Comments on: The renaissance of technicolour dinosaurs continues (and the gloves come off…) http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/ Mon, 26 Nov 2012 12:00:51 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.2 By: Glendon Mellow http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6397 Glendon Mellow Wed, 10 Feb 2010 13:02:32 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6397 Great post Ed! My wife may be looking at this one with her grade 1 & 2 class today! Great post Ed! My wife may be looking at this one with her grade 1 & 2 class today!

]]> By: CS Shelton http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6396 CS Shelton Tue, 09 Feb 2010 22:52:49 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6396 @Michael OE: Thanks! A lot of relevant info in one place. I'm not convinced by jura's argument that setae are a good argument against fuzz = warm blood. In fact, I find the evidence crocodilians are secondarily cold blooded pretty compelling, which would mean all dinosaurs probably started warm blooded. On the other hand, modern crocodilians are a good case that many dino groups could have reverted to cold blood, but it seems silly to even entertain that possibility for theropods. And since we know tyrannosaurs started fuzzy and re-acquired scales over the body, that seems to answer my question about whether it's possible for birds to re-acquire scales. My question then becomes Why haven't they? Why do these large ratites not have scales much above the foot area? Wouldn't a scaly ostrich have any survival advantage? I'd think so. It makes me want to go farther than Ostrom's Chickensaurus and make a scaly chicken. Hell yeah! @Michael OE:
Thanks! A lot of relevant info in one place. I’m not convinced by jura’s argument that setae are a good argument against fuzz = warm blood. In fact, I find the evidence crocodilians are secondarily cold blooded pretty compelling, which would mean all dinosaurs probably started warm blooded. On the other hand, modern crocodilians are a good case that many dino groups could have reverted to cold blood, but it seems silly to even entertain that possibility for theropods.
And since we know tyrannosaurs started fuzzy and re-acquired scales over the body, that seems to answer my question about whether it’s possible for birds to re-acquire scales. My question then becomes Why haven’t they? Why do these large ratites not have scales much above the foot area? Wouldn’t a scaly ostrich have any survival advantage? I’d think so.
It makes me want to go farther than Ostrom’s Chickensaurus and make a scaly chicken.
Hell yeah!

]]> By: Michael O. Erickson http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6395 Michael O. Erickson Tue, 09 Feb 2010 19:35:54 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6395 @ C S Shelton: <i>Is there any evidence - other than conjecture - that large species like T. rex had lost their dino-fuzz? I understand large, heavy-set species of mammal convergently lose hair, so one could guess the same of T. rex, but what evidence is there?</i> Skin impressions. Scaly skin impressions. Known from <i>Tyrannosaurus</i> and <i>Albertosaurus</i>, and also for non-tyrannosaurids such as <i>Allosaurus</i> and <i>Carnotaurus</i>. In regards to your other feather questions, check out Jura's awesome post, here: <a href="http://reptilis.net/2009/04/13/a-critical-evalution-of-tianyulong-confiusci-part-3-plucking-at-the-idea-of-feathered-dinosaurs/" rel="nofollow">http://reptilis.net/2009/04/13/a-critical-evalution-of-tianyulong-confiusci-part-3-plucking-at-the-idea-of-feathered-dinosaurs/</a> @ C S Shelton:
Is there any evidence – other than conjecture – that large species like T. rex had lost their dino-fuzz? I understand large, heavy-set species of mammal convergently lose hair, so one could guess the same of T. rex, but what evidence is there?
Skin impressions. Scaly skin impressions. Known from Tyrannosaurus and Albertosaurus, and also for non-tyrannosaurids such as Allosaurus and Carnotaurus.
In regards to your other feather questions, check out Jura’s awesome post, here:
http://reptilis.net/2009/04/13/a-critical-evalution-of-tianyulong-confiusci-part-3-plucking-at-the-idea-of-feathered-dinosaurs/

]]> By: David Marjanović http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6394 David Marjanović Tue, 09 Feb 2010 15:43:49 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6394 <blockquote>But I still wonder, what did these animals smell like? :-)</blockquote> What do birds smell like?

But I still wonder, what did these animals smell like? :-)

What do birds smell like?

