to me who is better. I would love to see the equality. But the test you cited proves your position wrong.<br />
Let&#8217;s leave political correctness out of science, and just go by the numbers ok?</p>
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		<title>By: Forshorn</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1846</link>
		<dc:creator>Forshorn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Aug 2009 20:11:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1846</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s fairly obvious that the statistic argument is fallacious. Clearly, a member of a group who has no aptitude in a specific discipline is far less likely to enter that discipline. The argument is therefore tautological.
Do women have less aptitude for chess?
You know, I saw an article in the New York Times the other day about how women are better managers than men. The expert was a member of the Elle Group - it was her opinion, basically. What is the Elle Group? A networking organization for women in business. If you haven&#039;t seen this article, you&#039;ve seen one like it. Remember Natalie Angier&#039;s book An Intimate Geography of Woman? It was largely about the physical superiority of women? Sexist? Of course not. Do a google books search on &quot;fascism.&quot; There are numerous books by academics connecting masculinity to fascism; i.e., arguing that masculinity causes fascism.
So, as a college-educated person and a TV-watcher, I know that women are morally and even physically superior to men. There&#039;s no problem with this. I wouldn&#039;t argue with people who went to upper west side prep schools.
The trouble with chess is that there&#039;s no affirmative action in chess and it&#039;s not really qualitative. That is, there&#039;s no way to &quot;interpret&quot; the results to fit what we all know about women&#039;s superiority. And that&#039;s why we&#039;re having this discussion.
The answer? Ban chess. It is unfair, because you have to be good at something to do well at it.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s fairly obvious that the statistic argument is fallacious. Clearly, a member of a group who has no aptitude in a specific discipline is far less likely to enter that discipline. The argument is therefore tautological.<br />
Do women have less aptitude for chess?<br />
You know, I saw an article in the New York Times the other day about how women are better managers than men. The expert was a member of the Elle Group &#8211; it was her opinion, basically. What is the Elle Group? A networking organization for women in business. If you haven&#8217;t seen this article, you&#8217;ve seen one like it. Remember Natalie Angier&#8217;s book An Intimate Geography of Woman? It was largely about the physical superiority of women? Sexist? Of course not. Do a google books search on &#8220;fascism.&#8221; There are numerous books by academics connecting masculinity to fascism; i.e., arguing that masculinity causes fascism.<br />
So, as a college-educated person and a TV-watcher, I know that women are morally and even physically superior to men. There&#8217;s no problem with this. I wouldn&#8217;t argue with people who went to upper west side prep schools.<br />
The trouble with chess is that there&#8217;s no affirmative action in chess and it&#8217;s not really qualitative. That is, there&#8217;s no way to &#8220;interpret&#8221; the results to fit what we all know about women&#8217;s superiority. And that&#8217;s why we&#8217;re having this discussion.<br />
The answer? Ban chess. It is unfair, because you have to be good at something to do well at it.</p>
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		<title>By: Azkyroth</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1845</link>
		<dc:creator>Azkyroth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 01:30:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1845</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Phil -- at the point that &quot;men and women are different&quot; stops being used as justification for general exclusion of women from, or prejudice against women in, careers and hobbies that many women actually show an interest in, then it will stop being a loaded and poisonous question. Do you understand that?&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Or, hell, when certain people start to act like &quot;men and women are different,&quot; &quot;these differences account for all observed statistical differences in status or compensation in any given field between men and women,&quot; &quot;absolutely nothing should be done to change the status quo,&quot; and &quot;bluntly, wimmenz just ain&#039;t suited for anythin&#039; but bein&#039; barefoot, pregnant, an&#039; in da kitzen makin&#039; mah SANWICH!&quot; are discrete propositions which must be supported independently, rather than treating the second, third, and often the fourth, as necessarily implied by the first (and conspicuously being interested in the first for this reason only).
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Phil &#8212; at the point that &#8220;men and women are different&#8221; stops being used as justification for general exclusion of women from, or prejudice against women in, careers and hobbies that many women actually show an interest in, then it will stop being a loaded and poisonous question. Do you understand that?</p></blockquote>
<p>Or, hell, when certain people start to act like &#8220;men and women are different,&#8221; &#8220;these differences account for all observed statistical differences in status or compensation in any given field between men and women,&#8221; &#8220;absolutely nothing should be done to change the status quo,&#8221; and &#8220;bluntly, wimmenz just ain&#8217;t suited for anythin&#8217; but bein&#8217; barefoot, pregnant, an&#8217; in da kitzen makin&#8217; mah SANWICH!&#8221; are discrete propositions which must be supported independently, rather than treating the second, third, and often the fourth, as necessarily implied by the first (and conspicuously being interested in the first for this reason only).</p>
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		<title>By: Luna_the_cat</title>
		<link>http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1844</link>
		<dc:creator>Luna_the_cat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 14:01:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2008/12/23/why-are-there-so-few-female-chess-grandmasters/#comment-1844</guid>
		<description>Phil -- at the point that &quot;men and women are different&quot; stops being used as justification for general exclusion of women from, or prejudice against women in, careers and hobbies that many women actually show an interest in, then it will stop being a loaded and poisonous question.  Do you understand that?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil &#8212; at the point that &#8220;men and women are different&#8221; stops being used as justification for general exclusion of women from, or prejudice against women in, careers and hobbies that many women actually show an interest in, then it will stop being a loaded and poisonous question.  Do you understand that?</p>
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