Comments on: Turtle embryos bask against the warmest side of their own eggs

By: Emily Willingham

Emily Willingham — Tue, 07 Jun 2011 23:14:51 +0000

Matt…sorry, that was misleading. I shouldn’t have said “turtles.” After “depends on the species,” I should have said “reptilians,” not “turtles.” I have turtles on the brain. Agama agama follows that high-males/low-females. There are probably others. But you’re right about the turtles. Also, I’ve been out of the TSD biz for about 8 years (although I follow the literature), and things may have changed with more info.

Regarding temp shifts and climate change…there is also the phenomenon of hatchling overwintering, which some species, like T. scripta show in northern latitudes.

By: MattK

MattK — Tue, 31 May 2011 20:32:41 +0000

IMHO it is somewhat doubtful that climate change will have serious effects via TSD (allthough it will have effects through other mechanisms) since many turtle species have rather wide latitudinal ranges with temperature differences along that gradient that will dwarf any that will occur because of AGW. Painted turtles (Chrysemys picta), for example range from northernmost Mexico to the southern edge of the boreal forest in Canada. The temperature differences between nests even at the same site are also very large relative to climactic effects. That is not to say that climate is not important to the developing embryos; it is. Cold climate seems to limit the distribution of northern turtles by limiting the time that embryos have to develop (rather than by constraints on adult hibernation, for example). Also, the pivotal temp at which embryos shift from one sex to another can shift in response to selection (it varies latitudinaly).

Emily, I would be interested to hear which species of turtles have a cold female/hot male TSD system. The ones that I can think of all have either type Ia (hot female/cold male) or type II (cold female/intermediate male/hot female). It sounds like you know more about this than I do so let me know.

By: Randi

Randi — Wed, 25 May 2011 17:30:20 +0000

Seriously cute!!

By: Sven DiMilo

Sven DiMilo — Tue, 24 May 2011 16:29:22 +0000

Pretty cool!
I’m very skeptical, however of any connection to TSD. First, afaik the entire family of softshells has genetic SD, or at least all those tested so far do. Second, even in a species with TSD, a thermal gradient of one degree C (the maximum obtained experimentally here) will only affect sex for those few eggs whose temperature would otherwise have been less than 1 degree lower than the pivotal incubation temperature.
The behavior is far more likely aimed at speeding up the rate of growth and development and thereby getting an earlier start as a larger hatchling.

By: Aaron

Aaron — Tue, 24 May 2011 00:48:34 +0000

Their friggin’ embryos are even cute!

By: Emily Willingham

Emily Willingham — Mon, 23 May 2011 23:24:50 +0000

Sam…one speculative response to your question is that the temperature trigger draws that “taxis” of the embryo, something that perhaps is selected for so that embryos that would be better fit at a given sex with an earlier emergence do, in fact, emerge earlier and with the “right” sex because of the warmer incubation temp they receive. The embryo doesn’t actively make the choice, of course, but perhaps there is selection for earlier emergence at, say, a peak temp of the season for a specific sex for whatever reason: more food, smaller organism (because of shorter incubation) can evade predators better, blah blah blah. Depends on the species, too. Some turtles do high/boys–low/girls, others reverse that, and some animals show low-high temps=one sex, mid-range=the other sex…so the “fitness” factors and interactions with sex are likely very species specific.

As a general example, a turtle that develops as male at low temps but as female at high temps might be male early in the season when being male is beneficial for whatever reasons, but female if incubated later in the season when female might be beneficial for various reasons. The mothers play a role in terms of their choice of nesting site, i.e., in shade, in sun, etc., too. It’s all delightfully fascinating and complex.

By: SamW

SamW — Mon, 23 May 2011 21:55:35 +0000

That’s the coolest thing I’ve seen in a long time, also love the pictures! Just wow.
Regarding the possible controlling of sex – how would the embryo choose which sex to become? Or rather why? It seems damn hard to prove that choice of sex is a factor influencing movement in the egg…

By: Emily Willingham

Emily Willingham — Mon, 23 May 2011 21:37:52 +0000

AG…some people have certainly speculated that this pattern is vulnerable. Some have even gone so far as to speculate that the age of the dinosaurs ended because of an interaction of TSD and climate change (e.g., http://rsbl.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/7/2/295.abstract). Crocodilians do all exhibit TSD, as do many turtles, some lizards, and the tuatara. It’s been hypothesized that TSD is a lingering life history strategy from the deep evolutionary history of reptilians. Given the age of the tuatara, that may certainly be the case. But…birds (as dinosaurian descendents) are genetically determined, so the TSD family tree is a confusing one, at best. As I noted above, some species even exhibit both. I’ve also published a paper on the interaction of temperature and environmental contaminants that mimic steroid hormones (the endpoint of temperature’s influence in TSD species), and they do interact. There’s certainly evidence that temperature changes and other factors, such as these contaminants, might influence sex ratios.

By: Emily Willingham

Emily Willingham — Mon, 23 May 2011 21:28:02 +0000

Word on the street is that Chinese softshells are genetically determined (jury’s still out, but see http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19729916), but that doesn’t preclude a temperature effect on determination, as has been seen in some other reptilians (e.g., Bassiana duperreyi). Even with genetic determination, temperature can still influence a vast array of fitness-related parameters, as you noted. I’ve always considered temperature a too-overlooked environmental input (The Journal of Thermal Biology notwithstanding), but that’s probably just my bias. Even spiders have shown influences of temperature, and there’s probably so much more to find out about what temperature does across the animal kingdom during development. I’m thrilled to see this post. Thanks.

By: AG

AG — Mon, 23 May 2011 21:23:46 +0000

“For many reptiles, the temperature of the egg determines the sex of the babies. ”

I remember crocodiles have the same Temperature-dependent sex determination (TSD). I always wonder wether such reproductive pattern is vulnerable to global climate change. If temps go one direction permantly, they all end up with one gender and extinction. Did dinosaurs have similar TSD?