]]> By: Ed Yong http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6393 Ed Yong Tue, 09 Feb 2010 12:10:25 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6393 Zephyr, <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJHTRBjje4w&feature=player_embedded" rel="nofollow">here's</a> a nice video explaining structural colours in butterflies. Zephyr, here’s a nice video explaining structural colours in butterflies.

]]> By: Cthulhus minion http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6392 Cthulhus minion Tue, 09 Feb 2010 09:09:47 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6392 @24 <a href="http://www.skrewtips.com/img/man-with-blue-skin-from-mercola-website.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://www.skrewtips.com/img/man-with-blue-skin-from-mercola-website.jpg</a> approves their color choice. @24
http://www.skrewtips.com/img/man-with-blue-skin-from-mercola-website.jpg approves their color choice.

]]> By: Ed Yong http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6391 Ed Yong Tue, 09 Feb 2010 08:47:01 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6391 Don't forget though that colour has many functions besides camouflage - communication, species recognition, sexual selection, signalling fitness... There's no reason to think that the giants weren't brightly coloured too in some ways. Oh and you're talking about structural colours. Google that, or iridescence. You can see it in starlings and some butterflies. Whenever an animal looks one colour from one angle and another colour from another angle, chances are you're dealing with structural colours. And yep, Vinther found these in fossil feathers too. If you look at the previous coloured dinos post, you'll find links in the final paras and some discussion in the comments Don’t forget though that colour has many functions besides camouflage – communication, species recognition, sexual selection, signalling fitness… There’s no reason to think that the giants weren’t brightly coloured too in some ways.
Oh and you’re talking about structural colours. Google that, or iridescence. You can see it in starlings and some butterflies. Whenever an animal looks one colour from one angle and another colour from another angle, chances are you’re dealing with structural colours. And yep, Vinther found these in fossil feathers too. If you look at the previous coloured dinos post, you’ll find links in the final paras and some discussion in the comments

]]> By: zephyr haversack http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6390 zephyr haversack Tue, 09 Feb 2010 03:54:38 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6390 It seems rather silly to have portrayed two-ton monsters that you could hear coming from a mile away in "camouflage" colors of mixed grays, greens and browns. Yes, that would really make them near invisible! Regarding birds' wing colors -- I wish I could remember where, but I read in a neurology text (a section on perception) that some bird feathers do not actually have the pigment that we perceive as a particular color, but that their feathers are formed in a way that reflects a particular band of light, so we see the particular color associated with the wavelength being reflected. I wonder if dinosaurs had this sort of structure in their feathers (or skin?). That would certainly complicate matters. It seems rather silly to have portrayed two-ton monsters that you could hear coming from a mile away in “camouflage” colors of mixed grays, greens and browns. Yes, that would really make them near invisible!
Regarding birds’ wing colors — I wish I could remember where, but I read in a neurology text (a section on perception) that some bird feathers do not actually have the pigment that we perceive as a particular color, but that their feathers are formed in a way that reflects a particular band of light, so we see the particular color associated with the wavelength being reflected. I wonder if dinosaurs had this sort of structure in their feathers (or skin?). That would certainly complicate matters.

]]> By: southlakesmom http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6389 southlakesmom Sun, 07 Feb 2010 22:17:40 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6389 @7 I'm not resistant to them having feathers -- just the idea that we want to make them 'cute' or recognizable in order to appreciate them. They were pretty cool when they were . . . um . . . NOT cute. It's actually kind of cool that with colored feathers the dinos will look more like the way the preschoolers color them...of course, in Sunday School last week they gave Noah blue skin, so . . . (it's a joke people) @7 I’m not resistant to them having feathers — just the idea that we want to make them ‘cute’ or recognizable in order to appreciate them. They were pretty cool when they were . . . um . . . NOT cute.
It’s actually kind of cool that with colored feathers the dinos will look more like the way the preschoolers color them…of course, in Sunday School last week they gave Noah blue skin, so . . . (it’s a joke people)

]]> By: CS Shelton http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6388 CS Shelton Sat, 06 Feb 2010 20:10:34 +0000 http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/02/04/the-renaissance-of-technicolour-dinosaurs-continues-and-the-gloves-come-off/#comment-6388 @27, If it looks like a chicken, don't be too surprised if it tastes like one... @27, If it looks like a chicken, don’t be too surprised if it tastes like one…

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